From pishaku at yahoo.com  Mon Nov  6 11:12:59 2006
From: pishaku at yahoo.com (Pishak Zhgaba)
Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2006 08:12:59 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [AlbClub] Trishtimi i Kadarese
Message-ID: <20061106161259.69753.qmail@web42209.mail.scd.yahoo.com>

Le t? jemi t? sinqert?. Intervista e Kadares? ishte banale, fund e krye banale. P?r nivelin e shkrimtarit Kadare ishte madje e turpshme. Fajin nuk mund t?ia v?m? intervistuesit, por vet? Kadares?, i cili mund t?i kishte t?rhequr v?mendjen gazetarit duke i th?n?: ?I nderuar gazetar, p?r hir t? inteligjenc?s s? shikuesve le t? flasim p?r gj?ra m? t? r?nd?sishme: p.sh. p?r artin, let?rsin?, shoq?rin?, shqiptarin?, etj. Un? k?tu jam n? studio televizive, jo n? klubin e kombinatit t? tekstileve Stalin dhe as n? bar/restorantin modern Berluskoni?.
  Mir?po Kadareja parap?lqeu t? thot? fjali t? tilla si: ?More qen bir qeni, pse paska r?nd?si q? kritikohem un?, ?far? jam un?, Hitler jam un??.
  Personalisht e ndjej veten n? siklet. Por jo p?r Kadaren?. P?r mua ka vite q? Kadareja shkrimtar i magjish?m ec?n n? binar? t? ndrysh?m nga Kadareja individ apo person publiko/politik. E ndjej veten n? siklet p?r ata q? e mbrojn? Kadaren? nga kritika, duke e ngritur at? mbi vet? kritik?n si parim.
   
Pishaku
 
---------------------------------
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From dritan68 at aol.com  Mon Nov  6 16:05:50 2006
From: dritan68 at aol.com (dritan68 at aol.com)
Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2006 16:05:50 -0500
Subject: [AlbClub] Trishtimi i Kadarese
In-Reply-To: <BAY106-F10642790A5E63BF20E62A0DDF30@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <8C8CFFE7917C5C9-824-D955@MBLK-M28.sysops.aol.com>

 Enveristet Milo-Rama-Gjinushi festuan ne PEZE dhe aty vleresuan hapur figuren e Enver Hoxhes . Kadare denoj kete akt te turpshem dhe kerkoj hapjen e dosjeve ne nje kohe kur dhe  Bashkimi Evropjan sistemin Komunist do ta kualifikonte njelloj me ate Nazist dhe ka miratuar rezoluten e genocidit  qe ndodhi ne Lindjen Komuniste . Milo&Co u tremben nga ky aktivizim politik i shkrimtarit dhe kerkuan prej ish-sigurimsave qe shume shpejt te benin dicka"
kadareja u tregua pak hipokrit ne kritiken ndaj milos.Ai per vete shkroi dimrin e madh .Nuk besoj se i vune koburen ne koke dhe e detyruan te shkruante nje liber ku i thurrte lavde enverit per shkeputjen nga ruset e cila i ngordhi shqiptaret per buke.
Megjithate ai mbetet shkrimtar i madh.100 vjet me pas do te kujtohet vetem per vepren e tij dhe jo per situatat politike ne te cilat jetoi.
To: alb-club at alb-net.com
Sent: Mon, 6 Nov 2006 9:14 AM
Subject: Re: [AlbClub] Trishtimi i Kadarese


                  *** AlbClub Discussion List ***










From:  "Ina Dushku" <ina.dushku at gmail.com>
To:  "Pishak Zhgaba" <pishaku at yahoo.com>
CC:  Alb-club alb-club at alb-net.com

Sidoqofte, kur Kadareja flet per nje strukture te tere te organizuar kunder tij, jam me afer bezdise qe ndjen Pishaku. Se pari, sepse me c'shoh ne shtypin shqiptar, shteti jone apo segmente te caktuara politike thjesht jane te paafte te organizojne nje sulm sistematik mbi njerin apo tjetrin - ata kane qene te paafte ta bejne me kundershtaret e tyre politike, e jo me me Kadarene. :
:::::::::::::::::::
Enveristet Milo-Rama-Gjinushi festuan ne PEZE dhe aty vleresuan hapur figuren e Enver Hoxhes . Kadare denoj kete akt te turpshem dhe kerkoj hapjen e dosjeve ne nje kohe kur dhe  Bashkimi Evropjan sistemin Komunist do ta kualifikonte njelloj me ate Nazist dhe ka miratuar rezoluten e genocidit  qe ndodhi ne Lindjen Komuniste . Milo&Co u tremben nga ky aktivizim politik i shkrimtarit dhe kerkuan prej ish-sigurimsave qe shume shpejt te benin dicka. Ata paguan familjen Rrapi per te instrumentalizuar nje ceshtje private Rrapi-Kadare plus dhe shtypin i cili ne Shqiperi eshte ne duart te krimineleve shume prej tyre me nje te kaluar Enveriste. Per me shume sesa 1 muaj ne shume gazeta sidomos 'te majta' u botuan lloj lloj shpifjesh kunder shkrimtarit qellimi duket qe ishte nepermjet diskretitimit te shkrimtarit te diskretitohej edhe fushata per hapjen e dosjeve dhe denimin e krimeve te Komunizmit. 



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From dxhezo at aol.com  Mon Nov  6 21:51:41 2006
From: dxhezo at aol.com (dxhezo at aol.com)
Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2006 21:51:41 -0500
Subject: [AlbClub] Trishtimi i Kadarese
In-Reply-To: <20061106161259.69753.qmail@web42209.mail.scd.yahoo.com>
References: <20061106161259.69753.qmail@web42209.mail.scd.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <8C8D02EC9E01280-A08-A611@FWM-D32.sysops.aol.com>

 <<
 Le t? jemi t? sinqert?. Intervista e Kadares? ishte banale, fund e krye banale. P?r nivelin e shkrimtarit Kadare ishte madje e turpshme. Fajin nuk mund t?ia v?m? intervistuesit, por vet? Kadares?, i cili mund t?i kishte t?rhequr v?mendjen gazetarit duke i th?n?: ?I nderuar gazetar, p?r hir t? inteligjenc?s s? shikuesve le t? flasim p?r gj?ra m? t? r?nd?sishme: p.sh. p?r artin, let?rsin?, shoq?rin?, shqiptarin?, etj. Un? k?tu jam n? studio televizive, jo n? klubin e kombinatit t? tekstileve Stalin dhe as n? bar/restorantin modern Berluskoni?. Mir?po Kadareja parap?lqeu t? thot? fjali t? tilla si: ?More qen bir qeni, pse paska r?nd?si q? kritikohem un?, ?far? jam un?, Hitler jam un??. Personalisht e ndjej veten n? siklet. Por jo p?r Kadaren?. P?r mua ka vite q? Kadareja shkrimtar i magjish?m ec?n n? binar? t? ndrysh?m nga Kadareja individ apo person publiko/politik. E ndjej veten n? siklet p?r ata q? e mbrojn? Kadaren? nga kritika, duke e ngritur at? mbi vet? kritik?n si parim. >>
 
 Qe te jemi fare, fare te sinqerte, do te na duhet ta pranojme se per disa njerez, cfaredo qe te thoshte Kadareja, cilado qe te kete qene ngjarja per te cilen diskutohet pas 20 vjetesh, Kadareja perseri do te ngelet me faj, ndoshta per arsye qe nuk kane fare te bejne me ato cka diskutohet. Tjetri eshte vene - sic u tha ketu - para nje gjyqi popullor, perpara furise se shtypit, dhe nuk ngeli gjysem-analist e gjysem-gazetar me gjysem-balluke ne balle, pa na u ngritur ne kete mbledhje fronti, e te recitoje indinjaten e tij te thelle ndaj Kadarese. Tjetri thirret ne interviste ne tv, i behen pyetje, e trajtohet, dhe i pritet fjala, tamam sikur dikush ti bertiste nga salla: "zbertheu para kolektivit, burgjez!" Dhe po te filloje Kadareja te flase per artin, letersine etj., atehere inkuizitoret e kane gati ate formulen tjeter: "O, tashti filloi e po na flet per artin e gjepura te tjera, i shmanget muhabetit se e ka mizen nen kesule, do ta ktheje atje ku i vete me mire, po neve nuk na e hedh dot dobici". Pishakut i duket banale intervista e Kadarese, por nuk i duket aspak banal i gjithe ky proces denigrimi i porositur ne shtyp. Ndoshta i duket banale intervista, pasi i akuzuari vendosi ti pergjigjet drejtperdrejt dhe hapur, banaliteteve me te cilat i eshte dashur te perballet. Damned if you do, damned if you don't! Tha.
 
 Kadare ka folur per artin, e letersine e shoqerine e gjithe te tjerat, kur ka qene vakti, por akuzuesit nuk jane aspak te interesuar per keto. Cfare kritikash? Qe te vjen nje e shkalluar dhe te thyen dritaret e deren e shtepise dhe te kerkon me dhune vajzen 15-vjecare per nuse, duke te uluritur, duke te kercenuar, e duke te share nga rruga? Sipas vete fjaleve te kesaj Janulles, djali i saj paska konsumuar vepren penale te kryerjes se marrdhenieve seksuale me nje te mitur (statutory rape) dhe ajo vete paska konsumuar vepren penale te ndihmes dhe inkurajimit te ketij akti. Pervec dhunimit te baneses, prishjes se qetesise publike, dhe kercenimit e ofendimit te personit. Te dy pra, ne cdo shtet demokratik, duhej te kishin perfunduar ne burg. Vetem ne nje shtet diktatorial, ku diktatures i interesonte ti mbante nen presion intelektualet, kjo u denua me nje "slap on the wrist", pune riedukuese per dy muaj, per tu lene e lire edhe per dy vjet te tjera, qe te vazhdonte zullumet qe kishte nisur. Tani na del ne kete histori edhe nje ish-juriste e Kuvendit, e cila ne vend qe te futet sa me thelle poshte ndonje rrogozi, na dalka hapur te deklaroje tru-shkulesine dhe mungesen e saj te profesionalizmit, teksa paska mbrojtur nje akt te tille ne instancat me te larta te shtetit, per arsye jashte-ligjore (sepse ia paska kerkuar mamaja per hir te nje borxhi te vjeter qe i kishte gjyshit te Janulles). I mean come-the-fkn-on! Per me teper, sipas ligjeve ne Amerike, ky Renatua, do te duhej te regjistrohej si "sex-offender" ne lagjen ne te cilen jeton aktualisht, ne rajonin e policise, pune etj, dhe ky regjistrim do te duhej ta ndiqte nga pas kudo qe te vente. Per gjithe jeten. Une them qe Kadareja, shume i njerezishem qenka treguar, teksa paska kerkuar me shkrim qe ta lene te lire. E paskan futur ne cmendine kete djale? Po shume mire e paskan bere, per ta kuruar, kur ky e kish provuar ne publik, mu ne mes te Tiranes, cmendurine e tij.
 
 Po, na sqaroni kete, o kritikues te medhenj: Qysh paska mundesi, qe kjo grua, te lihet e lire per dy vjet, qe te vazhdoje te bertase e te ulurase perpara shtepise se nje funksionari te larte te shtetit? Nuk ishte se ne Shqiperi kishte procese te gjata gjyqesore, ku vazhdonin seancat me vite te tera, me argumenta e kunder-argumenta te holla ligjore. Ne ate kohe, po te zune, ta vune. Buke, te thoje nuk ka ne dyqan, perfundoje ne Spac per agjitacion-propagande. Atehere me sa di une, as avokat mbrojtes nuk ka pasur ne seancat gjyqesore. Atehere, si paska mundesi?
 
 
 dritan68, tha:
 <<kadareja u tregua pak hipokrit ne kritiken ndaj milos.Ai per vete shkroi dimrin e madh .Nuk besoj se i vune koburen ne koke dhe e detyruan te shkruante nje liber ku i thurrte lavde enverit per shkeputjen nga ruset e cila i ngordhi shqiptaret per buke.>>
 
 Padyshim, faji perseri Kadarese i ngelet. Ai me duket se botoi nje variant tjeter te "dimrit" me pare, po e derguan per nja dy a tre vjet andej nga Fieri apo nga Berati, qe ti vinte gishtin kokes e ta rishkruante ate liber. Po e beri si e beri, nga qejfi apo nga zori, ajo ishte kohe tjeter. Po ju cfare alibie keni tani, qe akoma brohorisni per Enverin, kur e gjithe bota e mori vesh se cfare monstre paska qene. KE nxorri nje rezolute per denimin e krimeve te komunizmit, atehere kujt i sherben ky karshillek kaq blatant, ne mbrojtje te katilit.  
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From bkopliku at gmail.com  Tue Nov  7 01:36:33 2006
From: bkopliku at gmail.com (Bashkim Kopliku--->Gmail  Home)
Date: Tue, 7 Nov 2006 07:36:33 +0100
Subject: Akoma me keqpėrdorime me Ballin Kombėtar?!
Message-ID: <016501c70237$541752e0$0501a8c0@pc>



E majta aktuale shqiptare, po p?rdor? nj? m?nyr? dallkauke p?r t? kund?rshtuar 
Rezolut?n e K?shillit t? Evrop?s p?r D?nimin e Krimeve t? Komunizmit: po b?n 
diversion duke sajuar trash?gimi t? s? djatht?s shqiptare (PD etj.) nga 
nazist?t, n? vend q? t? d?noj? prerazi komunizmin.  Vazhdon me keqp?rdorimin me 
Ballin Komb?tar (BK), si n? 1991-shin: PD-ja ?sht? aleate me BK, BK ka qen? 
aleat me nazist?t, pra PD-ja ?sht? trashigimtare e nazizmit, si? ?sht?s? PS-ja e 
komunizmit!  Edhe k?to dit? d?gjuam sekretarin e PS, z. Majko, se si mbrojti 
enverizmin, se si i bishtnoi Rezolut?s, duke u hallakatur me metodat enveriste 
anti-BK.  Po p?rdorim nj? ?tabllo sinoptike??term q? e kishte qejf edhe ?Enveri 
yn???me shpres? se do t? kuptohet nga t? gjith?, e v?rteta se PBK ishte dhe 
?sht?, nj? parti nacionaliste, patriotike, por jo e djatht?, dhe prandaj PD-ja, 
si e djatht?, nuk ka si t? jet? trash?gimtare e saj, e natyrisht as e nazizmit.

Bashkim Kopliku
Phone: +355(0)52 23663
Mobile: +355(0)682200590
E-mail:<bkopliku at gmail.com>
optional <koplikub at yahoo.com>; <bkopliku at email.it>;<bkopliku at infinito.it>


Akoma me keqp?rdorime me Ballin Komb?tar?!
[Gazeta Shqiptare, 7.11.2006]

E majta aktuale shqiptare, po p?rdor? nj? m?nyr? dallkauke p?r t? kund?rshtuar 
Rezolut?n e K?shillit t? Evrop?s p?r D?nimin e Krimeve t? Komunizmit: po b?n 
diversion duke sajuar trash?gimi t? s? djatht?s shqiptare (PD etj.) nga 
nazist?t, n? vend q? t? d?noj? prerazi komunizmin.  Vazhdon me keqp?rdorimin me 
Ballin Komb?tar (BK), si n? 1991-shin: PD-ja ?sht? aleate me BK, BK ka qen? 
aleat me nazist?t, pra PD-ja ?sht? trashigimtare e nazizmit, si? ?sht?s? PS-ja e 
komunizmit!  Edhe k?to dit? d?gjuam sekretarin e PS, z. Majko, se si mbrojti 
enverizmin, se si i bishtnoi Rezolut?s, duke u hallakatur me metodat enveriste 
anti-BK.  Po p?rdorim nj? ?tabllo sinoptike??term q? e kishte qejf edhe ?Enveri 
yn???me shpres? se do t? kuptohet nga t? gjith?, e v?rteta se PBK ishte dhe 
?sht?, nj? parti nacionaliste, patriotike, por jo e djatht?, dhe prandaj PD-ja, 
si e djatht?, nuk ka si t? jet? trash?gimtare e saj, e natyrisht as e nazizmit.

Balli Komb?tar luftoi okupatorin, m? p?rpara se komunist?t.  BK u krijua p?r t?i 
rezistuar pushtimit fashist t? Shqip?ris?.  Ai i ka fillimet e tij, q? n? 
?dimrin e vitit 1939?, kur ?7 an?tar?? formuan ?Komitetin (Q?ndror) t? 
Organizat?s s? Nacionalistave?, pra KQ i BK (shih librin dy v?llim?sh ?Q?ndresa 
Shqiptare gjat? Luft?s s? dyt? Botnore?, Tiran? 2002, t? shkruar nga kolonel 
Faik Qukut, nj?ri nga ata an?tar?t e KQ t? BK).

Grupet komuniste shqiptare shpesh bashk?punonin me okupatorin, sepse nazizmi 
ishte aleat i komunist?ve.  Qendra e komunizmit, ?Bashkimi i lavdish?m Sovjetik?, 
n?nshkroi paktin Ribbentrop-Molotov m? 23.8.1939.  Komunist?t qen? bashk? me 
nazist?t, n? sulmin mbi Polonin?, m? 1.9.1939?nj? jav? pas paktit, pa vonesa 
fare, apo jo?dhe e ndan? Polonin? n? mes tyre!

Vet?m pas qershorit t? vitit 1941, komunist?t shqiptar? filluan t? mendojn? ?p?r 
luft?n kund?r okupatorit?.  Kjo vet?m pasi nazist?t i sulmuan komunist?t 
sovjetik?, m? 22.6.1941.  At?her? sovjetik?t, me an? t? t? d?rguarve t? tyre 
jugosllav?, krijuan Partin? Komuniste Shqiptare m? 8 n?ntor 1941, pra pothuaj dy 
vjet pas krijimit t? KQ t? BK, dhe dy vjet pas pushtimit t? Shqip?ris? nga 
fashist?t m? 7.4.1939?shum? von?, apo jo!

Balli Komb?tar filloi bashk?punim me komunist?t, n? luft? kund?r okuptorit, duke 
n?nshkruar marr?veshjen e Mukjes, m? 2.8.1943.  Ishte Enveri me jugosllav?t q? 
tradh?tuan, q? kthyen bashk?punimin n? nj? luft? civile p?r marrjen e pushtetit 
me dhun?.  Ata m? shum? luftuan kund?r BK, sesa kund?r nazist?ve.

Nj? pjes? e BK b?ri gabimin e bashk?punimit me nazist?t, p?r t? luftuar 
komunizmin.  Ky qe nj? gabim i r?nd? i asaj pjese t? BK, q? nuk diti t?i 
rezistoj? provokimit komunist.  Por etiketimi i tyre ?tradh?tar t? Shqip?ris?? 
duhet marr? me shum? rezerva.  Kjo sepse nazist?t tashm? kishin bashkuar trojet 
shqiptare, n?n nj? qeveri q? ?e quanin shqiptare?; ata premtonin realizimin e 
?ndrr?s s? vjet?r nacionaliste shqiptare, t? bashkimit t? trojeve shqiptare n? 
nj? shtet t? vet?m shqiptar (shihni hart?n bashkangjitur, t? premtuar nga 
propaganda naziste e koh?s)?shum? josh?se p?r shum? patriot? naiv? shqiptar?. 
Shumica e ballist?ve q? bashk?punuan me nazist?t kund?r komunizmit, ishin 
patriot? shqiptar?, q? donin atdheun e tyre, por q? gabuan politikisht n? 
aleanc?n q? b?n?.  Mos t? harrojm?, se shum? figura patriote shqiptare, edhe n? 
luft?n e par? bot?rore, b?n? aleanca t? gabuara, p.sh. me Austrohungarin? q? 
humbi luft?n, sepse edhe ajo, si Gjermania e luft?s s? dyt? bot?rore, premtonte 
p?rkrahje p?r Shqip?rin?.

Por nj? pjes? tjet?r e BK mbet?n konseguent? n? aleanc?n e tyre me 
anglo-amerikan?t, duke luftuar n? dy fronte: edhe kund?r nazist?ve, edhe kund?r 
komunist?ve.

Aleat?t per?ndimor?, jan? b?r? aleat? me ballist?t n? luft?n e tyre kund?r 
regjimit enverist n? Shqip?ri, gjat? gjith? viteve 1945-1990.  Kjo aleanc? ?sht? 
p?rgjigja m? praktike, m? joekuivoke, p?r q?ndrimin per?ndimor ndaj momenteve 
komplekse historike q? p?rshkruam m? lart.

Balli Komb?tar ishte i qendr?s, jo i djatht?.  Ai kishte pozicionim n? qend?r, 
me q?ndrime t? majta dhe t? djathta.  Edhe n? dekalogun e tij (?mos t? ket? bujq 
pa tok? t? vet?n t? mjaftueshme?, etj.), por edhe n? q?ndrimet politike t? 
shpalluara nga shum? politikan? t? BK, shihen qart? q?ndime edhe 
socialdemokrate, bile dhe komuniste, pra t? majta.  Se je antikomunist, si? 
?sht? BK, nuk do t? thot? fare, se je i djasht?: mund t? jesh? edhe i majt?.

Problemi aktual i PD-s? ?sht? berishizmi i saj, q? e ka zhvendosur krejt majtas, 
dhe jo aleanca e saj me BK.  Q? n? krijimin e saj, PD-ja qe nj? parti e djatht?, 
e ndar? qart? me BK.  Gjat? viteve 1991-96, PD-ja pati b?r? aleanca edhe majtas, 
si p.sh. me PSD-n?, q? kishte ngarkesa trash?gimie komuniste, dhe me qendr?n, me 
BK-n?, por edhe djathtas, me Legalitetin, q? ishte partia shqiptare 
tradicionalisht e djatht??aleancat me PBK dhe PL ishin t? natyrshme, sepse 
bazoheshin n? antikomunizmin e p?rbashk?t me PD-n? e fillimit.  Por fundja, se ???sht? 
PD-ja, nuk ka t? b?j? me d?nimin e komunizmit q? duhet t? b?j? PS-ja!

PS e kompani, duhet t? b?jn? prerazi d?nimin e komunizmit, duke u distancuar sa 
m? par? nga trash?gimia e tyre komuniste.  Diversionet nuk trullosin njeri dot, 
sidomos nuk trullosen aleat?t tan? aktual? per?ndimor?.  T? gjith? Shqip?ris? i 
duhet d?nimi i komunizmit nga t? majt?t tan??prandaj koalicioni yn? i majt?, t?i 
l?r? llogaritjet meskine me ?humbjen? e elektoratit enverist, sepse i bie shum? 
m? mir? ta humbin nj? her? e p?rgjithmon? at? far? elektorati.

Bashkim Kopliku
6.11.2006

Shqip?ria dhe shtetet fqinj? t? saj, si? premtoheshin nga nazist?t
 


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end



From pishaku at yahoo.com  Tue Nov  7 04:14:41 2006
From: pishaku at yahoo.com (Pishak Zhgaba)
Date: Tue, 7 Nov 2006 01:14:41 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [AlbClub] Trishtimi i Kadarese
Message-ID: <20061107091441.11367.qmail@web42208.mail.scd.yahoo.com>

P?rs?ri po biem n? nj? gabim t? vjet?r. N? mesazhin tim fola VET?M p?r intervist?n e Kadares? dh?n? n? Tv Klan e m? pas p?r?uar n? shtyp. Dhash? nj? mendim vet?m e vet?m p?r at? intervist?. E p?rs?ris me plot goj?n: ISHTE T?R?SISHT BANALE. Kush nuk ?sht? dakord le t? m? jap? argumente p?r t? kund?rt?n. T? mos hidhemi nga dega n? deg?.
  Dikush thot? q? mua nuk m? ?sht? dukur banal denigrimi i porositur n? shtyp. S? pari, duhet t? sqarojm? n?se kemi t? b?jm? me denigrim apo jo. S? dyti, duhet par? n?se po flitet p?r Kadaren? shkrimtar (pra vepr?n e tij) apo p?r aspekte jasht?letrare. S? treti, nuk mund t? hidhet posht? ideja se ? n? qoft? se kemi t? b?jm? me ring denigrues ? Kadareja e ka nj? rol t? diskutuesh?m n? p?rleshjen jasht?letrare ku ?sht? hedhur me kok? prej vitesh.
  Spekulimet kinse Kadareja po lin?ohet publikisht si dikur n? komuniz?m m? duken mjerane, pa asnj? baz? e devijuese. Kur m? referohen mua m? shfaqen deri qesharake. Gjithsesi n? thelb mbeten totalitare, meq? ngren? kultin e individit, pik?risht si nj? her? e nj? koh?.
  DXhezo thot? k?tu se ?far?do q? t? thoshte Kadareja p?rs?ri do t? ngelej m? faj p?r disa njer?z. Gabim foshnjor: nuk gjykohen q?llimet dhe as mund t? gjykohet me hamendje. Duhen fakte e prova.
  Kadareja nuk ka asnj? faj kur thot? mendimet e veta. P?rkundrazi. Ve?se ka faj kur pranon ta t?rheqin drejt llumit, ku p?r fat keq duket se noton si n? habitatin e vet. Intervista ishte llum i v?rtet?. N? rast se shkrimet p?r skandalin e djalit q? p?rfundoi n? ?mendin? jan? t? pav?rteta, gjyqet aty jan?: si p?r gazetar?t ashtu edhe p?r akuzuesen. Kadareja mund ta denonconte. Por neve, adhuruesve t? thekur t? Kadares? me veprat e t? cilit jemi ushqyer q? n? vegj?li, na mjaftonin dy rreshta: sa t? na thoshte se shkrimtari i madh nuk ulet aq posht? sa t? merret me ?ik?rrima tabloidesh apo me baltosje ballkanik?sh.
  Intervista ka vet?m nj? merit? t? madhe: na tregon se i PAGABUESHMI ekziston vet?m n? mendjen ton? t? mykur. N? qoft? se nuk e pranojm? as k?t?, at?her? pesimizmi q? na ka pllakosur qenka i nj?mendt?, jo vegues.
   
  Pishaku
   
  P.S. Kjo nuk do t? thot? se shkrimtari Kadare nuk e meriton, p?r veprat e tij letrare, ?mimin e mir?njohur Nobel.

 
---------------------------------
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From leila_0618 at yahoo.com  Tue Nov  7 10:39:54 2006
From: leila_0618 at yahoo.com (L G)
Date: Tue, 7 Nov 2006 07:39:54 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [AlbClub] Trishtimi i Kadarese
In-Reply-To: <20061107091441.11367.qmail@web42208.mail.scd.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20061107153954.2720.qmail@web35811.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Kadareja dha nje interviste banale. Jam dakord me Pishakun qe intervista nuk ishte ne nivelin e pritshem, dhe per kete arsye te ngjallte trishtim. Ne kemi lexuar intervista te tij me vite dhe asnjehere nuk kemi pare kete Kadare qe pame tani. Jo se nuk mendonim se edhe Kadareja mund te humbte dikur durimin dhe vetekontrollin dhe te thoshte c'ti vinte per mbare edhe publikisht. Megjithate:

1.  Qellimi i intervistes ishte pikerisht sqarimi i pikepyetjeve qe jane ngritur poshte e lart ne shtyp per Kadarene. Fevziu beri ato pyetje qe jane ne mendjet e gjithe atyre qe s'jane fort te qarte per Kadarene. Dhe domosdo, po te ulesh e te llafosesh per incidente me Janulla, me ish-sigurimsa, banalitete do presesh, s'ka si te kete nivel biseda.

2.  Incidenti me Janullen nuk ishte thjesht nje incident banal qe i ndodh nje njeriu publik, dhe pastaj perflitet nga shtypi. Nuk ka vend sugjerimi i Pishakut "le te veje ta zgjidhe ne gjykate nese s'eshte e vertete." Te gjitha jane te verteta, edhe historia, edhe reagimet, edhe internimi. Ajo qe s'eshte e vertete dhe qe s'ka si zgjidhet neper gjykata, dhe qe eshte denigrimi qe s'sheh dot Pishaku, eshte fakti qe shtypi po perdor kete histori per te provuar se Kadareja ishte pjese e nomeklatures dhe qe ka gisht ne terrorin qe ushtroi komunizmi ne Shqiperi. 

3.  Kjo puna e "veprimtarive jashteletrare" mua me ngaterron shume. Kadareja eshte person publik sepse ka veprimtari letrare, perndryshe as Janulla nuk do donte t'ia merrte vajzen per te birin, nese Kadareja do ishte shitesi solidar i Janulles. Nuk e kuptoj, Kadarese i duhet thene si Dixie Chicks "shut up and sing?" Se po te hapi gojen dhe te thote "eshte gabim perpjekja per rehabilitim e E.H." i turret Paskal Milua me kompani dhe i nxjerrin vajzen ne pazar? Apo po te japi mendim per ceshtjen e Kosoves, i mbetet hatri Rexhep Qoses, dhe sapo shkruan dicka Kadareja i turret dhe s'i le kenge pa kenduar?

4.  Nuk hyn ne rastin e Kadarese kulti i individit, jo se Kadareja s'ka kult, ka sa te duash, edhe delir madheshtie ka. Por nuk ka faj. Realisht ai nuk eshte thjesht nje shkrimtar apo artist i suksesshem midis te tjereve, dhe po perpiqet te ngreje kultin e vetes apo adhuruesit e tij po ja ngrene kultin me lart se c'meriton. Kadareja eshte I VETMI shkrimtar dhe personalitet i kalibrit te vet ne Shqiperi. Nuk ka vend per zgjedhje midis Kadarese apo Dritero Agollit, Nasi Leres, Vath Koreshit, Paskal Milos, Kristo Frasherit etj. etj.

5.  "Terheqja drejt llumit" eshte e detyruar, per mendimin tim. Keq na vjen, por mileti te cilit i drejtohet intervista "banale" e Kadarese eshte ne ate nivel qe nuk mund te kenaqet me reagime te tipit "nuk e ul veten une te merrem me keto." Asaj i thone ti hedhesh perla derrit. Kur mendje te ndricuara e te respektuara si keto te Alb-Clubit nuk po merren vesh, cfare prisni nga ajo popullsia qe deri ne 1990 ishte 75 perqind ne fshat, 24 perqind punetore dhe 1perqind intelektuale (nuk i hyj klasifikimit te intelektualeve fare)?





Pishak Zhgaba <pishaku at yahoo.com> wrote:                   *** AlbClub Discussion List ***



P?rs?ri po biem n? nj? gabim t? vjet?r. N? mesazhin tim fola VET?M p?r intervist?n e Kadares? dh?n? n? Tv Klan e m? pas p?r?uar n? shtyp. Dhash? nj? mendim vet?m e vet?m p?r at? intervist?. E p?rs?ris me plot goj?n: ISHTE T?R?SISHT BANALE. Kush nuk ?sht? dakord le t? m? jap? argumente p?r t? kund?rt?n. T? mos hidhemi nga dega n? deg?.
  Dikush thot? q? mua nuk m? ?sht? dukur banal denigrimi i porositur n? shtyp. S? pari, duhet t? sqarojm? n?se kemi t? b?jm? me denigrim apo jo. S? dyti, duhet par? n?se po flitet p?r Kadaren? shkrimtar (pra  vepr?n e tij) apo p?r aspekte jasht?letrare. S? treti, nuk mund t? hidhet posht? ideja se ? n? qoft? se kemi t? b?jm? me ring denigrues ? Kadareja e ka nj? rol t? diskutuesh?m n? p?rleshjen jasht?letrare ku ?sht? hedhur me kok? prej vitesh.
  Spekulimet kinse Kadareja po lin?ohet publikisht si dikur n? komuniz?m m? duken mjerane, pa asnj? baz? e devijuese. Kur m? referohen mua m? shfaqen deri qesharake. Gjithsesi n? thelb mbeten totalitare, meq? ngren? kultin e individit, pik?risht si nj? her? e nj? koh?.
  DXhezo thot? k?tu se ?far?do q? t? thoshte Kadareja p?rs?ri do t? ngelej m? faj p?r disa njer?z.  Gabim foshnjor: nuk gjykohen q?llimet dhe as mund t? gjykohet me hamendje. Duhen fakte e prova.
  Kadareja nuk ka asnj? faj kur thot? mendimet e veta. P?rkundrazi. Ve?se ka faj kur pranon ta t?rheqin drejt llumit, ku p?r fat keq duket se noton si n? habitatin e vet. Intervista ishte llum i v?rtet?. N? rast se shkrimet p?r skandalin e djalit q? p?rfundoi n? ?mendin? jan? t? pav?rteta, gjyqet aty jan?: si p?r gazetar?t ashtu edhe p?r akuzuesen. Kadareja mund ta denonconte. Por neve, adhuruesve t? thekur t? Kadares? me veprat e t? cilit jemi ushqyer q? n? vegj?li, na mjaftonin dy rreshta: sa t? na thoshte se shkrimtari i madh nuk ulet aq posht? sa t? merret me ?ik?rrima tabloidesh apo me baltosje ballkanik?sh.
  Intervista ka vet?m nj? merit? t? madhe: na tregon se i PAGABUESHMI ekziston vet?m n? mendjen ton? t? mykur. N? qoft? se nuk e pranojm? as k?t?, at?her? pesimizmi q? na ka pllakosur qenka i nj?mendt?, jo vegues.
   
  Pishaku
   
  P.S. Kjo nuk do t? thot? se shkrimtari Kadare nuk e meriton, p?r veprat e tij letrare, ?mimin e mir?njohur Nobel.
    

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From info at mjaft.org  Tue Nov  7 14:02:51 2006
From: info at mjaft.org (info at mjaft.org)
Date: Tue, 07 Nov 2006 14:02:51 -0500
Subject: Bashkohuni me ne tė premten/Join us on Friday afternoon
Message-ID: <E1GhWDj-00067K-AP@server1.yellowdns.com>

(Please find the english version below)

Bashkohuni me ne t? premten

Dit?n e premte, dt 10 nentor, ora 17:00, Aksioni Civil ju fton t? merrni pjes? n? nj? manifestim paq?sor p?rpara Kryeministris?. Ky manifestim do t? organizohet me bindjen se ne meritojm? t? qeverisemi m? mir?, dhe t? jemi t? sigurt se n? cdo rast parimet demokratike nuk do t? c?nohen nga askush dhe nga asgj?!

Dit?n e premte n? or?n 17:00 do t? jemi t? gjith? s? bashku n? k?t? manifestim, p?r t?i b?r? thirrje kryeministrit shqiptar t? ndaloj? sulmin ndaj institucioneve t? pavarura. Kemi qen? dhe jemi t? gjith? d?shmimtar? t? sulmeve t? egra t? kryeministrit Berisha ndaj Kryeprokuroris?, K?shillit t? Lart? t? Drejt?sis?, Presidenc?s, Komisionit Q?ndror t? Zgjedhjeve, etj. 

K?to sulme asnj?her? nuk kan? respektuar ligjin dhe Kushtetut?n, por p?rkundrazi i kan? anashkaluar ato duke i konsideruar si pengesa dhe jo si baza e aksioneve t? qeveris?. K?to sulme asnj?her? nuk kan? patur p?r baz? forcimin e demokracis? dhe shtetit ligjor n? vend, por vet?m forcimin dhe p?rq?ndrimin e pushtetit n? duart e nj? njeriu t? vet?m.

Dit?n e premte, ora 17:00, do t? jemi p?rpara Kryeministris? p?r t?u treguar pushtetar?ve se nuk mund t? sillen me arroganc? dhe autokraci kundrejt qytetar?ve t? vet. 

N?se d?shironi t? merrni m? shum? informacion, ju lutem vizitoni www.aksionicivil.org. Atje mund t? regjistroheni n? nj? mailing-list dhe n? koh? rekord do t? mund t? njiheni me zhvillimet m? t? reja t? k?tij grupimi qytetar.

Aksioni Civil


Join us on Friday afternoon

On Friday, November 10, at 17:00 the Civil Action invites you to participate in a peaceful manifestation in front of the Prime Minister?s Office. This manifestation will be organized based upon the belief that we deserve to be better governance and an assurance of safety. We also demand that democratic principles not be violated by anyone under any circumstances.

On Friday at 17:00 we will all be present at the manifestation to demand that the Albanian Prime Minister put an end to his attacks upon the autonomy of independent institutions. We have all been witness to the violent attacks that the Prime Minister has exercised upon the Attorney General, the High Council of Justice, the President of the Republic and the Central Commission of Elections. 

These attacks have shown a complete disregard of both the law and the constitution. They have undermined their importance by treating them as a burden rather than as the basis of democracy. These actions have never aimed towards consolidating democracy and the rule of law in the country.  Their sole objective has been to consolidate the power in the hands of a single person. 

On Friday, at 17:00 we will be in front of the Prime Minister?s Office to show the Albanian government that it can no longer continue to oppress its citizenry with both its arrogance and autocracy.

If you want to get more information please check our website www.aksionicivil.org. You can subscribe to the mailing list and you will be immediately updated about the latest developments of this civil group.  

Civil Action



From genckoka at gmail.com  Tue Nov  7 17:40:20 2006
From: genckoka at gmail.com (Genc Koka)
Date: Tue, 7 Nov 2006 17:40:20 -0500
Subject: [AlbClub] Komunizmi dhe Nazizmi.
Message-ID: <000001c702bd$b52b3250$6401a8c0@dellpc>

Stalini dhe Hitleri. 
  _____  


                                            Komunizmi dhe Nazizmi.
Komunisti dhe " SS ".

                                                                 Stalini dhe
Hitleri

                                                                Nje dhe te
pandare. 

 

Kane kaluar 61 vjet nga mbarimi i luftes se dyte dhe njeres ,fatkeqesisht
edhe drejtus shtetesh,duke mos njohur historine,meren ende me fazhizmin
Mussolinian duke injoruar  komunizmin dhe komunistet qe ende jane nder
pushtete politike dhe  konomike.

Komunizmi ideollogji tashme e deshtuar qe shkaktoi kryesisht shperberjen e
ndegjegjes njerzore,ne vendet ku pat vene renje,mbetet ende nje kercenim per
njerzimin,ashtu sic ishte ishte edhe analogu i tij Nacional Socializmi
Gjerman.

Propaganda komuniste apo ajo e kamufluar duke ndruar vetem  emrin e parties,
me po ata njeres  qe nuk kane dhe nuk kane patur ndryshim nga ajo Naziste
dhe " SS"-et ,ciret dhe nuk lodhet per te fshehur krimet e saj duke
permendur ende fashizmin e Mussolinit,qe nuk ishte gje tjeter vetem se nje
regjim dictatorial i tipit Meternikian,apo i Napolonit te I-re  ose pake a
shume si ay i Rusise cariste te fundit te shkeullite te XIX..

Politikani gjenial i shekullit te shkuar,njohesi me i thelle i ideollogjise
komuniste  W.Churchill,pas takimit te tij me Mussolinin ne Rome ,ne nje
conference shtypi i pat thene medias italiane se : " Po te kisha qene nje
Italian,jam i sigurte qe do te kisha qene i gjithe me ju,prej fillimit deri
ne funt ne luften tuaj triumfuse kunder gopsise dhe pasionit kafsheror te
komunizmit...,ay vazhdon 

"....Levizja fashiste i ka bere nje sherbim te madh gjith botes...ajo tregoi
qe eshte nje antidot i nevojshem kunder helmit Rus"... ( The Times,21
Janyary 1927: Churchill's Statemant to the press,20, January 1920 ) .

Gillbert,Wiston  S. Churchill,comp.v. 916 n, The Times  21-Jan.1927.

Graham i shkruante Chamberlain-it ne 28 july 1926 : "....ay ( Mussolini)
perpiqet qe te vere disipline ne nje vent te padisiplinuar." ( D.B.F.P.,ser
IA.ii.194).

Dhe akoma, Chamberlain i shkruante Grahamit : " Nuk eshte puna e ime si
Minister i Jashtem,per te falnderuar veprimet e tij ( Mussolinit ) ne vendin
e tij,por  po te me

thuhej qe te zgjidhnja ne vendin tim  Anarshi apo Diktature ,une do te isha
ne anen e diktartorit.." ( Petrie,ii.295-6).

Gruaja e Grahamit , Lady Sibil,mikeshe e Mussolinit ne Rome, e pat ftuar
shume here ne Ambasaden Britanike per caj , dhe ne 1926 bashke me te qe e
ftuar dhe e shoqia e Churchillit Lady Clementine, kjo i pat shkruar te
shoqit ( W.S.Churchill ) : "....qe kish takuar nje njeri shume
impresiv,krejtesisht te thjeshte dhe natyral,dinjitoz me buzqeshje te
embel,me sy te zinj depertus,..kur hyri ne sallon c'do kush ,perfshire edhe
grate,do ta kishte kujtuar per nje mbret"..

( Mrs Churchil to Mr Churchill,20,25Mar.192 ,  Spencer-Churchill Papers,
CSCT I/14).

Gilbert,W.S.Churchill,comp.v.6756,  677 n.

Ne shekullin e kaluar u krijuan dhe u zhvilluan tre ideollogji diktatoriale
shkatrimtare  per te gjithe njerzimin :

                                                1.   Komunizmi Stalinian

                                                2.   Nacional Socializmi
Hitlerian

                                                3.   Fashizmi Mussolinian.

 

Egersija e te tre ketyre  ideollogjive  eshte fakt dhe mbetet e shkallzuar
si me lart,te  vendosesh Fashizmin ne te paren duke injoruar Komunizmin dhe
Komunistet, eshte naiviet ,padituri historike dhe politike. Komunistet
permendin Fashizmin akoma sot,per te hutuar njerzit me terorin  e papare te
tyre ,per te hequr vemendjen e ndeshkimit per krimet e tyre. Por fatkeqesija
me e madhe eshte qe me ta shpesh here lajthiten edhe politikane  te tjere,qe
ne vent te fjales krahasuse per terorin e kuq permendet fashizmi,i vdekur
dhe  qe i takon nje kohe shume te larget. 

Fashizmi nuk ka qene as Komunizem as edhe Nacinal Socializem.,ndeshkimi per
te dytet ( Nac.Socj) u dha dhe jepet vazhdimisht edhe sot e kesaj dite
,dicka edhe per te tretet,ndesa per te paret me monstruozet : "Jo"! Ata
mbijetojne  ne mirqeniet me mahnitese,ne vazhdimsi te krimit dhe propagandes
,imoralitetit dhe spekullimit,fallsitetit dhe intriges. Kane mbetur aderenca
te nje kanceri politik,ekonomik dhe shoqeror.

Nuk duhet lodhur dhe hequr dore nga kerkesat per ndeshkimin e krimeve te
Komunisteve njesoj si te analogve te tyre  " SS ".

Nacjanal Sacjalistet,druhen te thone  : "Kemi qene  Naziste ",ndersa
Komunistet vazhdojne me mburje ta quajne veten: " Kemi qene Komuniste "!  

Afiniteti I Komunistve dhe Nazistve u pa qe ne pushtimin e Polonise nga te
dy palet dhe ndarja e prehut ne mes tyre , por  vula  i u vu ne 10 nentor
1940 kur delegacioni  Bollshevik prej 60 vetash me ne krye Molotovin u nis
me tren nga Biellorusija  per ne Berlin,Ne ate delegacion merte pjese
Beria,Dekanozovi Komisari per Punet e Jshtme, Merkulovi,16 oficere te
sherbimit sekret  KGB ,tre sherbysa,nje mjek dhe te tjere.Per Molotovin ky
qe  udhetimi i dyte  ne Evropen Perendimore qe nga 1922,kur bashke me te
shoqen Polinen,paten vzituar Italine ne ditet e para te Fashizmit.Tani ay po
e shikonte perseri fashizmin ne apogje..Ne mengjezin e dites tjeter treni i
Molotovit hyri ne stacionin Anhalter,te zbukuruar me flamuret e kuq me
draper dhe cekan dhe te kuqt e tjere ma svastiken e zeze ne fushe te
bardhe.Molotovi u prit ne stacion  nga Ribbentropi  dhe Feld Mareshali
Kajtel ( Keitel).Ay shtrengoi doren gjate dhe plot perzemersi me
Reichsfuhrerin SS  Himler.Banda ekzekutoi internacionalen dhe  zyrtaret e
larte te Moskes kaluan ne reviste  duke  nderuar togat  SS.

Pas kesaj seremonie me makina luksoze te blinduara Benz delegacioni komunist
i " Baba Stalinit" shkoi ne Schloss Bellevue,dikur pallati perandorak ne
Tiergarten.

I gjith delegacioni ish i veshur me te njejten lloj veshjeje si te qene
binjake,me costume te eret dhe kapela  feltri te blera ne gjermani.Shikimet
e tyre qene te hutuara .me sy te zgurdulluar,qe ngjanin me shume ne mafjoze
se sa zyrtare,dukeshin  ende muzhike te pagdhendur. Dukej qarte qe asnje
prej tyre nuk kish pare dhe ndigjuar per perendimin.

Takimi i pare zyrtar  u be nga Molotovi dhe Dekanozovi me Ribbentropin ne
zyren e 

Bismarkut.

Pas drekes ne Bellevue,Molotovi shkoi ne Kanceleri.Aty rojet SS djem te rinj
shtat larte i happen deren mysafirit komunist  duke e nderuar me doren e
shtrire lart dhe e drejtuan per ne sallen kryesore te kancelarit Adolf
Hitler.

Pas nje hezitimi te vogel Hitleri u ngrit ne kembe,me hap te shpejte dhe te
shkurter,i afrohet Molotovit, e nderon po me doren te shtrire lart (
pershendetjen Naziste ), dhe pasi roken doren perzemersisht njeri me tjetrin
u ulen ne kolltuket luksoze perandorake duke biseduar per marveshjet e tyre
tej miqsore..Pas bisedimeve Molotovi,Hitleri,Dekanozovi dhe perkthysi shkuan
ne sallen e ngrenies.Hitleri I shprehu  nder te tjera simpatine e tij per
Stalinin,per menyren se si t e dy shtetet duhej qe te mposhtnin Britanine
dhe  mosinteresin  qe gjermania kish per Ballkanin.Ne fakt asnjera nga keto
nuk qe e vertete, vetem se politese.Nga ana e tij nder te tjera Molotovi me
nje mirsjellje  te spikatur pasi i foli Hitlerit per miqsine  Ruso -
Gjermane , vuri theksin edhe  te ceshtja e Finlandes,Rumanise dhe
Bullgarise. ( Llogarira qe beheshin per ndarjen e Evropes  nga te dy
binjaket ).

Po ate nate Ribbentropi dha nja darke ne Kaiserhof Hotel per Molotovin dhe
delegacionin Bollshevik,.merte pjese Reichmarshalli Gering  ( beniamini i
Hitlerit ) dhe Hessi. Gjat darkes,Molotovit i vjen nje telegram nga Stalini
ku i thesh qe te insistonte per Ballkanin dhe  Ngushticen e Mesdheut (
Dardanelet). Mengjezin tjeter Molotovi i pergjigjet Stalinit: "  Une po
shkoi per drake me Hitlerin,do ti kerkoj per Detin e Zi,ngushticat dhe
Bullgarine ". Nje bisedim te tille  ky ja beri me perpara edhe
Geringut,n'ate kohe Minister I Aviacionit ( Paladin i Fyhrerit.) dhe me
Hessin...

Ne  2 te mesdites Hitleri ftoi  Molotovin,Dekanozovin dhe Merkulovin per
darke.Nga pala gjermane ishin te ftuar  edhe Gebelsi ( Minister i
Propagandes ) dhe Ribbentropi.

Takimi i dyte zyrtar me Hitlerin qe pas darkes.Molotovi i bente presion
Hitlerit qe ti jepej

Bosfori per te siguruar Odesen.Po ashtu  i kerkoi te dinte per dergimin e
trupave ne Rumani dhe Finlande,por Hitleri nuk dha pergjigje.Kur u ndane ,ay
i tha  :

"....Kam bindjen qe shpejt do te takohem edhe me Stalinin .."

" Sigurisht qe po ". I u pergjegj Molotovi..Dy dite para ketij takimi
Hitleri kishte nenshkruar axhenden ,qe sipas directives  Nr.18 te fillonte
invadimi i Rusise.

Diten tjeter Delegacioni Rus u kthye per ne Moske.

Operacioni Barbarossa ne 4 dhjetor u caktua qe te fillonte ne mesin e 1941.

Ne kryeqytetin Bollshevik Kuncevo,Timoshenko, dhe Zhukovi,dyshonin te
Gjermanija dhe  tentuan ti mbushnin mendjen Stalinit qe te bente mobilizimin
e ushtrise,sidomos per faktin qe ne kufine Ruso - Gjerman  ne Polonine e
pushtuar nga te dy palet,ishin vendosur shume trupa te Wermachtit. Mirepo
Stalini u sugjeroi qe Ambasadori  Sovjetik ne Berlin kish biseduar koke me
koke me Hitlerin ne sekret,dhe ky e kishte siguruar qe trupat ne Poloni
kishin shkuar vetem per stervitje tereni dhe Ruset  te mos sqetsoheshin per
kete,mbasi ishin miq.Gjermania ishte aleatja me e mire e Bollshevikve.

Kur Ilia Eremburgu  pat shkruar novelen " Renia e Parisit" ,Poskrebishevi i
telefonoi dhe i thote:

" Shoku Stalin ,kerkon te flase me Ju " !.........Ay u porosit me pas ,qe
mos atakonte me Nazistet ( Eremburgu ishte ebre).

Ne qershor te 1940-tes Gjermania filloi Blitz Krieg-un ndaj Vendeve te Ulta
dhe Frances qe kapitulloi ne 17 qershor. Molotovi pershendeti ngrohtesiht
Schulenburgun,per fitoren e ndritur te Wermachtit. Po ne kete kohe, Stalini
nxitoi per pushtimin e pjeseve te tjera te Evropes, Besarabise Rumune, dhe
shteteve Balltike,emisaret Bollshevike hynin me  mjete te blinduara dhe
venin ne krye gjoja qeveri proletaresh , pupetet e tyre.Dekanozovi pushtoi
Lituanine,Vishinski Letonine dhe Zhdanovi Estonine. Ruset ne emer te
revolucionit vrane njeheresh 34.250 Letone, 60.000 Estone , 75.000 Lituane.
Krimet ishin te pafund. Agjenti  i Berias,  Ramon Mercader ,i  N.K.V.D.-se ,
( me pas G.P.U.), i dhuroi ne 20 gusht per feste  " Baba Stalinit "  Skalpin
e Leon Trockit,qe e kish mare me pagese nga autopsia..Ne shtator te 1939
Polonia u sulmua ne te dy krahet ,nga gjermanija dhe Rusija Sovjetike,qe e
ndane si preh gjahu ne mes. Nderkaqe Stalini dhe manjatet e polit byrose
diskutuan per fatin e  ushtarakve Polake te zene rob dhe te atyre qe qene
dorzuar ne anen Ruse. Roberit qene vendosur ne tre kampe perqendrimi ,me i
madhi ishte  ay i Pyllit te Katines.

Komandanti  rus ne frontin Polak ,Kulik pat kerkuar qe te gjithe roberit te
liroheshin,kete mejtim perkrahu edhe  Voroshillovi ,por Mekhils  insistoi qe
polaket ishin armiq dhe duheshin fshire nga jeta.

Stalini beri nje leshim,urdheroi qe roberit te liroheshin me perjashtim te
26.000 oficerve Polake,fati te cilve do te diskutohej ne  5 Mars te 1940-tes
ne Poltbyro. Bollsheviket ekzekutuan me rovolvera  walter  gjermane (per te
mbuluar krimin nga ana e tyre), 26.000 Polake, 14.700 oficere dhe 11.000 te
quajtur sabotatore dhe agjente,armiq te pushtetit sovjetik.Urdheri u pat
firmosur nga Stalini,Molotovi,Voshillovi,Mikojani,Kalinini dhe Kaganovici.

Cekistet ekzekutonin 250 veta c'do nate, 7.000 u ekzekutuan nga i njejti
xhelat cekist per 28 net radhazi. 19.000 te tjeret nga te  tjere cekiste.
Trupat e tyre u hodhen nder gropa te ndryshme. 4.500 te kampit te Kozelskut
u shpune dhe u vrane ne Pyllin e Katines, Varosjet dhe vrasjet beheshin te
ngatruara per te humbur c'do evidence. 

Ngjashmerija e Komunistve me Nazistet  ishte dhe eshte si ajo e dy pikave
uji.

Stalini pershpejtoi te pushtonte Ballkanin,por Hitleri I dolli me perpara
kesaj pune dhe ne Mars  ktheu ne anen e politikes se tij Bullgarine dhe
Jugosllavine, pas pake kohe,pune ditesh,qeverija  Jugosllave u permbys ne
saje te komplotit te N.K.G.B.-ruse dhe Sherbimit Sekret Britanik. Gjermanise
ju desh te merej me Jugosllavine e kthyer  kunder saj,kjo gje u kushtoi
gjermanve  nje muaj vonese per te vene ne veprim planin Barbarosa.

Ne 4 Prill ,Stalini  beri marveshjen me Jugosllavine,duke shpresuar qe
Hitlerin do ta ulte ne tavolinen e  bisedimeve dhe ivadimi do te shtyhej
deri ne 1942. Mirpo sapo u nenshkrua marveshja Ruso -Jugosllave,wermachti
filloi bombardimin e  Beogradit.Ne Jugosllavi Blitzkriegu        qe me I
sukseshem se kudo gjetke. Po ate dite Ministri I jashtem Japonez  Jasuke
Matsuoka, mbriti ne Moske , pas kthimit nga Berlini. Duke pare fitoren e
Zhukovit ne lindjen e larget , Japonija hoqi dore nga mejtimi i  atakimit te
Rusise dhe ne  14 prill te 1941 nenshkroi marveshien e mossulmimit nga te dy
palet. Kjo u festua, sidomos nga Ruset, me mikun Japonez ne Kremlin gjer ne
te gdhire. Japonija vendosi qe  te bente shtrirjen ne Jug.

Ne 6 te mengjezit treni do te nisej nga Moska, Matsuoka u percoll gjer ne
stacion nga vete Stalini ,gje jo e zakonte,dhe Molotovi, te entuziazmuar dhe
te dehur per kete aritje.

kendonin " Shumel Kamish-in ".Ne stacion ,Stalini i afrohet Kolonelit Krebs

(Atashe Ushtarak i gjermanise ne Rusine Sovjetike), e pushton duke e
shtrenguar pas gjoksit dhe i thote me ze te latrte : " Ne kemi qene miq me
ju dhe do te mbetemi miq ".

Kete e deshmoi  Ambasadori i Suedise qe qe present..

" S'kam dyshim per kete". i thote Krebsi Stalinit..

".Ne do te organizojme,Evropen dhe Azine dore per dore ..." e mbyll Stalini
dhe me suiten e tij dhe Molotovin,kthehen per ne Kremlin.

Vlasiku i urdheruar prej Stalinit  lajmeron Svetllanen n'ate kohe 15 vjece
qe te  mblidhte gjith familjen per te festuar kete eveniment...............

 

Ing.Genc Sami Koka.          

 

Florida     7-Nentor-2006

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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From PKulla at aol.com  Tue Nov  7 21:08:53 2006
From: PKulla at aol.com (PKulla at aol.com)
Date: Tue, 7 Nov 2006 21:08:53 EST
Subject: [AlbClub] Fqinjesi dhe identitet
Message-ID: <52f.a2a8934.32829635@aol.com>

E quaj me vend ta ve ne vemendjen e Albclubit kete fjalim interesant te  
nobelistit te fresket Orhan Pamuk, perkthyer me dashuri nga Faruku
PK
..............................................................................
......................................
Fqinjesia, fytyrat e Stambollit


Orhan  Pamuk 

Nuk ka asgje me te bukur se sa kur arrij te gjej dy a tri numra te  rinj 
gazetash kulturore, terhiqem me to e mbyllem ne studion time dhe ia nis  leximit. 
Cfare mund te pritet prej tyre? Per mua, periodiket kulturore  perbejne nje 
hapesire ku kultura reziston. Ose, se paku, pritet te rezistoje. E  shoh si 
shume shqetesuese kur gazetat kulturore vihen ne gare apo influencohen  prej 
gjuhes dhe interesave te prirjeve kaba te masmedias. Gazetaret e kultures  duhet 
te refuzojne problemet qe sillen prej medias se madhe dhe, ne vend te  tyre, te 
insistojne te merren me familiarizimin me shqetesimet e posacme.  Ndonjehere, 
gjuha e medias se madhe na josh edhe ne; ndonjehere tabloidi terheq  edhe 
vemendjen tone dhe kjo jo se gjithnje nuk pelqehet. Me tej, gazetat  kulturore 
nuk duhet te ndjekin problemet qe mbulohen prej tv-ve apo gazetave te  medha, qe 
kane synim audiencen e gjere. Fatkeqesisht, eshte ekzaktesisht ky  itinerari 
qe kemi qene detyruar te ndjekim vjeteve te mbrame, vecanerisht ne  disa prej 
periodikeve me perfaqesues ne kulture. 
Duhet terhequr vemendja e  lexuesit, le te investigohet problemi, ceshtjet 
ndiqen e zmadhohen prej medias  se madhe. Terhiqet interesimi, provizorisht, 
por, me tej mund te ndodhe si ne  mediat e medha. 
E cfare mbetet te pelqej kur sapo hap gazetat e kultures  shoh te njejtin 
lajm qe e gjej edhe tjeterkund?! 
Nje tjeter shqetesim ne  lidhje me gazetat e kultures: ato jane aq shume nen 
ndikimin e botes  anglo-saksone. Periodiket e gazetat kulturore duhet te 
komunikojne me shume me  kulturat e tjera, kulturat e aferta, fqinje, me kulturat 
me te cilat ato kane  rrenje te perbashketa apo qe kane te bejne. Ato duhet te 
perballen me tendencat  e pergjithshme te kultures si industri; duhet te 
piketojne udhe te tjera,  ndryshe prej alternatives hegjemone te kultures 
anglo-saksone. 
Po kembejme  bisede ne lidhje me "fqinjesine", nje koncept qe per Turqine 
duhet te perfshije  Komunitetin Europian. Megjithese ende nuk jemi bere fqinj me 
te drejta te plota  me EU. Aq me teper kur i vetmi vend prej ketij komuniteti 
ne kufi me ne eshte  Greqia, me te cilin kemi marredhenie racionale. Po i 
permiresojme ato, por ende  nuk mund te pohojme se kemi marredhenie te mira me 
fqinjet. Perkundrazi,  ndodhemi ne nje gjendje konstante konflikti me ta. Ndokush 
mund te shprehet se  po i rregullojme marredheniet me fqinjet tane europiane 
thjesht sa per te hyre  ne BE. 
"Fqinjesia e mire" zakonisht veshtrohet si berje fondamentalisht mire  e 
dickaje esenciale. Ndaj dhe ne kete takim duhet te lutemi e admirojme dhe t?i  
gezohemi fqinjesise si sjellje e tille. Duke vepruar keshtu, behemi me korrekte.  
Per paqen boterore, fqinjesia eshte nje koncept i rendesishem dhe fqinjesia e 
 mire eshte nevoje. Sidoqofte, pelqej te vazhdoj te kerkoj nje koncept te 
qarte  te fqinjesise se mire, koncept qe eshte i konsakruar ne kulturen tone dhe 
ka  kaluar nepermjet proverbave dhe thenieve te mencura. 
Po, Turqia s?ka nevoje  te shkoje mire me fqinjet e vet. 
Por, ne kontekstin kulturor, une mbetem ne  hall me fqinjesine. Kam disa 
probleme me fqinjesine, sic jam i sigurt se keni  edhe ju te tjeret. Sipas meje, 
te jetuarit ne nje qytet modern esencialisht  nenkupton te qenit i lire prej 
presionit qe buron prej fqinjeve. Fqinji eshte  nje person qe mire eshte ta 
duash dhe, i cili, nese nuk arrijme te na doje,  informon per ne, peshperit te 
polici per ne, na denoncon per deshtimet dhe  sjelljet tona. Shprehja me 
dominante ne kulturen tone, ajo qe cdokush duhet te  shkoje mire me fqinjet e tij, ka 
te beje me shume me pershtatjen ndaj fqinjit  (?ta kemi mire me fqinjin, qe ai 
te mos na denoncoje!?). Kjo trysni na detyron  te mendojme se ka dicka shume 
te ndjeshme per t?u ndryshuar. 
Moderniteti ose  thirrja per te ikur prej provincializmit, per disa nivele 
perfaqeson nje deshire  per t?iu shmangur fqinjit, per t?i shpetuar nderhyrjes 
dhe syrit vezhgues te  komunitetit. 
Ne marredheniet nderkombetare e gjej fqinjesine ne tjeter  koncept, te cilin 
edhe e vleresoj. Mendoj se Turqia duhet te shkoje mire me  fqinjet e saj. Por, 
ata prej nesh qe jetojne ne qytete te medha duhet te jene te  lumtur, ne 
kontrast me banoret e qyteteve te vegjel, pasi ne jemi te lire prej  fqinjeve. 
Natyrisht, ndonjehere ne trokasim ne deren e fqinjit kur i kemi dhene  fund 
kafese ne shtepine tone dhe u kerkojme atyre te na japin ca borxh. Sado gje  e 
kendshme eshte kjo, do te thote edhe se ne hapim deren per te verifikuar  
mekanizmin e shoqerise. 
Ne Turqi ekziston thenia se ?fqinji di se cfare  ndjen fqinji?. Ne mendojme 
per nje fqinj si per dike qe gjithnje mban edhe nje  rezerve, dike qe mbikeqyr 
dhe qe raporton tjeterkund cdo gje te tepert qe ai  veren, qe e mban shenim 
ne nje fletorke dhe qe e ruan atje per ta perdorur  pikerisht ne nje moment te 
keq. Mbajtja veth ne vesh e ketyre ishte bere zakon  ne shoqerine otomane ku 
shteti e ofronte si detyre zbulimin e krimit ndaj  komunitetit, kur 
perfaqesuesi i autoritetit shteteror nuk infiltronte dot brenda  ketij komuniteti, gje qe 
ne e njohim prej kultures Perendimore; ku ekzsiton nje  kulture ne te cilen 
gjithsecili eshte nje informator dhe polic; ku komunitetet  ishin transformuar 
prej shoqerise Otomane ? e cila ia atribuonte kete sistemit  popullor (millet 
system-ne origjinal) ? brenda mjedisit ku secili kallezonte  tjetrin. 
Ja prej nga vjen koncepti i fqinjesise, nje koncept qe e vleresojme  
ngrohtesisht edhe sot. Ne turqit e kremtojme kuptimin e fqinjesise se mire dhe  bejme c
?mund per te pasur kete lloj fqinjesie. Sidoqofte, eshte e rendesishme te  
shenojme se per shkak te shoqerise publike, kjo nenkupton edhe te shkuarit mire  
me shtetin, policine dhe me ushtrine. Per shkak te fqinjeve, per shkak te  
merakut perballe pyetjes ?Cfare do te thoshin fqinjet??, secili prej nesh ruan  
mendime te perkunderta, rezervat e kundershtimet ndaj te tjereve. 
Le t?i  duam pra fqinjet tane, te duam Greqine, Iranin, Sirine. Le te hyjme 
ne BE dhe te  jetojme ne paqe. Por te mos braktisim mendimet tona, identitetin 
tone,  personalitetin tone, vetem e vetem sepse jemi te shqetesuar se ?kush e 
di se  c?thone fqinjet tane?, vetem e vetem pse na duhet te shkojme mire me 
fqinjet  tane. 
Gazetat kulturore ne thelb i adresohen njerezve me te emancipuar e me  te 
perparuar ne nje shoqeri, atyre me nivelin me te larte te arsimimit dhe te  
mireqenies. Kultura e fqinjesise, nga ana tjeter, eshte nje koncept qe i sherben  
nevojes se njerezve qe nuk mund te mbijetojne te vetmuar ne nje qytet modern, 
te  cilet kane nevoje per moralin, per kulturen dhe religjionin e tyre, por 
edhe per  religjionin e fqinjeve te vet, per t?u pershtatur ne mjedisin modern 
qytetar  atje. Pa asnje dyshim, do te biem ne ujdi me fqinjet tane, por le te 
mos  sakrifikojme perseri mendimet tona, idete tona te ndryshme prej te tyreve. 
Kur  prinderit tane grindeshin brenda shtepise, ata ishin ne nje mendje per te 
bere  kujdes ?shshshet, shshshet, kush e di se c?do te mendojne fqinjet?? 
dhe frika  nga fqinjet na bente te humbisnim idete tona dhe na shtynte te 
mendonim njelloj  si tere te tjeret. Qe te kthehemi atje ku u nisem, ajo qe presim 
nga gazetat  kulturore eshte te mos na prijne ne te mendojme ne konformizem me 
te tjeret.  
Shpresoj qe kjo konference, ashtu si edhe marreveshja per mundesine e hyrjes  
se Turqise ne Komunitetin Europian, te procedoje ne keto linja. Secili prej 
nesh  duhet te mendoje sadopak ndryshem; nuk ka perse te ngjajme me 
njeri-tjetrin;  duhet te ndiejme kenaqesi ne diferencat me fqinjet tane, jo ne 
ngjashmerite me  ta. Fqinjet tane nuk duhet ta kene problem diferencen tone. Kjo eshte 
bota te  cilen deshirojme. Dhe kjo eshte arsyeja perse koncepti i fqinjesise 
eshte  kredoja e ketij takimi: sepse ne duam te jetojme ne nje bote diverse,  
jokonformiste. 

Perktheu: Faruk Myrtaj 

-------------------------  
*Orhan Pamuk e mbajti kete ligjerate ne hapje te Takimit XVIII Europian te  
Gazetave Kulturore, ne Stamboll, 4 deri 7 nentor, 2005. 


6 Nentor 2006
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From klajdkapinova at yahoo.com  Tue Nov  7 20:44:31 2006
From: klajdkapinova at yahoo.com (klajd kapinova)
Date: Tue, 7 Nov 2006 17:44:31 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [AlbClub] Doli # i ri i revistes kulturore "Jeta Katolike", 3/2006,
	New York
Message-ID: <20061108014431.40807.qmail@web60923.mail.yahoo.com>

Revista kulturore ?Jeta Katolike? #3/2006, New York 
 
Doli numeri i ri i revistes kulturore ?Jeta Katolike?,
qe botohet prej 40 vit?sh, n?n kujdesin e Kish?s
Katolike ?Zoja e Shkodr?s? (New York), me drejtor Don
Pjet?r Popaj dhe kryeredaktor Mark K. Shkreli. Ajo,
ruan shembullin e tradit?s m? t? mir? n? fush?n e
publicistik?s shqiptare ne diasporen e Amerikes. Ne
permbajtjen e saj do te gjeni nder te tjera:

- ?Degjoja nje ze te pikelluar, qe thoshte: ?Mos na
harroni!?, ku autori i shkrimit drejtori Don Pjeter
Popaj, pershkruan emocionet e udhetimit te paharruar
mbas 34 vjetesh ne vendlindje.
- Papa Benedikti XVI, priti ne audiencen zyrtare
Ambasadorin e ri fuqiplote te Republikes se Shqiperise
ne shtetin e Vatikanit Z. Ing. Rrok Logu. 
- ?Nje perle ne bregdet?, titullohet shkrimi me nga
Ulqini, shkruar nga kryeredaktori Mark K. Shkreli, e
cila shoqerohet me foto me ngjyra.
- Publicisti veteran i diaspores shqiptaro - amerikane
Z. Tonin Mirakaj, mbas nje udhetimi qe ka pasur ne
Tirane, sjell mbresat nga Shqiperia dhe ceremonine e
shugurimit te Ipeshkvit Ndihmes te Arqipeshkevise
Metropilitane Tirane - Durres Imzot Gjergj Frendo
O.P., shoqeruar me foto origjinale. 
- Gazetari Ndue Hila nga Detroiti, sjell ne reviste
raportin e organizimit te Festivalit 20-te ne Kishen
?Zoja Pajtore e Shqiptareve? ne Michigan, permes
shkrimit: ?Mes kenges e valles popullore shqiptare ne
Detroit?, shoqeruar me foto me ngjyra.
- Nikolle Pashko Shkreli, ne raportin: ?Moti i mire
dhe organizimi i mire i karnevalit vjetor ne New
York?, percjell perjetimin e kesaj feste te pervitshme
me shkrim e fotoreportazh.
- Ne gjuhen angleze i riu Gjovalin Dedaj, jep
historine e ?The Albanian Pope?, duke sjelle fakte te
reja nga jeta e Tij.
- ?Me Pika Loti Nen Hijen e Rozafes?, eshte
jeteshkrimi i aktivistit te palodhur te komunitetit
shqiptaro - amerikan ish te burgosurit politik ne
Shqiperi (1946-1956) Prof. Sami Repishtit (1925),
shkruar nga editori i gjuhes shqipe. Per here te pare,
jepen detajet e jetes dhe vepres se personalitetit te
shquar te ?eshtjes shqiptare ne Amerike e Kosoves ne
ve?anti, ku tregohen librat e shkruar nga Dr.
Repishti, titujt e nderit te dhene nga organizata te
ndryshme e insitucione amerikane e shqiptare ne
Kosove, Shqiperi etj. 
- Donika Timko (poete), serisht sjell perjetimet nga
vizita ne Kishen Katolike ?Zoja e Shkodres?, duke i
perjetuar ne essene: ?Shpirti i embel i Krishtit
kontrollon jeten e nje komuniteti?.
- Genc Hoti nga Australia, per here te pare risjell
kujtimet origjinale nen titullin: ?Ne gjurmet e nje
krimi? (E verteta vonon, por nuk harron
). Ai hedh
drite me fakte te dokumentuara martirizimin e klerikut
Don Engjell Kovaci (1920 ? 1958), permes deshmive
direkte qe ka marre edhe nga gjyqi zhvilluar ne vitin
1958. Shkrimi historik, pershkruan te kaluaren e
pergjakur te tokes shqiptare, ku Sigurimi i Shtetit
organizon nje vrasje (operativi i zones Marku) ne
Qelze te Pukes dhe per kete akuzohet meshtari qe
perfundon me denimin me vdekje, mbasi sipas Sigurimit
(thjeshte alibi), ai nder te tjera (akuza) ka
perdhunuar motren e vet!!! Vrasja e dyte e klerikut
vjen permes romanit perves: ?Gjurmet te ?ojne ne
qele?, shkruar me porosi nga nje shkrimtar sherbestar
i rregjimit. Historine e projektit te denimit me
pushkatim te klerikut, mund ta lexoni teresisht ne
numerin e ri te revistes. 
- Sofra poetike, me autore: Lasgush Poradeci, Frederik
Reshpja, Kolec Traboini (Boston), Prof. Martin Camaj,
Gjeke Marikaj (Texas) Prof. Simon Pepa (Shkoder, Prof.
Alfred ?apaliku (Shkoder), Gjergj Lacuku (Florida),
Qazim Rushaj (California), Vitore Stefa Leka (Itali),
Dhimiter Pojanaku (Tirane), Ilirjan Me?e (Florida),
Gjeto Turmalaj (Conneticut), Elinda Marku (Detroit),
Kozeta Zylo (New York) etj.
- Profil shkrimtari: Leke Gjoka (Florida) : ?Pak ethe
mergimi?, eshte ne focus i ftuar ne revisten ?Jeta
Katolike?, me nje cikel me poezi dhe jeta e tij si
shkrimtar.
- Kritike letrare: Mhill Velaj (Conneticut), sjell nje
vetrim te shkurter rreth prozes se shkrimtarit Ramiz
Gjini, me titull: ?Jeta njerezore rrjedh perms
anktheve te ndryshme?.
- Studiuesi Bardhyl Camaj (New York), ?Gjergj
Kastrioti ? Atlet i Krishtit Dominius Albaniae.
- Dorina Xheraj (Itali), nga kultura popullore
pershkruan veshjet tradicionale mirditore, perms
shkrimit: ?Simboli i Kryqit gjate propagandas kunder
Tij?. (Autoria, ka mbaruar studimet e larta ne
Universitetin e Bolonjes ne Fakultetin Filozofi
Letersi, ne degen Kulture dhe Teknika e Kostumeve dhe
e Modes dhe aktualisht merret privatisht me kerkime ne
terren dhe ka nje koleksion te pasur te veshjeve
tradicionale shqiptare).   
- Publicisti veteran Tonin Mirakaj (New York):
?Westchester Honors its 109 Residents Lost on 9/11?, e
cila shoqerohet me memorialin (foto), ku ben pjese
edhe shqiptari Simon Marash Dedvukaj, i cili, humbi
jeten ne menyre tragjike.


Afrohuni me mendimin dhe kontributin e drejtp?rdrejt?
n? faqet e revist?s tuaj! Vet?m s?bashku mund t?
ruajm?, kultivojm? e mbrojm? m? tej nga asimilimi
vlerat m? t? mira t? tradit?s shqiptare.  
 
Ju kujtojm?:
 
T? gjith? lexuesve, brenda ShBA-s?, q? d?shirojn? t?
abonohen n? revist?n ?Jeta Katolike?, shuma vjetore
?sht? $30.00 (USA). Abonimi (jasht?) ShBA-s?, p?r
Canada, Europa, Australia, Asia e Africa ?sht? $50.00,
ku p?rfshihet postimi. 
T? interesuarit, mund t? d?rgojn? pages?n n? adres?n:

Our Lady of Shkodra, 
361 W. Hartsdale Ave, 
Hartsdale, New York 10530. 

 Telefono sekretarin e Kish?s Katolike "Zoja e
Shkodr?s", n? num?rin (914)-761-3523 per te konfirmuar
abonimin tuaj. Abonenti duhet te shkruaj emrin dhe
mbiemrin, adresen e plote dhe numerin e telefonit te
tij.
Nd?rsa, bashk?pun?tor?t e dashamir?t e artit,
kultur?s, mund t? d?rgojn? shkrimet e tyre n? e-mail:
ShkreliM at aol. com simonvukel at yahoo.com
klajdkapinova at yahoo.com  
P?r reklama mund t? kontaktoni direkt me dizenjerin z.
Ismer Mjeku, p?rmes e-mail: imjeku at aol.com or tel.
(718)-584-1620.

Ne jemi n? sh?rbim t? komunitetit ton?.
Faleminderit p?r bashk?punimin!
Jepja nje miku tuaj!




 
____________________________________________________________________________________
Yahoo! Music Unlimited
Access over 1 million songs.
http://music.yahoo.com/unlimited


From Dritan68 at aol.com  Tue Nov  7 23:48:12 2006
From: Dritan68 at aol.com (Dritan68 at aol.com)
Date: Tue, 7 Nov 2006 23:48:12 EST
Subject: [AlbClub] Trishtimi i Kadarese
Message-ID: <58d.61bf088.3282bb8c@aol.com>

 
In a message dated 11/6/2006 9:36:21 P.M. Central Standard Time,  
dxhezo at aol.com writes:

Padyshim, faji perseri Kadarese i ngelet. Ai me duket se botoi nje  variant 
tjeter te "dimrit" me pare, po e derguan per nja dy a tre vjet andej  nga Fieri 
apo nga Berati, qe ti vinte gishtin kokes e ta rishkruante ate  liber. Po e 
beri si e beri, nga qejfi apo nga zori, ajo ishte kohe tjeter. Po  ju cfare 
alibie keni tani, qe akoma brohorisni per Enverin, kur e gjithe bota  e mori vesh 
se cfare monstre paska qene. KE nxorri nje rezolute per denimin e  krimeve te 
komunizmit, atehere kujt i sherben ky karshillek kaq blatant, ne  mbrojtje te 
katilit


Compadre ky lloj toni prej polici te ekzaltuar eshte pa vend.Ne Peze  sipas 
shtypit nuk eshte brohoritur per enverin por vetemj sa eshte permendur si  
protagonist i konferences se pezes.kadareja nuk ka dhe aq goje te luaje  
antienveristin e flakte se i thurri mijera vargje dikur duke e ngritur ne  qiell.Po te 
ishte aq i flakte terhiqej si Lasgush poradeci e bente vjersha me  hene.
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From ina.dushku at gmail.com  Wed Nov  8 01:32:04 2006
From: ina.dushku at gmail.com (Ina Dushku)
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2006 01:32:04 -0500
Subject: [AlbClub] korrupsioni dhe revolucioni
Message-ID: <e17e70530611072232p5cfddf61y9d590b18d38ae248@mail.gmail.com>

Nese te premten nuk mblidhen shume perpara kryeministrise, Mjafti dhe
Aksioni Civil mund te gjejne ngushellim te keto fjali:

"Like machine politics or clientelist politics in general, corruption
provides immediate, specific, and concrete benefits to groups which might
otherwise be thoroughly alienated from society. Corruption may thus be
functional to the maintenance of a political system in the same way that
reform is. Corruption itself may be a substitute for reform and both
corruption and reform may be substitute for revolution. Corruption serves to
reduce group pressures for policy changes, just as reform serves to reduce
class pressures for structural changes. "
Huntingtoni i vitit 1968 (perpara 'perplasjes se civilizimeve', por eshte
gjithmone i gatshem te shohe dhunen si karakteristike te zhvillimeve
boterore, ne kete rast te procesit te modernizimit - shyqyr qe paskemi
korrupsionin te na shkarkoje energjine e dhunes).

Duke bere detyrat :)
Ina
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From cun-tirone at hotmail.com  Wed Nov  8 02:42:25 2006
From: cun-tirone at hotmail.com (Cun Tirone)
Date: Wed, 08 Nov 2006 02:42:25 -0500
Subject: [AlbClub] Trishtimi i Kadarese
In-Reply-To: <8C8CFFE7917C5C9-824-D955@MBLK-M28.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <BAY106-F29CA02239229E16EB9141F91F10@phx.gbl>

Nje pyetje kisha. A e ke lexuar Dimrin dhe nese po, kur (per here te pare)?
Te siguroj se nuk me intereson aspak mosha jote, por me mire te sqarohemi,
sesa te kerkojme celesin atje ku ka drite.

?un Tirone


>From: dritan68 at aol.com
>To: alb-club at alb-net.com
>Subject: Re: [AlbClub] Trishtimi i Kadarese
>Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2006 16:05:50 -0500
>
>                   *** AlbClub Discussion List ***
>
>kadareja u tregua pak hipokrit ne kritiken ndaj milos.Ai per vete shkroi 
>dimrin e madh .Nuk besoj se i vune koburen ne koke dhe e detyruan te 
>shkruante nje liber ku i thurrte lavde enverit per shkeputjen nga ruset e 
>cila i ngordhi shqiptaret per buke.
>Megjithate ai mbetet shkrimtar i madh.100 vjet me pas do te kujtohet vetem 
>per vepren e tij dhe jo per situatat politike ne te cilat jetoi.

_________________________________________________________________
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From dacibao at gmail.com  Wed Nov  8 03:05:06 2006
From: dacibao at gmail.com (F. Bajo)
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2006 09:05:06 +0100
Subject: [AlbClub] bashkohuni me ne?
Message-ID: <df49e93e0611080005s781e4592ld811311257d84760@mail.gmail.com>

Me ke te bashkohemi, me ju? Me pare qetesoni egon tuaj te frustruar

 Ju nuk e keni keq o djema qe ka ftoni ne manifestime, po a nuk keni frike
se jeni bere qesharake. Po ku e gjetet kete pune tani qe per here te pare
komisioni Evropian po flet mire per Shqiperine? A jeni ne gjendje ti ndani
interesat tuaja politike nga ato kombetare qe na intersojne te gjitheve? Qen
roje, ju quante ai Lubonja dhe mu duk se e kishte shkelur nje cike,  por
paska patur te drejte. Ju nuk jeni qen roje te se shkuares, por te egos suaj
te frustruar.

Me poshte keni nje fragment qe e gjeta te nje gazeta aq opzitare me qeverine
sa Gazeta shqiptare.
Lexoni dhe ju ruajte zoti mendjen, se duke ecur keshtu me koken ne ere, nuk
eshte e keqja se bini ju ne nje grope me erera te pakendeshme, por puna
eshte se doni te terhiqni edhe te tjeret pas vetes.

Lexoni paragrafin qe ju ka sjelle Feroja dhe gjykoni vete nese jeni te
besueshem:


Komisioni Evropian vler?son se gjat? k?tij viti Shqip?ria ka b?r? progres t?
duksh?m n? t? gjith? sektor?t. Draftkonkluzionet e raportit q? Komisioni
Evropian do t? miratoj? nes?r, paraqesin nj? panoram? roz? p?r pun?n e b?r?
nga t? gjitha institucionet n? Shqip?ri. Sipas Raportit t? p?rgjithsh?m t?
Komisionit Evropian p?r t? gjitha vendet e Ballkanit, kur flitet p?r rastin
e Shqip?ris? thuhet qart? se ?sht? b?r? progres i duksh?m n? zhvillimin e
demokracis?, luft?n kund?r korrupsionit, por edhe efektivitetin e
institucioneve kushtetuese n? Shqip?ri. P?rsa i p?rket situat?s politike,
Shqip?ria ka sh?nuar progres n? forcimin e demokracis? dhe shtetit ligjor,
p?rfshi k?tu edhe luft?n kund?r korrupsionit, nj? ??shtje kryesore n?
prioritetet e Partneritetit Evropian.

Fero
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From ulysse.demneri at club-internet.fr  Wed Nov  8 04:56:39 2006
From: ulysse.demneri at club-internet.fr (ulysse.demneri at club-internet.fr)
Date: Wed,  8 Nov 2006 10:56:39 +0100
Subject: [AlbClub] BALONAT E KABULIT (fragment)
Message-ID: <mnet1.1162979799.21907.ulysse.demneri@club-internet.fr>

Po b?hen dy dit? q? jam me rruf?. (D?gjoj dy-tre zera q? thon? "T? 
shkuara". Faleminderit). P?r t? vrar? dit?n time, por jo p?r te vrar? 
kohen tuaj, mendova q? t? perkthej nj? fragment nga romani 
"Balonat e Kabulit" te shkrimtarit Khaled Hosseini, te cilin jua kisha 
rekomanduar. Edhe pa shpjegime, fragmenti flet vete. Nje copez nga 
jeta e personazhit kryesor qe secili mund t'a ndjeje e gjykoje sipas 
ndjeshmerise e ekperiences se tij. 
Lexim te mbare. 

PS Fragmentin e perkthyer po ja bashkengjis ketij mesazhi.



From ulyssed at wanadoo.fr  Wed Nov  8 10:26:33 2006
From: ulyssed at wanadoo.fr (Ulysse)
Date: Wed, 08 Nov 2006 16:26:33 +0100
Subject: [AlbClub] Balonat e kabulit
Message-ID: <C177B5B9.1F17%ulyssed@wanadoo.fr>

Duke pare qe shkrimi i bashkengjitur nuk eshte ngjitur, po e dergoj perseri.

Ju kerkoj ndjese
YD

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From s_bollati at yahoo.com  Wed Nov  8 20:50:15 2006
From: s_bollati at yahoo.com (sali bollati)
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2006 17:50:15 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [AlbClub] Cameria Problem MbareShqiptar
Message-ID: <20061109015015.39816.qmail@web57108.mail.re3.yahoo.com>

Te nderuar bashkeatdhetare/
  Po ju paraqes nje leter per S.Berishen
  LETER E HAPUR Z. SALI BERISHA
   
  Po ju shkruaj kete leter te hapur si pergjigje te deklarates qe bete pardje ketu ne New York: "Ceshtjen Came e kemi te zgjidhur nepermjet Traktatit te lidhur me Greqine me 1996"
   
   Porosine e babait tuaj qe ju paska thene se Cameria eshte Shqiptare(deklarate e juaj me 1994 ne Konispol), nuk mund ta vinit ne veprim, per aresye madhore-ish mesuesi i juaj, antishqiptari E.Hoxha,jo vetem qe nuk e permendte Camerine por as Kosoven dhe as  viset e tjera shqiptare te aneksuara pa te drejte nga shovinistat fqinje greko-serbe. Ai e bente kete pune per te mos u rrezuar nga froni, por ama nuk i dha asnje cope tjeter nga kjo Shqiperi e vogel e 1912. Kurse ju vazhdoni ta beni kete pune per te rihipur ne fron
  .Megjithese u a kam permendur edhe here te tjera, me detyroni ta perseris edhe nje here :
   
  1. Pse me 2 gusht 1992 u larguat nga Shqiperia per ne Itali- ne nje kohe kur kishit dhene miratimin e kurorezimit te grekut-bizantin Janullatos ne krye te KAOSH?! (provokacionet greke ne kufijte tane po me 2 gusht 1949, ndoshta nuk jua ka thene njeri?!)
   
  2. Shqiptaret e varferuar ne kulm nga rregjimi gjakatar komunist. ja mbathen me vrap per te punuar per familjet e tyre ne Greqi; ndersa juve si president asnjehere nuk bere as me te voglen percapje per te mos i detyruar autoritetet  greke te nderojne emrat e tyre te bukur shqiptare.
   
  3.Ligjin e pronave e bere mishmash me qellim per t'ju uruar ardhacakeve greke-argate te bejlereve shqiptare-i gezofshi tapite e tokave te shqiptareve. More Z. S. Berisha, a thua se vertete  nuk u mjaftuan grekeve 210.000ha toka te Cameve ne Camerin Shqiptare etnike??!!
   
  4.Me 1996 nenshkrove nje pacavure (po, pacavure e vertete quhet Pakti i "Miqesise") kur edhe sot e kesaj dite Greqia mban ne fuqi Ligjin e luftes me Shqiperine .
  Megjithe protestat e SHPA "Cameria" ju e miratuat( por jo  greket !) kete palo Traktat per te vazhduar te qendronit ne fron.Dhe tashti ne mes te New Yorkut, pa pike pergjegjesie e rikonfirmoni. Atehere ju nuk e shpallet, por ish ministri i juaj i Drejtesise njoftoi nepermjet BBC:.." kush nga Camet ka tapi, mund te shkoje ne Greqi e te marri pronat e tija"!!
  More Z. Berisha, si mendoni qe une 7 vjecar, mbasi me kishin vrare 7 pjestare te familjes time, mbasi me mbajten 6 muaj ne burg , kur po me debonin ( jo vetem mua, .por mbi 30.000  came per ne Shqiperine Nene), tu kerkonim shovinistave greke tapite e tokave e te shtepive??!! Per deri sa flitni me kete gjuhe, nuk mund ta kuptoni dot absurditetin e zgjidhjes tuaj te Problemit Cam!!  
  5.Si shpjegohet qe me 1994, grekun-bizantin N.Gaxojanis e quajte persona "non grata" dhe tashti e pret me bujari ne Tirane (s'ma ha mendja se gjate ketyre dy vizitave qe bere brenda 10 diteve ne SHBA, te mos  takohesh me kete" mik strategjik" te shqiptarizmes).
   
  6. Ate qe bere me 2 gusht te 1992 e perserite me 8 Prill 2004. U largove nga votimi i Rezolutes Came (mos kujto se nuk te kuptuam-3 votat qe largove nga parlamenti bene qe kjo Rezolute me se e Drejte-si pjese perberese e Problemit Mbarekombetar Shqiptar-te mos fitonte, perkohesisht).
  7.Pra kurorezimi i Janullatosit, tapite ardhacakeve, ndryshimin e emrave-edhe te vendlindjeve te shqiptareve ne Greqi, miqesite e nderimet me antishqiptaret e deklaruar, japin vetem nje pergjigje se nuk ke asnje te drejte te deklarohesh shqiptare bashkevuajtes por bashkefajtor!!
  7. Nuk po zgjatem me, shkurtimisht po te pyes:
  Ne qofte se e ka haruar porosine e babes se Cameria eshte Shqiptare.
  Pse i dhuron grekut Himaren Shqiptare??
   
   
  Sali Bollati                                                   New York  3 Shkurt 2005.
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
    
   
    
   
                
   
     

 
---------------------------------
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From ina.dushku at gmail.com  Wed Nov  8 22:48:42 2006
From: ina.dushku at gmail.com (Ina Dushku)
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2006 22:48:42 -0500
Subject: [AlbClub] Trishtimi i Kadarese
In-Reply-To: <BAY106-F29CA02239229E16EB9141F91F10@phx.gbl>
References: <8C8CFFE7917C5C9-824-D955@MBLK-M28.sysops.aol.com>
	<BAY106-F29CA02239229E16EB9141F91F10@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <e17e70530611081948y33b21faey5bbbfae87fc8595e@mail.gmail.com>

Por qe te quash Qosen te semure mendor e te cilesosh tolerancen fetare ne
Shqiperi si model te percjelle nga gjenetika eshte nje budallallek i madh,
gjithmone duke perjashtuar mundesine qe gazetaret e Top Channel-it t'ja kene
futur kot citimeve. Perfundimisht nuk dua te merrem me Kadarene per ca kohe,
madje rrezik ta kthjej "The Successor" pa e lexuar sepse perkthimi mu duk i
tmerrshem (ndryshe nga pershtypja e Dritanit).
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From bkopliku at gmail.com  Thu Nov  9 04:14:46 2006
From: bkopliku at gmail.com (Bashkim Kopliku--->Gmail  Home)
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2006 10:14:46 +0100
Subject: Fw: Flet nga SHBA Shinasi Rama, nismėtar i themelimit tė PD-sė. Dhjetori ’90
Message-ID: <046901c703df$819eb240$0501a8c0@pc>



T? nderuarit lexues,
N? nj? intervist? t? para pak dit?ve, nd?rmjet t? tjerave, pata shkruar:

?L?vizjen antikomuniste t? vitit 1990, fillimisht e shihja me dyshim: m? dukej 
sikur ishte nj? sajim i Partis? s? Pun?s (Komuniste), ku kryesor?t ishin agjent? 
t? sigurimit t? shtetit. M? dukej se Partia e Pun?s po sajonte grupin armiq?sor 
t? radh?s, po gjente nj? m?nyr? p?r t? shkarkuar m?rzitjen popullore nga gjendja 
e keqe ekonomike, p?r t? dh?n? pastaj goditjen e radh?s: arrestime, internime 
etj. N? URT, filloi organizimi i PD-s?, q? n? fillim t? 1991, ku un? fillimisht 
?nuk isha aktivist i saj?. Shum? dashamir?s m? shtynin q? t? angazhohesha, gj? 
q? m? b?ri t? heq dyshimet se kishim t? b?nim me nj? provokim t? sigurimit. ...?

Disa m? shkruan se dyshimet e mia t? asaj kohe, 1990-t?s, kan? qene t? tepruara.
Por rezulton se dyshimet nuk paskan qen? aq t? tepruara ...  N? vijim po ju 
d?rgoj intervist?n e dh?n? nga z. Shinasi Rama, nj?ri nga nism?tar?t e l?vizjes 
studentore antikomuniste t? dhjetorit t? 1990, q? qe dhe preludi i formimit t? 
PD-s? etj.  Z. Shinasi jeton n? Amerik?, ka nd?rtuar karier?n e tij atje, nuk 
duket t? ket? ambicje politike n? Shqip?ri, q? t? jen? motive p?r t?i gjetur 
bishtat tona shqiptare; duket se i vetmi motiv q? e shtyn? t? shkruaj, ?sht? 
atdhedashuria, d?shira p?r t? na transmetuar t? v?rtetat e tia.
Natyrisht, un? kam disa interpretime t? ndryshme nga z. Shinasi, p?r periudh?n 
q? edhe un? u b?ra protagonist, pra pas janarit t? 1991, por kjo nuk m? pengon 
t? respektoj si t? v?rteta, ato q? shkruhen n? k?t? intervist?.
Lexim t? mbar? t? intervist?s mahnit?se t? z. Shinasi Rama.
.
Bashkim Kopliku

Phone: +355(0)52 23663
Mobile: +355(0)682200590
E-mail:<bkopliku at gmail.com>
optional <koplikub at yahoo.com>; <bkopliku at email.it>;<bkopliku at infinito.it>




Flet nga SHBA Shinasi Rama, nism?tar i themelimit t? PD-s?. Dhjetori ?90, nga 
Xhon Lennon n? demonstrata
?Roli i Ramizit dhe t? d?rguarit e tij n? L?vizjen e Dhjetorit?
?Ndarja me Azemin, u b? veg?l e Berish?s?
[Gazeta Shqiptare, 5.11.2006]
Lorenc Vangjeli


Esht? jo vet?m nj? d?shmitar. Esht? nj? nga protagonist?t kryesor? t? L?vizjes 
s? Student?ve t? Dhjetorit 1990. Shinasi Rama, nj? nga nism?tar?t e krijimit t? 
Partis? Demokratike, vjen n? k?t? intervist? n? Gazeta Shqiptare me t? v?rtet?n 
e tij p?r ato ngjarje t? cilat shenjuan Shqip?rin? e k?tyre viteve, por dhe 
kusht?zuan Shqip?rin? e sotme politike. I larguar nga Shqip?ria n? 1992 dhe i 
vendosur n? SHBA, me kthjellt?sin? q? jep larg?sia, ai analizon ngjarjet, por 
dhe personazhet m? t? r?nd?sish?m t? koh?s q? i dhan? emrin e tyre asaj 
l?vizjeje dhe ndikuan jo vet?m n? at? t? djeshme, por jan? protagonist? edhe 
sot. Portretet e djeshme q? ai sjell dhe q?ndrimet q? ai mban ndaj 
ish-presidentit Ramiz Alia, kryeministrit t? sot?m Sali Berisha, 
ish-kryeministrit Aleksand?r Meksi, ish-kryetarit t? par? t? PD-s? Azem Hajdari, 
Gramoz Pashkos, Arben Imamit, Genc Rulit, por dhe Fatos Nanos e t? tjer?ve, 
b?jn? t? kuptohet m? mir? e sotmja e tyre. N? p?rgjigjet e tij tentohet t? 
shpjegohen gjith? ato dilema, keqinterpretime apo dhe shtres?zime larg 
realitetit q? tashm? bashk?shoq?rojn? Dhjetorin ?90. Shinasi Rama tregon p?r 
takimin e student?ve me Ramiz Alin?, ardhjen e Sali Berish?s tek student?t, 
Grev?n e Uris?, shpresat dhe zhg?njimet e L?vizjes. Ai hedh drit? sipas bindjes 
s? tij mbi nj? histori q? ende nuk ?sht? shkruar n? m?nyr? q? t? pranohet nga t? 
gjith? ose m? keq akoma, ?sht? shkruar sipas interesave t? ?disave?.

Sot ish-studenti i Dhjetorit Rama ka mbrojtur grad?n e Doktorit t? Shkencave 
Politike n? Columbia University dhe ?sht? Profesor i Asociuar Klinik dhe Drejtor 
i Programeve t? Masters-it n? Departamentin e Politik?s n? Ne? York University. 
Esht? specializuar n? teorin? e marr?dh?nieve nd?rkomb?tare, n? proceset e shtet 
dhe kombformimit dhe analiz?n e politikave t? jashtme e t? siguris? n? sistemin 
nd?rkomb?tar.

N? pjes?n e par? t? intervist?s ai kujton protestat e para t? student?ve, 
raportet e tij me Azem Hajdarin, p?r grupin e quajtur at? koh? t? ?tropojan?ve? 
n? L?vizje dhe sidomos p?r rolin e ish-presidentit Alia n? at? periudh?.


Esht? folur shum? p?r at? Dhjetorin ?90, por ?sht? krijuar p?rshtypja se m? 
shum? kan? folur protagonist? an?sor? ose ata q? k?rkojn? protagoniz?m me ?do 
kusht. Ju vet? ku ndodheshit n? at? koh? dhe ?far? kujtoni prej saj?
N? at? koh? kam q?n? student i vitit t? dyt? t? anglishtes n? universitetin e 
Tiran?s. Isha 31 vje?, ndoshta studenti m? i vjet?r me mosh? n? universitet. T? 
drejt?n p?r t? shkuar n? shkoll?n e lart? edhe nj? her? e kisha fituar si 
krijues letrar i ri i talentuar, nj? dritare q? u hap n? vitet e fundit t? 
sistemit. Kisha nj? lib?r me poezi q? sa kishte dal? nga shtypi, ?Gjaku Im 
Trash?gon? dhe q? ishte pritur mir?. Po ashtu, sa kisha botuar nj? p?rkthim t? 
Xhejms Xhojsit, i pari n? gjuh?n shqipe, dhe nj? tjet?r t? Karlo Kasol?s. Njihja 
mjaft mir? rreth dhjet? gjuh? t? huaja, dhe kisha studjuar shum? e 
sistematikisht, edhe pse n? m?nyr? autodidakte, n? fusha ku kisha interes si 
filozofia dhe historia. Meq?, p?r mua, rruga e vetme p?r t? ?ar? n? at? sistem 
ishte botimi i shkrimeve artistike e i p?rkthimeve, un? punoja shum? 
intensivisht n? k?to fusha, se asokohe nuk t? linte kush as t? mendoje p?r 
filozofin? e p?r politik?n. Edhe n? at? koh? kisha p?rkthyer dhe kisha t? 
gatshme edhe disa p?rmbledhje autor?sh modern? anglez?, amerikan? e italian? si 
T.S. Elliot, Thomas, Auden, Montale, Quasimodo, Pound, etj. Kisha nj? rreth 
shum? t? mir? shoq?ror p?rmes t? cilit m? binin n? dor? shum? libra t? ardhur 
nga jasht?, edhe t? viteve t? fundit.


Si e kujtoni demonstrat?n e par? t? student?ve, n?se t? till? do t? quanim 
demonstrimin e tyre mbas ?mesh?s? p?r John Lenon, n? Akademin? e Arteve?
E kujtoj si nj? ngjarje shum? t? r?nd?sishme. Duhet me than? se n? Qytetin 
Studenti ka pasur edhe shum? protesta t? tjera q? tash nuk i kujton kush, 
thjesht sepse ishin spontane dhe pa vijueshm?ri, si p?r shembull, djegja e nj? 
dysheku tek godina 6, sharjet e p?rnatshme p?r Nexhmije Hoxh?n etj., demonstrata 
e heshtur apo protestat e her?pashershme q? l?shoheshin nat?n e kur fikeshin 
dritat e me rradh? si nga godinat e djemve ashtu edhe t? vajzave. Po ashtu, 
midis 29 N?ntorit e 8 Dhjetorit ka pasur shum? rr?muj? dhe gjithkush e l?shonte 
nga nj? parull? apo b?rtiste nga dritarja apo nga tarraca kund?r partis? e 
kund?r sistemit, sjellje q? u acaruan shum? nga 6-7 Dhjetori. Megjithat?, 
p?rkujtimi i vrasjes s? Xhon Lennon, dhe ajo q? ndodhi m? pas e ka vler?n e vet 
dhe b?n pjes? n? k?t? seri protestash studentore, edhe pse nuk ishte pik? 
kulmore apo pik? kthese politike thjesht sepse ajo p?rkujtimore nuk pati as 
organizim politik dhe as k?rkesa t? mir?fillta politike. Shiko, n? at? koh? p?r 
me organizue nj? aktivitet t? till? duhej nj? leje q? nuk jepej nga Drejtoria e 
Institutit t? Arteve. Mandej, at? protest? duhet me e pa n? kontekstin e 
zhvillimit t? gj?rave. Nga fundi i gushtit 1990 u pa qart? se mbasi d?shtuan me 
duetet, trojkat, me intelektual?t etj., strukturat shtet?rore po iu drejtoheshin 
si student?ve ashtu edhe universitetit p?r t? krijue nj? shk?ndij?, aq sa p?r t? 
justifikuar ndryshimet e pjesshme q? ata synonin t?i arrinin. Pra, un? e shum? 
t? tjer? kishim dyshimet tona legjitime se kjo p?rkutimore p?r Lennon po ndodhte 
me lej?n e sistemit dhe si pjes? e k?tij plani, i cili parashihte q? sa t? 
kalonin datat e 28 e 29 n?ntorit, e t? fillonin provimet, n? Universitet t? 
fillonin protestat e student?ve, q? do t? rrinin aty, d.m.th. nj? p?rqindje e 
vog?l e 5000-6000 vet?ve q? banonin n? Qytetin Studenti gjat? vitit shkollor. 
Un? e shum? shok? t? mi e ndoq?m me shum? v?mendje at? aktivitet q? p?r ne nuk 
po b?nte gj? tjet?r por po legjitimonte ata q? p?r ne ishin skalioni i dyt? i 
paris? sunduese t? Tiran?s, dhe shpresa e tyre p?r t? ruajtur sundimin e kast?s, 
?ka mes nesh i referoheshim me humor si ?malladaja gvardija?. Ajo ishte mund?sia 
p?r nj? shk?ndij? q? nuk e ndezi zjarrin q? pritej.


Kur jeni njohur fillimisht me Azem Hajdarin dhe cilat ishin raportet tuaja me 
t??
Azemin e kam njoh? edhe m? p?rpara, por nuk kemi q?n? shok? sepse kemi pasur 
interesa t? ndryshme dhe kemi l?vizur n? rrethe shoq?rore t? ndryshme. Kemi 
fillue me bashk?punue n? politik? me 9 Dhjetor 1990 dhe menj?her? kemi marr? 
drejtime t? ndryshme dhe t? kund?rta. Raportet i kemi pas? shum? t? ftohta sepse 
n? vlerat e n? mendimet ideologjike nuk pajtoheshim kurrkund me nj?ri-tjetrin 
dhe shpesh jemi z?n? shum? keq. K?shtu ndodhi me 9 Dhjetor kur ai i mbajti 
student?t n? mens? e ne t? tjer?t organizuam demonstrat?n e par? politike n? 45 
vjet n? sheshin kryesor t? Tiran?s. Po k?shtu ndodhi edhe n? m?ngjezin e 10 
Dhjetorit, kur Azemi nuk donte me lan? k?nd q? nuk pajtohej me t? me fol? dhe 
gati e hodh?n n? tok? prej platform?s derisa na l?shoi mikrofonin. Edhe at? fije 
respekti e besimi q? mund t? kisha p?r t? e kam humbur gjat? takimit me Ramiz 
Alin? kur Azemi, duke b?r? me shenj? nga un? i tha Ramiz Alis? se ?k?ta q? i 
?ojn? dy gishtat, nuk na e duen t? mir?n ne, shoku Ramiz.? Mbas atij momenti, 
un? e kam konsiderue haptazi si provokator dhe spiun dhe k?t? e din? t? gjith? 
ata q? kan? q?n? af?r nesh. Edhe pse k?t? mendim un? e kam shpreh? edhe 
publikisht me shok?t ton?, Azemi kishte fitue shum? respekt tek student?t e 
tjer? dhe, n? ato koh?, nuk na interesonte aspak p?r?arja sepse aq duhej p?r me 
hedh? n? er? gjith?ka t? mir? q? mund t? vinte nga ato protesta e nga ajo 
L?vizje Studentore. Nga ana e ime, un? kam punue me Azemin dhe kam q?n? tep?r 
korrekt me t? edhe pse i jemi ruejt? fort nj?ri-tjetrit. Si shum? shok? t? 
tjer?, n? pika t? caktuara m? von? edhe un? e kam mb?shtet? shum? dhe e kam 
mbrojt?, thjesht sepse mendonim q? ai nuk mund t? shkonte kurrkund pa ne e pa 
mb?shtetjen tone. Me pak naivitet, mendonim q? po t? ndahej prej nesh, hienat e 
paris? s? Tiran?s do ta b?nin leck?, ashtu si deri-diku edhe ndodhi. Un? e t? 
tjer?t i jemi gjind? Azemit n? momente kritike, por ai gjithnj? ka synuar vet?m 
lavdin? e vet, nuk e ka pasur ndjenj?n e sh?rbimit publik, dhe ka ken? krejt i 
paskrupullt n? p?rdorimin e ndjenjave dhe t? besimit t? student?ve, si pasoj?, 
duke e d?mtuar keqazi L?vizjen Studentore. Personalisht, mundem me than? se mbas 
dor?heqjes sime nga Komisioni Nism?tar i PD-s?, Azemi m? ?sht? kund?rv?n? ashp?r 
n? shum? raste dhe m? ka rrezikuar shum?. N? lidhje me dallimet e tjera, po 
p?rmend rastin e organizimit t? Grev?s s? Uris?, kur i v?n? me shpatulla mbas 
murit prej ?intelektual?ve? t? Kryesis? s? PD-s?, q? donin ta hiqnin si Kryetar 
i PD-s?, ai filloi t? shtynte student?t q? t? protestonin duke e filluar 
rr?muj?n me 6 Shkurt e duke na i ngat?rruar keq planet tona. Kemi pasur shum? 
z?nie gjat? periudh?s s? organizimit t? Grev?s s? Uris?, por her?n e fundit q? 
jemi z?n? publikisht ka ndodhur gjat? Grev?s s? Uris?. Azemi erdhi me mision q? 
ta prishte Grev?n, dhe disa shok? si Ben Lika, Ben Sula, dhe m? duket se edhe 
Edmond Bushati, Alban Pici, Edvin Shvarci, Fred Gemi etj., e rrethuan me qet?si 
dhe e paralizuan duke mos e lan? as me shkue tek salla ku ishin student?t e 
fakultetit t? inxhinjeris?. Azemi e ndjeu veten shum? keq kur e pa veten t? 
izoluar e t? keqtrajtuar prej nesh dhe mbas do kohe u ?ua dhe iku shum? i 
r?nduar. Mbas asaj kohe jemi par?, por nuk kemi marr? dh?n? e marr? m? me 
nj?ri-tjetrin. Ai u b? vegla e pakushte e Sali Berish?s dhe p?rfundoi duke u 
shoq?ruar me gjithfar? interesash, jo gjithmon? t? pastra, nd?rsa un? vazhdova 
rrug?n time. Por mua m? ka ardh? jasht?zakonisht shum? keq kur e kan? vra sepse 
pavar?sisht mospajtimeve e problemeve q? kishim me nj?ri-tjetrin, prap? se prap? 
ai ka q?n? pjes? e r?nd?sishme e L?vizjes Studentore, dhe nj? nd?r shok?t ton? 
t? af?rt e me pesh? shum? t? madhe n? shum? vendime q? jan? marr? e n? shum? 
veprime q? kemi ba t? gjith? bashk?.


A ka ekzistuar realisht grupi i quajtur ?tropojan?t? n? k?t? L?vizje?
N? at? koh? shum? njer?z shoq?roheshin me bashk?qytetar?t e me bashk?fshatar?t e 
tyre. N? k?t? sens, edhe tropojan?t kan? ndenj? af?r nj?ri-tjetrit, por n? 
L?vizjen Studentore nuk i ka pyet? kush si ?tropojan??. Mandej, sa vet? ishin, 
kush ishin, ?ka mendonin e ?ka kan? b?r? k?ta ?lidera tropojan???!! N? krye t? 
L?vizjes Studentore, qysh n? fillim kishte nj? komision i cili n? m?ngjezin e 10 
Dhjetorit u b? formal dhe q? respektohej shum? nga t? gjith? student?t. N? 
Komisionin Drejtues ishin Arben Lika, heroi i fillimit t? protestave t? 7-8 
Dhjetorit dhe njeriu q? me nj? shoqe ton?n e futi Azemin n? loj?, Tefalin 
Malshyti, m? von? n?nkryetari i par? i PD-s?, Mimoza Zhamo si p?rfaq?suese e 
vajzave, Azem Hajdari dhe Shinasi Rama. Tre nga k?to pjestar? t? Komisionit 
Drejtues ishin shkodran? si? ishin shumica d?rmuese e student?ve q? mor?n pjes? 
n? Demonstrat?n e 9 Dhjetorit n? Sheshin Skanderbej e n? t? gjitha aktivitetet e 
tjera. Po t? jet? ashtu, mundem me than? me kompetenc? se shkodran?t kan? qen? 
shum? ma t? lidhur, shum? ma t? vendosur e shum? m? p?rpara me koncepte se t? 
gjith? t? tjer?t. Ne t? tre, Ben Lika, Tefalin Malshyti, dhe un? kemi q?n? edhe 
an?tar? t? Komisonit Nism?tar t? PD-s?, ashtu si? ishte edhe nj? nga heronjt? e 
tjer? t? fillimit, miku jon? dhe nj? nga heronjt? e asaj L?vizje studentore, 
Arben Sula nga Lushnja. Formalisht, n? krye t? L?vizjes Studentore si asokohe 
por edhe ma von? kemi q?n? ne, ose si grup, ose si individ? q? dol?m n? krye t? 
grupeve e t? shoqatave q? lind?n ma von?. Kush jan? k?ta pjestar? t? ?grupit 
tropojan? p?r t? cil?t flisni ju??!! Me vjen keq me t? than? por kjo ?sht? nj? 
p?rrall? q? i duhej Sali Berish?s dhe Ramiz Alis? p?r me justifikue loj?n e tyre 
e n? rradh? t? par?, futjen e Berish?s n? loj?, kinse si nd?rmjet?si i Ramiz 
Alis? me ?tropojan?t? sepse, p?r to, ne t? tjer?t nuk duhej t? ekzistonim. 
Prandaj, edhe e kan? trumbetuar pa u lodhur tash sa vjet.


Ish-Presidenti Ramiz Alia, n? k?t? periudh? edhe i duartrokitur, por dhe i par? 
me dyshime t? r?nda. Cili ?sht? opinioni yt p?r t?, sot dhe n? at? koh??
Shiko, Ramiz Alia ka q?n? figur? me pesh? jasht?zakonisht t? r?nd?sishme n? 
loj?n politike n? at? moment historik dhe i cili kishte mund?sin? e rrall? p?r 
me ba shum? gj?ra t? mira p?r t? gjith? shqiptar?t. Por, edhe asokohe, shihej 
qart? se ai nuk e kishte vullnetin e duhur politik p?r me sjell? ndryshime t? 
v?rteta, por po b?nte pirueta politike p?r me fitue koh?. Personalisht, nuk kam 
pas? aspak respekt p?r t?, kur ?sht? krijuar mund?sia i jam kund?rv?n? pa pik? 
hezitimi, dhe ai ka q?n? tejet k?rc?nues karshi disave prej nesh. Edhe at?her?, 
edhe tashti, mendoj se Ramiz Alia nuk diti p?r me u ngrit? n? nivelin e momentit 
historik e p?r me i fut? proceset politike n? rrug?n e duhur. Ai ishte nj? 
kurtizan tipik, pa pik? ndjenje komb?tare, shum? i zgjuar, i pabes?, i 
depresuar, i rrethuar nga nj? turm? injorant?sh fanatik? n? Byron? Politike e m? 
gjer?, pa miq?si t? q?ndrueshme, pa shtyll? kurrizore, ?fik i rritur n?n hije,? 
dhe n?n presionin e strukturave t? frikshme institucionale q? shpesh as ai nuk i 
kontrollonte si duhet, pse lidhjet n? ato struktura ishin ?imentuar me martesa, 
me klane, me interesa etj., jasht? kontrollit t? tij. Por, me i ra shkurt, 
gabimi kryesor i Ramiz Alis? ishte n? nivelin ideologjik e t? vizionit. Ramiz 
Alia e shihte bot?n t? ndar? n? kapitalist? e n? komunist?. Rrug?n e 
tranzicionit, Ramiz Alia, si e gjith? klasa politike e tanishme, por edhe si 
paria intelektuale e at?hershme, e konceptonin si nj? kthim n? sistemin 
kapitalist, ashtu si? ishte paraqitur nga Marksi, Engelsi, Lenini dhe Enver 
Hoxha. Me q?, n? mendjen e tyre, vendosja e kapitalizmit ishte e pashmangshme, 
ai mendonte e synonte jo vet?m q? kasta sunduese e at?hershme t? b?hej 
borgjezia, por edhe q? kasta dhe nivelet e m?poshtme t? ndjek?sve besnik? t? 
struktur?s t? vazhdonin t? drejtoheshin nga ?shtabi? i saj i paduksh?m, tamam si 
ortat e jeni?er?ve n? rezerv? q? drejtoheshin nga teqet? e Baba Aliut n? majat e 
maleve t? Tepelen?s. Me k?t? synim n? mendje, Ramiz Alia ndoqi nj? politik? 
konseguente e cila kishte si q?llim kryesor ruajtjen e sundimit t? kast?s e t? 
shtres?s t? cil?n ai mendonte se e p?rfaq?sonte n? politik?. Kjo sjellje u pa 
qysh tek p?rzgjedhja e lojtar?ve t? ?malladaja gvardija,? tek p?rcaktimi si 
lojtar? kryesor? t? opozit?s i disa individ?ve t? kompromentuar e t? 
kontrolluesh?m, disa edhe mburravec? e profesionalisht t? pazot?, si dhe tek 
mandatet politike q? ai iu dha k?tyre individ?ve q?, ku me m? shum? besnik?ri e 
ku me m? pak, k?ta ia zbatuan shumic?n e detyrave ashtu si ua la ai. Ishte 
fatkeq?si q? kjo mend?si marksiste q? e shihte bot?n t? ndar? n? borgjez? e n? 
proletar? nuk i la as Ramiz Alin?, as jeni?er?t e tjer? q? t? kuptonin se e 
vetmja mbrojtje nga eg?rsia e strukturave t? sistemit ekonomik nd?rkomb?tar do 
t? ishte q? me bashkue njer?zit rreth ides? s? kombit e t? shtetit-komb. Pra, 
krimi i tij dhe krimi i paris? s? Tiran?s ka q?n? d?shtimi me i vue gj?rat n? 
rrug?n e duhur, d.m.th., as jeni?er?t e martalloz?t e Bllokut e as Ramiz Alia 
nuk menduan p?r t? gjith? shqiptar?t si popull. Ishte fatkeq?si e madhe q? nuk 
kishte ndodhur ndrrimi i brezave. Drejtuesit e PPSh-s?, si Alia dhe shum? t? 
tjer? me pesh? n? at? rreth, vinin nga brezi q? kishte dal? nga Lufta e Dyt? 
Bot?rore dhe q? kishte zhvilluar nj? luft? t? eg?r civile kund?r nacionalist?ve 
e kund?r ?klas?s shfryt?zuese,? dhe, n? vitin 1990, k?ta ende mendonin se po 
ktheheshin n? pushtet Balli Komb?tar e Legaliteti, armiqt? e tyre t? Luft?s. 
K?shtu, duke k?rkuar e duke luftuar me i kthye kast?n e Bllokut e shtres?n e vet 
n? borgjezi e n? shtres?n sunduese, Ramiz Alia as nuk e vrau mendjen se k?shtu 
ai po kryente nj? krim t? llahtarsh?m kund?r t? gjith? shqiptar?ve t? tjer?, t? 
cil?t nuk e kishin as aft?sin?, as dijen, as mund?sin? ekonomike p?r me mbijetue 
n? sistemin kapitalist ekstrem. Po t? lihen marr?dh?niet ekonomike p?r me 
p?rcaktue marr?dh?niet shoq?rore e shtetin, at?her? kapitalizmi p?rfundon n? nj? 
sistem ku nj? grusht klanesh kontrollon e zot?ron gjith?ka e t? tjer?t kan? e 
shesin vet?m krahun e pun?s. Ky ishte edhe sistemi q? Alia dhe t? tjer?t n? 
strukturat e shtetit imagjinonin se do t? vendosej e q? mandej sistematikisht 
luftuan p?r me e vendos? n? shtetin shqiptar. Mir?po, k?tyre t? shfryt?zuarve, 
t? munduarve e t? pazot?ve q? ishin 90% e shqiptar?ve, do t?iu duhej shteti, si 
mbrojtja e vetme q? ata do t? kishin prej proceseve t? egra diferencuese t? 
tranzicionit. Gjithkund, mbrojtja m? e fort? kund?r mekanizmit bluajt?s e 
efekteve rr?nuese e shkat?rrimtare t? kapitalizmit mbi shoq?rin? ?sht? shteti 
dhe ndjenja e kombit. Jo se Alia nuk mendoi p?r sistemin politik dhe p?r efektet 
e tij, por ai mendoi mbrapsht. K?shtu, p?rzierja e ndarja e pronave dhe manovrat 
e tyre p?r t? ruajtur struktur?n e mb?shtetjes n? popull etj., u b?n? me q?llim 
t? ruajtjes s? elektoratit t? PPSH-s?, d.m.th. q? ata individ? e familje t?iu 
ishin p?rjet? mir?njoh?s partis? s? tij dhe strukturave t? saj, si dhe t? heqjes 
s? baz?s ekonomike t? pronar?ve t? dikursh?m. Pasojat e atij vendimi politik 
kan? q?n? fatale p?r t? ardhmen e t? gjith? shqiptar?ve. Pra, nd?r gabimet m? t? 
m?dha t? Ramiz Alis? ka q?n? paaft?sia p?r me pas? e me zbatue vizionin e duhur 
strategjik p?r t? gjith? shqiptar?t, nj? vizion i cili do t?iu garantonte t? 
ardhmen t? gjith?ve. Nuk e teproj p?r me than? se ky ka q?n? nj? d?shtim 
themelor q? e ka futur vendin e kombin n? k?t? hulli dhe q?, me koh?, e ka ?uar 
n? k?t? gjendje tragjike ku ?sht? tash.


Takimi i ish-Presidentit Ramiz Alia me p?rfaq?sin? e student?ve n? Pallatin e 
Brigadave, ?far? kujtoni nga ajo mbr?mje?
Ai takim ka mbetur i pashlyesh?m n? kujtes?n time. T? gjith? ne kemi q?n? tep?r 
t? vet?dijsh?m p?r r?nd?sin? jasht?zakonisht t? madhe historike t? atij takimi. 
Personalisht, ju jam q?n? p?rjet? mir?njoh?s shok?ve e shoqeve t? mia q? m? 
besuan p?r me shkue e me i p?rfaq?sue n? at? takim. Mendoj se si un? ashtu edhe 
disa shok? t? tjer?, n? ve?anti Ben Lika dhe Tefalin Malshyti, ia mbrrit?m p?r 
me u ngrit? n? lart?sin? e momentit historik, nd?rsa do t? tjer? si Azem 
Hajdari, Arben Me?e, Blendi Gonxhe, e me rradh? e treguan veten se p?r ?ka 
kishin ardhur atje dhe se me k? ishin t? lidhur. Do t? ndalem pak k?tu se ka 
shum? vjet q? t? gjith? ata q? kan? folur p?r at? takim, qysh nga vet? Ramiz 
Alia nuk e kan? paraqitur t? v?rtet?n si duhet. Problemi ?sht? se t? gjith? kan? 
treguar mjaft p?rralla dhe shum? prej tyre nuk kan? pasur guxim ta thon? t? 
v?rtet?n si duhet, disa edhe pse nuk e kan? kuptuar mir? se si erdh?n gj?rat?


Takimi i ish-Presiden tit Ramiz Alia me p?rfaq?sin? e student?ve n? Pallatin e 
Brigadave, ?far? kujtoni nga ajo mbr?mje?
Ai takim ka mbetur i pashlyesh?m n? kujtes?n time. T? gjith? ne kemi q?n? tep?r 
t? vet?dijsh?m p?r r?nd?sin? jasht?zakonisht t? madhe historike t? atij takimi. 
Personalisht, ju jam p?rjet? mir?njoh?s shok?ve e shoqeve t? mia q? m? besuan 
p?r me shkue e me i p?rfaq?sue n? at? takim. Mendoj se si un? ashtu edhe disa 
shok? t? tjer?, n? ve?anti Ben Lika dhe Tefalin Malshyti, ia mbrrit?m p?r me u 
ngrit? n? lart?sin? e momentit historik, nd?rsa do t? tjer? si Azem Hajdari, 
Arben Me?e, Blendi Gonxhe, e me rradh? e treguan veten se p?r ?ka kishin ardhur 
atje dhe se me k? ishin t? lidhur. Do t? ndalem pak k?tu se ka shum? vjet q? t? 
gjith? ata q? kan? folur p?r at? takim, qysh nga vet? Ramiz Alia nuk e kan? 
paraqitur t? v?rtet?n si duhet. Problemi ?sht? se t? gjith? kan? treguar mjaft 
p?rralla dhe shum? prej tyre nuk kan? pasur guxim ta thon? t? v?rtet?n si duhet, 
disa edhe pse nuk e kan? kuptuar mir? se si erdh?n gj?rat. P?r ne, student?t, 
problemi n? thelb ishte se pavar?sisht si erdh?n gj?rat n? at? pik?, tash q? 
ishte krijuar, L?vizja Studentore kishte nj? mision historik i cili donim-s?donim 
ne, e tejkalonte problemin e ushqimit, t? dritave, t? ngrohjes. Se sa do t? 
ishim t? zot?t ne q? ta kuptonim rolin q? mund t? luanim n? at? kthes? 
historike, e ta merrnim p?rsip?r k?t? mision ishte ??shtje tjet?r. Mendoj se un? 
e disa t? tjer? kemi q?n? krejt?sisht t? qart? p?r misionin q? duhej t? merrte 
p?rsip?r L?vizja Studentore, q? duhej t? ishte vet?m e vet?m shkulja e s? 
drejt?s s? pluralizmit t? partive politike dhe k?rkesa p?r nd?rimin e sistemit 
politik. Ky ishte thelbi i loj?s.
Mir?po, mbas protestave t? fillimit, n? Qytetin Studenti kishte lindur nj? 
p?r?arje e madhe. Konviktor?t kishin q?n? shtylla e protestave t? fillimit, por 
nga data 10 Dhjetor edhe m? shum? student? tiranas iu ishin bashk?ngjitur atyre. 
Frika e shum? prej konviktor?ve ishte se Ramiz Alia po e kontrollonte loj?n 
p?rmes individ?ve t? caktuar, k?shtu q? shum? student? konviktor? u t?rhoq?n dhe 
nuk donin t? ishin m? pjes? e ?loj?s? s? PPSH-s?. Si pasoj? shum? prej heronjve 
t? L?vizjes Studentore si Artan P?rvaza, etj., kishin dyshime e as nuk donin me 
marr? e me dh?n? m? me ne. Kur u b?n? zgjedhjet e p?rfaq?sive t? fakulteteve, 
gjendja u pa se ishte shum? problematike p?r ne. Paradoksi ishte se nd?r ata q? 
u zgjodh?n n? at? P?rfaq?si kishte m? shum? student? nga Tirana q? nuk kishin 
b?r? asgj? dhe q? ishin dukur n? Qytetin Studenti vet?m me 10 Dhjetor se sa prej 
atyre student?ve q? kishin treguar burr?ri e karakter n? protestat e dit?ve t? 
m?parshme. Edhe m? problematik ishte fakti se shumica e P?rfaq?sis? q? do 
shkonte tek Ramiz Alia ishin sekretar? rinie, student? t? vitit t? kat?rt, bij e 
nipa an?tar?sh t? KQ t? PPSH, si dhe shum? pedagog?, disa an?tar? t? PPSH-s?, t? 
cil?ve iu kishte dal? frika vet?m at? paradite.


Ata u bashkuan me ju?
Tashti problemi ishte se me at? p?rfaq?si q? u zgjodh, n? t? cil?n kishte t? 
pakt?n 10 an?tar? e kandidat? partie, e disa sekretar? rinie, nuk kishim aspak 
besim se mundeshim me shkue te Ramiz Alia dhe me e ngrit? e me e diskutue vet?m 
e vet?m k?rkes?n p?r pluraliz?m politik, p?r t? cil?n disa prej nesh mendonin se 
duhej t? ishte k?rkesa e vetme p?r t? cil?n duhej shkuar tek Ramiz Alia. Ne e 
dinim se po t? donte Ramiz Alia nuk e kishte problem me na dhan? nj? pjat? sup? 
ma tep?r e nga nj? batanije p?r t? gjith?, se depot e rezerv?s s? Komand?s s? 
P?rgjithshme n? Elbasan ishin plot edhe p?r dy-tre vjet. Po ashtu, shumica e 
atyre q? ishin zgjedhur n? P?rfaq?si e dinin mir? se tashm? ishte marr? vendimi 
n? KQ t? PPSH-s? p?r lejimin e organizat?s s? student?ve dhe intelektual?ve t? 
rinj dhe po ashtu e dinin tekstualisht se ?ka thuhej n? at? vendim. Kur vinte 
puna tek thashethemet, Tirana ishte e vog?l. Kaq t? lidhur ishin disa prej tyre 
me KQ t? PPSH, sa dikush q? nuk po i a p?rmend emrin m? sillte p?rdit?, ?haberet? 
e vendimet q? ishin marr?, deri edhe fjalimin e Xhelil Gjonit n? nj? kaset? e 
bile edhe t? transkriptuar. Nuk kishim kurrfar? besimi se me k?to tipa mund t? 
shkonim p?r me mbrrit? gja tjet?r p?rve?se me duartrokit? at? ?ka do t? thoshte 
Ramiz Alia. Mir?po, ky kishte q?n? vullneti i student?ve, k?to individ? ishin 
zgjedhur p?r t? p?rfaq?suar student?t dhe ai vullnet i tyre duhej respektuar. 
Megjithat?, mbasi e diskutuam p?r pak minuta, me Ben Lik?n, Azem Hajdarin, e 
Tef? Malshytin e mb?rrit?m nj? kompromis se si do t? vepronim. K?shtu, mbas nj? 
diskutimi t? shkurt?r, un? iu thash? se do t? shkoj vet?m p?r me k?rkue 
pluralizmin politik, k?rkes? q? ishte shprehur jo qart? n? nj? pik? t? k?rkesave 
tona. Edhe ata kishin mendimet e tyre se p?r ?ka duhej folur. Mandej ata shkuan 
t? bisedonin me P?rfaq?sin? e zgjedhur e t? ndanin detyrat se p?r ?ka do t? 
fliste nj?ri e tjetri prej pjestar?ve t? P?rfaq?sis?, kush p?r ??shtje 
ekonomike, kush p?r rrahjen, kur p?r organizat?n e intelektual?ve e student?ve 
t? rinj, dikush p?r kushtet, p?r pronat, ekonomin?, e me rradh?. Un? nuk jam 
takue m? as me ata t? tre, as me ndonj?rin nga P?rfaq?sia deri sa kemi hypur n? 
autobus e derisa jemi nisur p?r n? Pallatin e Brigadave. Gjith? dit?n jam marr? 
me mas?n e popullit q? ishte grumbulluar n? sheshin e Qytetit Studenti ku kishte 
gjithfar? spiun?sh e provokator?sh q? l?viznin nga grupi n? grup. Synimi ishte 
q? t?i nisnim njer?zit t? organizoheshin n? vendet e tyre t? pun?s etj., por ata 
nuk shkuleshin nga sheshi. S? bashku me disa shok? u munduam dhe ia arrit?m t?i 
shk?putnim do provokator? deri diku nga masa studentore, d.m.th., nuk pati as 
trazirat e as rr?muj?n q? disa prej tyre synonin p?r me shkaktue, por, mbas tre 
net?ve pa gjum?, un? e humba z?rin, shpesh edhe nervat e qet?sin?.


Pastaj ju u nis?t p?r n? Pallatin e Brigadave. E kishe vendosur se ?far? do t?i 
komunikoje Presidentit t? vendit?
?sht? pak me than? se disa prej nesh jemi nis? p?r me vdek? n? at? takim. 
Pavar?sisht letr?s me n?nt? pika q? P?rfaq?sia kishte r?n? dakord q? do t?i 
diskutonim me Ramiz Alin?, mendimi im ishte se duhej t? ishim t? vendosur q? t? 
k?rkonim vet?m e vet?m pluralizmin e partive politike, d.m.th. tamam at? gj? t? 
cil?s i silleshin rrotull t? gjith? dhe q? askush nuk guxonte ta p?rmendte si 
duhej, dhe q? nuk ishte e th?n? si duhej tek k?rkesat tona. Frika e madhe ishte 
se edhe po t? dor?zohej Ramiz Alia, jasht? kishte aq shum? fanatik? t? Enver 
Hoxh?s, sa kur t? dilje q? andej nuk merrej vesh se kah t? shkonte jeta. K?t? 
k?rkes? do ta b?nim publikisht, do t? k?mb?ngulnim fort dhe nuk dihej fare se 
cili do t? ishte reagimi i Ramiz Alis? dhe i strukturave q? nuk e imagjinonin, e 
le m? t? pranonin at? ?dor?zim? para armikut t? klas?s e ?imperializmit 
nd?rkomb?tar?. Nga ana e vet, Ramiz Alia e filloi me tone shum? t? r?nda 
k?rc?nuese. Ai na lexoi vendimin e KQ t? PPSH q? thonte se lejohej pluralizmi i 
subjekteve elektorale. Kjo ishte di?ka q? e lejonte ligji ekzistues. N? k?t? 
kontekst, lejohej edhe krijimi i shoqat?s s? intelektual?ve t? rinj dhe 
student?ve, pra PPSH-ja nuk po l?shonte formalisht asgj?, vet?m po lejonte q? t? 
shtohej nj? organizat? m? tep?r, d.m.th. po ofrohej nj? pluraliz?m subjektesh, 
fiktiv, dhe aspak demokratik. Ne e dinim k?t? sepse letr?n me k?t? vendim na e 
kishte sjell? i d?rguari i tij personal, Sali Berisha, n? m?ngjezin e 11 
Dhjetorit dhe ne e kishim shprehur mospajtimin tone, por na u tha se kjo ?sht? e 
mos k?rkoni m? se mandej nuk i dihet. Pra, Ramiz Alia priste q? pasi t? na 
lexonte vendimin, ne ta duartrokisnim dhe t? shkonim me ?sihariqin? tek 
student?t e t? b?nim nj? organizat? me ?malladaja gvardija? n? krye t? saj. 
Simbas mend?sis? s? Bllokut, n? krye t? saj do t? dilnin pedagog?t e rinj e 
intelektual?t e kryeqytetit q? ata i kishin piketuar me kujdes, nuk do t? dilnim 
ne konviktor?t e provincial?t. E papritura e madhe p?r Ramiz Alin?, Sk?nder 
Gjinushin e Lisenko Bashkurtin ishte se ne ja hodh?m posht?, pa nj? pa dy, k?t? 
vendim t? KQ t? PPSH-s?, nuk i k?rkuam batanije e sup? t? nxeht? e drita, por ia 
k?rkuam, me ashp?rsi, sepse ajo ishte e drejt? q? duhej fituar prej nesh e nuk 
mund t? na falej prej tij, pluralizmin e mir?fillt? t? partive politike. Mir?po, 
ne e dinim se Alia nuk e kishte mandatin p?r me e dhan? pluralizmin e partive 
politike, ai nuk kishte ku me i marr? an?tar?t e Byros? q? t?ja aprovonin 
vendimin e mandej ai t?ua linte p?rgjegj?sin?, pra, p?rgjegj?sia ishte krejt e 
tija dhe ai mund t? vihej leht?sisht n? kryq prej tyre. Nga ana tjet?r, edhe me 
u sjell? ndryshe nuk mundte, ai duhej ta merrte nj? vendim aty e n? at? moment 
sepse ishin 150,000 vet? n? sheshin e Qytetit Studenti q? prisnin p?rgjigje dhe 
nuk dihej se ?ka mund t? ndodhte. Pra, ne e kishim ngritur pazarin shum? dhe e 
kishim v?n? n? nj? pozit? shum? t? v?shtir?, aq sa ai filloi t? djersiste 
duksh?m dhe u b? shum? nervoz. Si pasoj?, edhe marr?dh?niet e biseda u 
tensionuan shum?.


Pra, biseda po b?hej n?n shenj?n e nervozizmit?
Biseda shkoi rrug? pa rrug?, Ramiz Alia kishte ardhur me tre fjalime rezerv? p?r 
gjith?ka q? mund t? diskutohej, ne e d?gjuam dhe e trajtuam her? me respekt e 
her? pa pik? respekti, thjesht sepse duke iu kund?rv?n? atij po i kund?rviheshim 
publikisht edhe partis?-shtet, deri at?her? po edhe at?her?, t? plotfuqishme, q? 
ai e p?rfaq?sonte. Gjithkush prej nesh e tregoi se kush ishte n? t? v?rtet? n? 
at? takim e p?r k? punonin. Kur mbas akrobacive t? tij, erdhi puna q? e pyet?m 
haptazi ?a don me e dhan? apo jo?? Ramiz Alia e kuptoi se kishte ardhur koha p?r 
nj? vendim q? ende mendoj se ai nuk ishte i p?rgatitur p?r me e marr? dhe q? nuk 
donte me e marr?. Ai tha nj? ?po? n?p?r dh?mb?, dhe jam i sigurt? se na 
imagjinonte disa prej nesh si agjent? t? imperializmit, t? revizionizmit, t? 
Amerik?s e t? Anglis? dhe mendonte se me siguri q? dikush nga agjenturat e huaja 
duhej t? na e kishte p?shp?ritur n? vesh q? ta k?rkonim pluralizmin. Ramiz Alis? 
nuk ja merrte mendja se ne mund ta dinim se ?ka ishte pluralizmi i partive 
politike. Kur ai tha ?po? takimi e mbrriti fitoren m? t? madhe p?r t? gjith? 
popullin shqiptar, por mbi t? gjitha, ishte ajo ?ka na kishin k?rkue p?r me 
mbrrit? t? gjith? shok?t ton? q? prisnin n? Sheshin e Qytetit Studenti dhe q? 
ende kishin dyshime, p?r disa edhe shum? t? bazuara, se mund t?i tradhtonim. P?r 
mua, ky ka ken? momenti m? i r?nd?sish?m i jet?s sime dhe q? e ka p?rcaktue 
rrug?n q? kam marr? at?her? e mbrapa. Un? me shok?t e mi, kur kemi shkue n? at? 
takim, jemi nis? p?r me vdek? por t? vendosur p?r me u kthye me nder, p?r me i 
ba nj? sh?rbim popullit ton? dhe me e ndihmue p?r me gjet? rrug?n e duhur n? at? 
pik? delikate dhe ekzistenciale.


N? mes t? dhjetorit, n? Qytetin Studenti nis?n t? ngjiten ata njer?z q? kan? 
pushtuar n? k?to 16 vjet politik?n shqiptare. Mund t? kujtoni ardhjen e 
kryeministrit t? sot?m Sali Berisha?
Nuk ka r?nd?si se kur e si erdhi Saliu, se si e kishte ngjyr?n e pardesys?, kush 
e thirri e i dha detyr?n, kush i tregoi se si duhej t? ngjitej n? Qytetin 
Studenti, kush e shoq?ronte, si i ngjiti shkall?t, etj., R?nd?si ka se kush e 
?oi dhe ?far? mesazhi po sillte. P?r shok?t e mi dhe p?r mua, pavar?sisht emrit 
q? kishte krijuar n? rrethet intelektuale, Saliu erdhi dhe u soll si sh?rb?tor 
besnik i Ramiz Alis? dhe ato koh? ne e kemi trajtue gjithnj? n? at? kategorin? e 
kasnecit t? Ramiz Alis?.


N? fjal?n e par? t? tij p?rpara student?ve Doktor Berisha ?sht? shprehur se 
?vinte t? p?rsh?ndeste si mik i student?ve dhe i partis? demokratike? dhe p?r 
k?t? edhe ?sht? fishk?llyer nga student?t. ?far? raportesh krijuat me t??
Ta thash? edhe m? lart, Sali Berisha vinte me nj? mesazh t? qart? nga Ramiz 
Alia. Kur flet papagalli nuk ka r?nd?si se ?ka thot?, ai thot? at? q? i kan? 
m?suar t? thot?. Pra, dihet se ?ka ban papagalli, at? bani edhe Saliu. Edhe pse 
m? vjen shum? keq p?r me e than?, ne e kemi trajtuar si lajm?tar besnik t? Ramiz 
Alis? dhe n? nj? far? m?nyre edhe e kemi abuzuar keq, pa dasht? p?r me kuptue se 
kishte gj?ra q? ishin jasht? kontrollit t? tij, sepse dihej se Saliu nuk ishte 
njeri krejt ordiner dhe se ai vepronte brenda strukturave, fuqin? e t? cilave ai 
e njihte mir?. Pra, kjo nuk don me than? se Saliu nuk kishte mendime t? vetat se 
ai kishte shprehur opinionet t? tijat n? shtyp dhe n? takime t? ndryshme. 
Mandej, me e than? at? q? ?sht?, Saliu ishte nd?r individ?t m? t? zgjuar q? 
erdh?n n? Qytetin Studenti dhe ai ishte shum? m? lart se t? gjith? t? tjer?t n? 
?do drejtim. Ai ishte me kultur? t? gjer?, me interesa t? m?dha, dhe me dijeni 
p?r funksionimin e shtetit e t? institucioneve, edhe per?ndimore. Gjithashtu, 
p?r shkak t? profesionit t? tij ai kishte lidhje shum? t? gj?ra me shum? grupe e 
individ? n? parin? e Tiran?s e m? gjer?. Por, personalisht, un? nuk i kam besuar 
asnj?her? sepse mendoja q? p?rtej lustr?s s? jashtme, Saliu kishte probleme t? 
m?dha, si individ, si karakter, e si politikan, defekte t? cilat edhe i 
manifestoi kur hyri n? politik?.


Roli i intelektual?ve q? ju bashkangjit?n L?vizjes, Meksi, Imami, Pashko, Ruli e 
t? tjer?? Sot nga larg?sia e k?tyre viteve, ?far? kujtoni p?r ta?
Kur u themelua PD-ja, ajo ishte nj? parti q? u themelua me ngut dhe me pazarll?k 
midis tre-kat?r vet?ve dhe mandej secili solli njer?zit e vet, dhe n? dy-tre 
dit? PD ishte kthyer n? nj? karnaval t? v?rtet?. Por n? lidhje me sa pyesni ju, 
Azemi dhe Saliu e mb?shtet?n Imamin, se ky erdhi i rekomanduar fort tek ata dhe 
njihej si pedagog q? ishte b?r? aktiv mbas 10 Dhjetorit, nd?rsa Gramoz Pashkoja 
solli Genc Rulin e Leka Meksin, dhe n? at? moment ky ishte padyshim sh?rbim i 
madh p?r PD-n? sepse si Leka Meksi ashtu edhe Genc Ruli ishin intelektual? t? 
formuar e me respekt t? madh n? rrethe t? caktuara e n? profesionet e tyre. Leka 
Meksi kishte jetuar n? Gjermani, e njihte demokracin?, e njihte sistemin, dhe 
kishte aft?si t? m?dha p?r t? punuar me intelektual?t. Nga ana e vet, Genc Ruli 
ishte nga t? pakt?t profesionist? t? zot? q? edhe po t? donte t? rrinte nga 
krahu tjet?r, Ramiz Alia nuk e mbante dot, sepse ai ishte kunati i Gramoz 
Pashkos dhe nuk kishte se si t?i mbante nj? k?ndej e nj? andej, por duhet th?n? 
se vet?m pak muaj m? par?, nga vera e vitit 1990, ai kishte q?n? kandidati num?r 
nj? p?r postin e ministrit t? Tregtis? s? Jashtme, ?ka flet edhe dijet q? ai 
kishte.


Ju u konfliktuat nd?r t? par?t me zotin Berisha, a mund t? na tregoni detaje p?r 
debatet tuaja?
Me q? un? k?to aspekte i kam trajtuar gjer? e gjat? n? librin tim, ?Probleme 
Politike Shqiptare? nuk po dua q? t? flas m? shum? p?r Berish?n dhe p?r 
p?rplasjet e mia t? shumta me t?. Por do t? them vet?m se kur kam dh?n? 
dor?heqjen nga Komisioni Nism?tar i PD-s?, dhe un? kam q?n? i pari nga 
?themeluesit e PD-s?? q? e ka b?r? k?t?, e kam akuzuar se kishte fjal? se ishte 
agjent i dyfisht?, se ishte veg?l e Ramiz Alis?, se ishte person me 
karakteristika t? theksuara autoritare, ?ka do ta minonte demokracin? dhe do ta 
?onte vendin n? Luft? Civile, dhe si individ q? i kishte tradh?tuar idealet e 
L?vizjes Studentore. Nuk m? vjen mir? p?r me than? se kam pasur t? drejt? qysh 
at?her?, por koha m? ka dh?n? shum? t? drejt?. Me Saliun jemi ngat?rruar e nuk 
jemi pajtuar p?r shum? gj?ra, qysh prej trajtimit t? ??shtjes komb?tare, tek 
metoda me t? cil?n u synua q? t? nd?rtoheshin strukturat e PD-s? n? Tiran? e m? 
gjer?, tek kulti i tij, e me rradh?. Por t? gjitha k?to debate dhe argumentet e 
mia jan? shpjeguar mjaft qart? n? librin tim.



N? numrin e djesh?m t? Gazeta Shqiptare, n? intervist?n e tij, Shinasi Rama, nj? 
nga nism?tar?t e themelimit t? Partis? Demokratike tregpoi p?r atmosfer?n 
dramtike t? takimit t? P?rfaq?sis? s? Student?ve me ish-Presidentin Ramiz Alia, 
n? Pallatin e Brigadave, kur dhe u k?rkua p?r her? t? par? shpallja e 
pluralizmit politik n? Shqip?ri. Rama d?shmon p?r m?nyr?n sesi u krijua PD dhe 
jep konsideratat e tij p?r ata personazhe t? cil?t i dhan? emrin e tyre k?saj 
partie, akuzon zotin Berisha si t? d?rguar nga Ramiz Alia tek student?t dhe flet 
p?r Hajdarin, Pashkon, Meksin, Imamin, Rulin e t? tjer?. Vet? Rama largohet nga 
Shqip?ria menj?her? mbas zgjedhjeve t? para pluraliste t? 31 marsit 1991, dy 
dit? mbas t? cilave ndodhi masakra e Shkodr?s. Vendoset q? n? vitin 1992 n? SHBA 
duke vazhduar nj? karrier? akademike. N? 1998-2000 angazhohet n? rradh?t e 
U?K-s? si k?shilltar politik e z?dh?n?s i saj e m? pas, edhe si k?shilltar i 
Kryeministrit t? Qeveris? s? P?rkohshme n? Kosov?. Nga viti 2000 e k?tej ka 
dh?n? m?sim n? SHBA, n? Columbia University dhe Ne? York University.



Krijimi i Partis? Demokratike, besoni se u tradh?tua shpirti i L?vizjes 
Studentore dhe ajo sh?rbeu si trampolin? p?r ?bijt? e et?rve??
Nuk ka pik? dyshimi se krijimi i PD-s? ishte nj? moment kritik p?r t? gjith?. 
Kush e krijoi PD-n?? Saliu duhet q? t? na shpjegoj? se kush i b?ri bashk? at? me 
Gramoz Pashkon n? m?ngjezin e 11 Dhjetorit, kush iu tha q? t? bisedonin e t? 
mblidhnin edhe intelektual?t e tjer? e ta b?nin partin?, sepse po ta b?nin at? 
hap, L?vizja Studentore do t?i mb?shteste deri n? fund. K?shtu, m? vjen me qesh? 
kur e d?gjoj Saliun t? thot? n? p?rvjetoret e ndryshme se filani ka q?n? nga 
?themeluesit m? t? r?nd?sish?m? ? Asokohe, gj?rat ndrronin me minuta e jo me 
or?. Ne kemi synuar q? t?i mb?shtesnim intelektual?t q? ata t? krijonin partin? 
e tyre e ne t? ruanim L?vizjen Studentore t? pavarur nga ajo parti politike q? 
do t? lindte. Mir?po, ku do ta b?nin partin?? K?shtu u detyruan q? t? vinin tek 
ne sepse mendonin se me Azemin si nd?rmjet?s do t?i zgjidhnin pun?t. Por, mbasi 
e pam? se kush po vinte q? ta b?nte partin? e opozit?s, un? e shok?t e tjer? i 
p?rzum? si ata ashtu edhe Azemin dhe gjendja e tyre u b? shum? kritike, se nuk 
krijohej partia n? bodrumin e sht?pis? ku jetonte Gramoz Pashko. Nga dreka, duke 
e par? gjendjen dhe duke e par? se populli nuk shkulej fare nga Sheshi i Qytetit 
Studenti, ne i lejuam q? ta shpallnin PD-n?, por me kusht q? n? Komisionin 
Nism?tar t? mos kishte shtat? vet?, por gjasht? student?, tre intelektual? t? 
Tiran?s e kat?r pedagog? t? Universitetit. Mendonim se do t? mund t? ruanim 
kontrollin mbi Qytetin Studenti e mbi L?vizjen Studentore dhe, me koh?, ne t? 
vazhdonim rrug?n ton? q? nuk ishte rruga e tyre, e q? nuk duhej t? ishte rruga e 
tyre. Por, Saliu dhe Azemi e ??imentuan? aleanc?n e tyre e cila na d?mtoi tep?r, 
sepse duke e b?r? Azemin Kryetar t? Komisionit Nism?tar, e duke ia p?rk?dhelur 
sedr?n, Sali Berisha e p?r?au L?vizjen Studentore n? mb?shtet?s t? Azemit e n? 
mb?shtet?s t? dikujt tjet?r. Duke par? nj? student n? krye t? opozit?s, t? 
gjith? student?t u turr?n p?r me mb?shtet? PDn? dhe kjo na d?mtoi shum?. Ne e 
dinim se Azemi ra viktim? e egoizmit t? vet dhe se ishte ??shtje kohe derisa 
k?ta ?intelektual?? ta shtrydhnin e ta hidhnin n? plehra. Gjithsesi, ne ishim t? 
vendosur ta toleronim PD-n? n? Qytetin Studenti thjesht sepse pluralizmi nuk ka 
kuptim pa partit? politike, dhe shpresa jon? ishte se gj?rat do t? sqaroheshin 
me koh?. Por instruksionet atyre ua dha tjerakush. Paradite vinin tek ne e 
mbasdite faleshin diku tjet?r dhe, me koh?, PD-ja u b? si karroca e Nastradinit.


Ju thoni se k?to ndarje u vun? re, menj?her? n? at? koh??
Dua t? ndalem pak tek kjo puna e ?et?r e bij.? N? se e mendoni literalisht, 
?bijt? e et?rve? e ?bijt? e nan?s? ishim t? gjith? shqiptar?t dhe ne student?t 
po ashtu. Shumica e student?ve i kishin prind?rit ose t? af?rmit an?tar? t? 
PPSH-s? n? t? gjitha nivelet, ashtu si edhe i kishim familjet me zemrat e 
p?rc?lluara nga t? af?rmit q? ishin pushkatuar apo t? d?nuar me afate t? gjata 
nga sistemi totalitar. P.sh. im at? ka q?n? nd?r themeluesit e PKSH-s?, i 
p?rjashtuar p?r antijugosllaviz?m n? vitin 1943, dhe m? von? pjes?risht i 
rehabilituar, dhe i l?n? me mbijetue si oficer artilerie, por un? jam rritur 
edhe me nj? nan? q? nuk iu than? syt? sepse t? v?llan? ia d?nuan nj? her? me 
vdekje e mandej me 25 vjet burg dhe e gjith? familja e saj ishte e shkat?rruar 
kulm e themel. Ashtu si revolucioni han bijt? e vet, ashtu edhe sistemi 
totalitar han njer?zit q? e ngrejn? dhe q? e mbajn? n? k?mb? dhe e b?jn? 
funksional. Ashtu ndodhi edhe n? shtetin shqiptar. Krijimi i nj? sistemi 
totalitar ?oi edhe n? krijimin e strukturave terrorizuese p?r t? gjith? n? t? 
cilat jemi rrit? gjith? dhe n? t? cilat kemi funksionue t? gjith?. Mua m? vjen 
shum? keq p?r vuajtjet q? kan? kalue t? persekutuarit gjat? koh?s s? sistemit 
totalitar dhe po ashtu me vjen shum? keq edhe p?r vuajtjet e njer?zve q? p?r me 
jetue nuk e fol?n nj? fjal? kund?r sistemit apo u p?rdor?n nga strukturat. 
Dilema me t? cil?n jemi p?rballuar t? gjith? n? at? pik? kthese historike t? 
viteve 1990-1991 ka q?n? se si me e ndryshue sistemin totalitar, si me u kthye 
n? nj? sistem demokratik, si me arrit? q? duke iu krijue mund?si t? vuajturve e 
t? persekutuarve ashtu edhe t? tjer?ve p?r me ken? t? lir?, t? mund t? krijonim 
kushtet p?r me pas? nj? fillim t? ri p?r t? gjith? shqiptar?t. Nuk ma merr 
mendja se dikush ka prit? q? un? e shum? t? tjer? si un? me d?nue me vdekje 
prind?rit e mi e familjen time p?r me iu dhan? lirin? atyre q? kishin vuajtur 
apo q? un? me u kthye n? skllavin e tyre p?r ?ka ka ndodh? n? sistemin 
totalitar. Ne nuk kemi njohur sisteme t? tjera, n? at? sistem kemi jetuar dhe 
shum? a pak t? gjith? jemi p?rdhunuar prej atij sistemi e na ka lan? vraga t? 
thella n? shpirt, na ka ba me vuejt? shum?, se ndryshe nuk do t? rebeloheshim 
por do ta mb?shtesnim pa kushte. Q?llimi i t? gjith? student?ve ka q?n? q? lufta 
e klasave dhe urrejtja e ndasit? t? b?heshin nj? pjes? e s? shkuar?s dhe t? 
gjith? t? kishim nj? fillim t? ri, mund?si t? barabarta, respekt e dinjitet para 
ligjit e para nj?ri-tjetrit. Askush nga ne nuk ka dasht? q? e shkuara t? ishte 
pengu q? do t? na linte mbrapa, edhe m? t? p?r?ar?, edhe m? t? ndar?, edhe m? t? 
pashpres? p?r t? ardhmen se sa e kishim gjetur veten n? Dhjetor t? vitit 
1990-t?. Por, n? se e mendoni figurativisht dhe me ?et?r? n?nkuptoni ?etnit 
shpirt?ror?,? d.m.th., nj? grup t? paskrupullt, arrivist e n? ndjekje t? 
pushtetit, q? nuk u ndal para asgj?je vet?m e vet?m q? t? rrinte n? pushtet, as 
para vazhdimit t? luft?s s? klasave, as para vuejtjeve t? popullit t? vet, as 
para mjerimit t? t? gjith? shqiptar?ve, at?her? p?rgjigja do t? jet? se ju keni 
t? drejt?. Nga gjarp?rinjt? nuk lindin skiftera, dhe brezi i ri q? hyri n? 
politik? mbas vitit 1990 e q? ?sht? sot n? loj?, refuzoi p?r me ndjek? ideale e 
vlera q? do ta shmangnin t? keqen q? e kishte njollosur jet?n e ?et?rve? t? tyre 
dhe me iu dhan? t? gjith?ve nj? fillim t? ri. Ata nuk e kuptuan se p?r t? 
ndrruar rrug?, duhej q? ata t? sakrifikonin gjith?ka dhe t? vinin bazat p?r 
pajtim t? mir?fillt? komb?tar e p?r krijimin e nj? shteti n? sh?rbim t? t? 
gjith? shqiptar?ve. P?r fat t? keq, ai brez q? hyri n? loj? e m?soi politik?n 
duke imituar parin? jeni?ere q? ishte p?rgatitur p?r me i sh?rbye sistemit 
kriminal t? Enver Hoxh?s, q? hyri n? partit? q? lind?n tek zyrat e Z?rit t? 
Popullit dhe me nd?rgjegje t? plot? u turr?n p?r me shtyp? e me shfryt?zue 
popullin e tyre duke krijue at? sistem kriminal q? ?sht? duke iu thar? shpirtin 
t? gjith? shqiptar?ve sot. Nga ana e jon?, lufta e L?vizjes Studentore dhe e 
gjith? shok?ve e shoqeve t? mija ka q?n? q? t? mos kishte vazhdim t? s? keqes q? 
na kishte kaplluar. Ne nuk donim nj? vazhdim t? loj?s ?et?r e bij,? ne donim nj? 
shtet demokratik t? t? gjith? shqiptar?ve e ku t? gjith? t? kishin t? drejta e 
detyra t? barabarta para ligjit. Ne besonim se duhej q? t? ndrrohej faqja e 
historis? dhe se duhej t? kishte nj? fillim t? ri p?r t? gjith? shqiptar?t, 
p?rndryshe do t? p?rjet?sonim t? keqen e vllavrasjen, luft?n e klasave dhe t? 
klaneve, dhe pse, jo edhe t? shmangnim luft?n brenda familjes ku p?r nj? 
kafshat? buk? me tep?r padiste v?lla-v?llan? e gruaja-burrin.


At?her?, si e mendonit ju n? at? koh? partin? e par? opozitare t? sapokrijuar?
At?her? synimi yn? kryesor n? strukturimin e PD-s? ka q?n? q? t? mos 
p?rjet?sonim k?t? ndarje n? et?r e bij, n? miq e armiq t? p?rjetsh?m, por t?i 
bashkonim t? gjith?, sepse nj? parti q? do t? kishte individ? nga t? gjitha 
pal?t, do t? bashkonte t? gjitha pal?t dhe k?shtu do t? krijonte ndasi t? reja 
n? shoq?ri. Ndasi kryesore n? politik?n shqiptare, simbas nesh duhej t? ishte n? 
njer?z t? ndersh?m dhe q? jetonin duke iu bindur ligjit e n? hajdut?, pusht?, 
kodosh? e kriminel? n? an?n e kund?rt t? ligjit. K?t? zgjidhje duhej ta b?nim jo 
n? em?r t? tregut t? lir? apo t? kast?s sunduese por n? em?r t? nj? vlere 
themelore q? i bashkon t? gjith? dhe t? vetmet struktura rreth t? cilave 
bashkohen t? gjith? jan? kombi e shteti. N? historin? e shqiptar?ve e vetmja 
vler? q? i ka bashkuar njer?zit, q? ju ka dh?n? shpres? e t? ardhme, q? i ka 
lidhur dhe q? i larguar nga e keqja q? iu kanosej ka q?n? nacionalizmi. Sado 
idealiste q? mund t? duket, un? e shok?t e mi e kemi propaganduar fuqish?m e me 
vet?dije t? plot? k?t? bot?kuptim n? t? gjith? veprimtarit? e L?vizjes 
Studentore. Si njer?z me k?to bindje, ne e kemi ditur pa pik? dyshimi se jemi t? 
humbur n? politik?, e kemi ditur se do t? trajtohemi si idealist? t? pandreqsh?m 
dhe se ishim jasht? loj?s. Prap? se prap? kemi q?n? shum? t? vet?dijsh?m se 
duhej dh?n? nj? shembull, se duhej b?r? gjith?ka q? ishte e mundur p?r t? 
luftuar t? keqen. Kemi q?n? t? bindur se duhej hedhur ai hap i par? n? nj? rrug? 
t? caktuar p?r t? hyr? n? nj? hulli t? t? ndryshme nga llumi ku po e zvarriste 
me q?llim popullin paria e Tiran?s e cila kishte vet?m nj? synim n? mendje; t? 
ruante kontrollin e saj mbi shtetin e mbi ekonomin?. K?shtu ne mendonim se edhe 
pse me nj? lule nuk vjen pranvera, t? gjith? t? tjerat vijn? mbas t? par?s. 
Dikush duhej me guxue. Platform?n e kishim t? gatshme sepse para nesh ishte 
Rilindja Komb?tare, vlerat e saj ishin t? ditura e na jepnin nj? shembull t? 
shk?lqyer p?r t?u ndjekur prej nesh. Pra, aspirata e L?vizjes Studentore ka q?n? 
shum? fisnike dhe n? dukje shum? jasht? koh?s kur u shpreh. Paradoksi ?sht? se 
her?t a von? ka me ardh? koha edhe e diskutimit dhe e nevoj?s s? zbatimit t? 
asaj aspirate sepse, derisa shoq?ria shqiptare ta kuptoj? se cila ?sht? rruga e 
duhur, dhe derisa ta kuptoj? se ajo rrug? kalon p?rmes bashkimit e mir?kuptimit 
e krijimit t? shtetitkomb, n? shtetin shqiptar nuk do t? ket? kurr? as paqe, as 
qet?si, as begati, as dinjitet p?r njer?zit e as stabilitet politik. Paria e 
Tiran?s ka fituar shum? beteja por ende nuk e ka fituar luft?n ideologjike me 
at? sistem vlerash. Ai sistem vlerash ?sht? i gatsh?m, jep zgjidhje e shpres? 
p?r t? ardhmen dhe ?sht? e vetmja rrug? q? mund t? shmang? vazhdimin e s? keqes. 
Por, ndarja e q?llimt? q? b?n paria e Tiran?s n? ?et?r e n? bijt? e et?rve? e 
shkat?rroi edhe nj? her? tjet?r mund?sin? e bashkimit t? shqiptar?ve, e 
p?rjet?soi edhe p?r nj? brez luft?n klanore, krahinore e fetare, dhe e ktheu 
shtetin shqiptar n? nj? fole t? krimit t? organizuar politik. P?r k?t?, 
p?rgjegj?se e padiskutueshme ?sht? paria politike e Tiran?s e t? gjitha 
ngjyrave, partive dhe parti?kave politike.


N? zgjedhjet e para pluraliste rikonfirmohen komunist?t e partis? s? pun?s dhe 
nj? vit m? pas, n? pushtet vjen partia demokratike. ?far? kujtoni nga kjo koh??
Vrasjet e 2 prillit dhe mesazhi i zymt? q? u p?rcoll me ato ndodhi m? kan? vrar? 
shum?. Personalisht kam ikur shum? i trishtuar sepse isha shum? i vet?dijsh?m se 
klasa politike ishte n? nj? nivel politik mizerab?l dhe e pazonja p?r me iu 
p?rgjigj? popullit e nevojave t? koh?s. Po ashtu, ishte e qart? se ajo nuk 
kishte pik?n e vullnetit politik p?r me investue p?r daljen nga kriza dhe se 
lufta civile ishte e pashmangshme por vet?m ??shtje kohe. Shkalla e kriz?s s? 
gjithanshme ishte e tmerrshme dhe kushdo q? e merrte pushtetin do t? p?rballej 
me detyra t? pazgjidhshme t? cilat do t? k?rkonin q? ata si individ? e si forca 
politike ose t? b?nin zgjidhjet e duhura e t? pranonin q? do t? digjeshin shum? 
shpejt, ose t? sakrifikonin popullin e tyre e t? b?heshin paria e borgjezia q? 
mbronte klanin e tyre n? kurriz t? t? gjith? shqiptar?ve t? tjer?. Nuk kisha 
pik? dyshimi q? ata do t? merrrnin rrug?n e dyt? ashtu si edhe ndodhi, dhe p?r 
k?t? kam vuajtur shum?. Por, me iu dhan? hakun, kushdo q? hynte n? politik? 
hynte si humb?s e do t? dilte si humb?s edhe m? i madh se nuk kishte m?nyra, 
koh? e mjete, p?r me i zgjidh? problemet e shumta ashtu si duhej.
N? zgjedhjet e 26 majit 1996 pati probleme t? r?nda dhe dy dit? m? pas opozita u 
rrah n? Sheshin Sk?nderbej. Si e keni p?rjetuar k?t? periudh?? Gjendjen e kam 
p?rjetuar si shum? t? r?nd? dhe e kam ndjekur me shum? v?mendje. Mbas Dejtonit, 
ishte e qart? se po i vinte rradha edhe problemit t? ??shtjes komb?tare 
shqiptare, por gjendja ishte e frikshme sepse kishte shum? interesa t? fuqishme 
q? po kryq?zoheshin n? shtetin shqiptar dhe paria ishte krejt e p?r?ar? dhe e 
pazonja p?r me iu p?rgjigj? si duhet problemeve t? koh?s, pse e motivuar nga 
interesat e veta t? ngushta ekonomike klanore dhe nga nj? etje primitive p?r me 
mbrrit? kontrollin e shtetit me ?do kusht. Prap?, p?r me i ra shkurt, p?r kriz?n 
e vitit 1997 fajtore ?sht? paria e Tiran?s e t? gjitha ngjyrave dhe partive 
politike, politike, dhe n? ve?anti, Sali Berisha, i cili nuk i respektoi 
marr?veshjet e b?ra midis pal?ve t? paris? n? fillimin e tranzicionit. Po ashtu, 
Berisha bashk? me segmentet e tjera t? paris? nuk e kuptuan gjendjen delikate t? 
shtetit shqiptar dhe vendin q? zinte n? skemat e ndryshme q? po viheshin n? 
zbatim.


Kriza e 97?, cili ?sht? opinioni juaj, pse Shqip?ria mb?rriti n? prag t? 
humner?s dhe cil?t jan? aktor?t kryesor? t? k?saj krize?
K?saj pyetjeje besoj se i kam dh?n? p?rgjigje n? librin tim. Atje ka nj? analiz? 
mjaft t? gjat? t? kriz?s s? vitit 1997 e t? proceseve politike q? i paraprin? 
asaj tragjedie e marr?zie komb?tare. Por, p?r mua po t? l?m? m?njan? interesat e 
fuqishme t? huaja, fajtori kryesor ?sht? paria politike e Tiran?s e t? gjith? 
ngjyrave q? shitet e blihet p?r kurrgj?, q? nuk e don, p?r mos me than? q? e 
p?rbuz popullin, dhe q? nuk ndalet para asgj?je kur i preken interesat e saj t? 
ngushta klanore, ekonomike e politike.


N? t? nj?jtin vit rikthehen socialist?t dhe q?ndrojn? n? pushtet p?r tet? vite. 
Si e keni p?rjetuar rikthimin e tyre q? r?ndom quheshin trash?gimtar? t? 
ish-komunist?ve shqiptar??
 Komunist? kishte shum? edhe tek PD-ja, dhe nuk ?sht? problemi se u kthyen 
komunist?t se mbas tranzicionit u pa qart? se ata nuk kishin asnj? bindje 
komuniste, por donin pushtet ekonomik e politik. Mandej, kthimi n? politik? e n? 
pushtet ?sht? nj? proces normal n? nj? demokraci, aq m? shum? kur PS-ja e 
partit? q? dol?n nga PPSH-ja kishin mb?shtetje t? ndjeshme n? popull, struktura 
t? konsoliduara dhe nj? grup cil?sor zyrtar?sh e specialist?sh q? e dinin se si 
funksionon shteti. Me than? t? drejt?n, shum? nga k?to specialist? q? iu ngjit?n 
PS-s? e q? u hoq?n nga puna nq? vitet 1992, duhej t? kishin mbetur n? vendet e 
tyre se ata ishin investimi m? i ?muesh?m q? ishte b?r? n? t? shkuar?n e af?rt 
dhe ata duhej t? ishin trajtuar me respekt si n?pun?s e sh?rbyes publik? e jo t? 
detyroheshin q? t? shisnin banane e misra rrug?ve t? Tiran?s. Kthimi i tyre n? 
pushtet ishte vet?m ??shtje kohe dhe at?her?, po t? ndodhte si duhej, do t? 
ishte shenja m? e mir? se demokracia po funksionon, anipse si marr?veshje e 
paris? e jo si shprehje e vullnetit t? mir?fillt? t? popullit. Por, si edhe e 
kam analizuar n? librin tim, kriza e vitit 1997 ?sht? njolla m? e zez? p?r 
parin? politike shqiptare t? t? gjitha ngjyrave, si p?r ata ?blue? edhe p?r k?to 
t? partis? ?pink? apo roz?. Problemi i t? gjith?ve fillonte me m?nyr?n se si e 
lan? veten p?r me u p?rdorue nga interesa t? caktuara, se si erdh?n n? pushtet, 
?ka vendos?n p?r me ba, kur erdh?n n? pushtet, si u tall?n me popullin e vet, 
dhe se kujt vendos?n me i sh?rbye. Fatos Nano, Pandeli Majko, Ilir Meta, 
triumvirati i djesh?m i socialist?ve edhe pse e riktheu vendin n? normalitet, 
shkaktoi megjithat? mjaft probleme. Konsideratat tuaja p?r ta dhe gjith? 
tet?vje?arin roz? t? socialist?ve n? pushtet. N? vitin 1990, Fatos Nano ishte 
ekonomisti m? i mir? q? kishte shteti shqiptar n? at? pik? kritike. Po t? vinte 
n? PD n? fillim, ashtu si disa prej nesh besonin se do t? ndodhte se ai kishte 
dh?n? intervist? tek Z?ri i Amerik?s, ishte pedagog, pjes? e ?trojk?s? ekonomike 
ramiziane, etj., ai do t? g?zonte shum? m? mb?shtetje se Gramoz Pashko apo edhe 
se gjith? t? tjer?t q? erdh?n n? PD t? marr? bashk?. Nano dukej se ishte njeriu 
q? duhej n? at? pik?; me p?rgatitje t? shk?lqyer profesionale, me mend?si 
shtetari, i zgjuar, me kuptim t? qart? t? m?nyr?s s? funksionimit t? 
institucioneve e t? ekonomis? dhe jo pa nj? pik? karakteri si disa t? tjer? q? 
erdh?n n? PD. Por Ramiz Alia e Spiro Dede, kur i ndan? detyrat, desh?n ta ruanin 
Nanon p?r PS-n?. Se si hyri ai n? burg e se kush e futi, k?t? duhet t? na e 
thot? Sali Berisha e disa nga drejtuesit e at?hersh?m t? PS-s?, por nuk kishte 
dyshim se n? disa takime Nano kishte shfaqur ndjenja patriotike e opinione t? 
papranueshme dhe se kjo ia prishte planet edhe dikujt q? e mbante me rroga edhe 
PS-n?. M? von?, mbas burgut, Fatos Nano ?sht? transformuar ndoshta n? figur?n m? 
t? err?t e m? t? ndyr? n? politik?n shqiptare. Mbas daljes nga burgu, Nano u 
sprovua t? ishte njeri i korruptuar, politikan q? personalizoi shtetin, 
korruptoi edhe shum? t? tjer?, e d?mtoi r?ndsh?m ??shtjen komb?tare, e zvet?noi 
administrat?n shtet?rore, e ndau shtetin shqiptar n? disa kantone me zhvillim t? 
pabarabart?, iu sh?rbeu interesave joshqiptare dhe manifestoi vet?m ambicjen p?r 
me sundue vet?, dhe pse jo, si person, ai shfaqi vese t? frikshme e t? 
pak?ndshme. Nga ana e vet, pavar?sisht t? metave t? tij si individ e si 
politikan q? jan? t? shumta e q? dihen mir?, Ilir Meta ka dh?n? prova se din t? 
punoj? me struktura, se i drejton shum? mir? ato struktura, dhe se din t? marr? 
vendime. Por, pavar?sisht arritjeve, dhe ka pasur arritje n? disa drejtime, 
gjykimi q? mund t? jepet p?r tet? vjet?t e drejtimit t? shtetit nga PS-ja ?sht? 
shum? i zymt?, sepse ato nuk b?n? at? q? duhej b?r?, se ishin e se mbet?n n? 
sh?rbim t? interesave t? huaja, se e p?r?an? popullin edhe m? shum? se sa ishte, 
se e ndan? vendin politikisht n? tosk? e n? geg?, se e humb?n shansin historik 
p?r me nd?rtue e me mbrrit? zhvillimin komb?tar me burimet q? kishim n? nivelin 
e mundsh?m, se u b?n? penges? kryesore n? zgjidhjen e duhur t? ??shtjes 
komb?tare shqiptare, se nuk lejuan krijimin e nj? shteti t? past?r ligjor e t? 
strukturave t? pakorruotueshme q? do t?u sh?rbenin t? gjith?ve por e 
personalizuan shtetin dhe jo m? e fundit, sepse e korruptuan dhe e zvet?nuan 
edhe brezin e ri q? hyri n? loj? e q? mund t? ishte brezi i kthes?s por q? u 
p?rdorue kaq keq sa pa frik? mund t? thuhet se ?sht? brezi i vazhdim?sis? s? 
jeni?er?ve t? PS-s?.




Shinasi Rama, nj? nga Nism?tar?t e themelimit t? partis? Demokratike n? 
Dhjetorin ?90 tregoi dje n? Gazet?n Shqiptare at? zinxhir ngjarjesh dhe 
personazhesh t? cil?t mund?suan krijimin e partis? s? par? opozitare n? vend. Ai 
d?shmon p?r dhe dyshimet e tij t? para p?r intelektual?t q? ju bashkuan L?vizjes 
studentore dhe krijimin e PD-s?. Sipas tij, n? at? periudh? kur pluralizmi 
politik ishte b?r? fakt, n? krye t? forcave politike t? krijuara apo n? krijim e 
sip?r, do t? vinin figura t? parazgjedhura. Madje ai pretendon edhe se n? at? 
koh?, Fatos Nano do t? ishte shum? m? i pranuesh?m se Sali Berisha p?r drejtimin 
e t? djatht?ve. Sot, do t? lexoni kosnsideratat e tij p?r rikthimin n? pushtet 
t? zotit Sali Berisha. Dyshimet p?r at? ?ka ndodhi n? zgjedhjet e korrikut 2005 
dhe roli i faktorit nd?rkomb?tar n? krijimin e qeveris? s? sotme. Presidenti i 
Republik?s, Kryeprokurori dhe marr?dh?niet e tyre me ekzekutivin e zotit 
Berisha; kreu i ri i socialist?ve Edi Rama, rebusi i zgjedhjeve t? pritshme 
lokale dhe ndikimi i rezultatit t? tyre n? politik?n e nes?rme n? vend.
Vet? Shinasi Rama thot? se do t? rikthehet s?rish n? Shqip?ri, por ndruhet se 
mbijetesa n? Shqip?rin? politike ?sht? tep?r e v?shtir?, n? rastin e zgjedhjes 
s? t? jetuarit t? nj? jete t? ndershme.


N? mes t? mandatit t? tyre t? dyt?, President i vendit b?het ish-ushtaraku 
Alfred Moisiu, sot n? qend?r t? kritikave kryesisht nga doktor Berisha e t? 
tijt?. Si e vler?soni rolin e tij?
Presidenti Moisiu ka pasur disa k?shilltar? shum? t? mir? dhe k?ta e kan? 
ndihmuar q? t? luaj? nj? rol shum? m? me pesh? si president se sa e ka t? 
p?rkufizuar edhe Kushtetuta e shtetit shqiptar. Pavar?sisht, kufizimeve q? nuk i 
lejojn? shum? hap?sir? veprimi si dhe t? problemeve q? ka pasur, n? nj? pik? 
Moisiu ?sht? treguar shembullor. Duket se ai nuk ka luajtur si t? tjer?t me 
??shtjen shqiptare. edhe n? takime delikate, Moisiu ka th?n? at? q? ka menduar 
p?r problemin komb?tar shqiptar edhe kur t? tjer?t luanin lojra t? ndyra.


Vitin e kaluar n? pushtet rikthehet Berisha. E prisnit nj? gj? t? till??
P?r fat t? keq, n? nj? intervist? q? kam dh?n? para zgjedhjeve t? Korrikut 2005, 
e pata parapar? se marr?veshja midis pal?ve t? paris? po funksiononte si duhet, 
dhe se me sa dukej Sali Berisha kishte mund?si q? t? fitonte zgjedhjet, edhe pse 
mendoja, se t? huajt nuk do ta pranonin dhe kjo do t? ishte nj? penges? jo e 
vog?l p?r ruajtjen e stabilitetit t? shtetit shqiptar. Kjo mund?si e fitimit t? 
zgjedhjeve u ba edhe m? e qart? mbas intervist?s q? Berisha i dha Der Spiegel 
kur ai i dha publikisht garancit? q? duheshin p?r disa drejtues t? at?hersh?m t? 
shtetit. Mbas fushat?s mizerab?l t? PS-s?, u binda qe me t? v?rtet? Sali Berisha 
edhe mund t? fitonte zgjedhjet. Berisha i vuri Nanos si kund?rshtar Besnik 
Aliajn q? nuk e njihte kush, e Nano i vuri si kund?rshtar Berish?s nj? k?ng?tar 
opere; po t? donin me luftue kund?r nj?ri-tjetrit, ata e dinin mir? se cila 
ishte rruga, por nuk kishin k?t? q?llim. K?tu hyn edhe sjellja e ?uditshme e 
Nanos, q? me than? t? drejt?n ishte t?r?sisht jasht? sjelljes e praktikave t? 
tij. Praktikisht, Nano, jo vet?m q? ia la loj?n politike t? vendit Berish?s q? 
ta fitonte (sepse u mor vet?m me LSI-n?, me 1997-n e me vet? Berish?n), por ai 
nd?rmori hapa q? i alarmuan e shqet?suan shum? nd?rkomb?tar?t, sidomos kur 
ngriti problemin e ??shtjes komb?tare shqiptare dhe k?rc?noi se ai do t? punonte 
p?r ta zgjidhur at? problem. K?shtu, thuajse brenda nat?s, Berisha, q? tregoi 
zot?si t? madhe politike duke e mbajtur bashk? nj? koalicion parti?kash e 
individ?sh q? nuk lidhen kurrkund ve?se mbas kulet?s s? vet, u b? nj? 
alternativ? e mundshme, ndon?se aspak e p?lqyeshme p?r t? huajt q? mezi e kishin 
hequr nga posti i presidentit n? vitin 1997. Mendoj se Berisha vet? nuk ishte i 
interesuar per me i fitue zgjedhjet sepse ai e dinte mir? q? n? shtetin shqiptar 
u b? nj? luft? civile p?r ta hequr at? e PD-n? nga pushteti dhe ai thjesht donte 
t? mbeste n? kontroll t? opozit?s, d.m.th. t? shkonte n? buz? t? fitores dhe 
mandej t?ia linte fajin t? tjer?ve p?r humbjen e pritshme.


Mendoni se ekziston nj? komponente nd?rkomb?tare n? at? ?ka ndodhi para dhe mbas 
tre korrikut 2005 n? Shqip?ri?
N? nj? shtet si shteti shqiptar i cili e ka sovranitetin shum? t? kufizuar, 
pesha e fuqive t? interesuara ?sht? shum?, shum? e madhe, p?r mos me than? 
vendimtare dhe fitimi i zgjedhjeve i krijoi Berish?s m? shum? probleme se sa 
mund?si p?r qeverisje. Nd?rsa fitimi i zgjedhjeve ishte hapi i par?, momenti m? 
i v?shtir? ishte mund?sia e mospranimit nga ana e bashk?sis? nd?rkomb?tare e 
kthimit t? Sali Berish?s n? pushtet. P?r dy muaj, politikisht shum? t? gjat?, 
ambasadat e vendeve q? kan? pesh? n? shtetin shqiptar as nuk i njoh?n zgjedhjet 
e as nuk e njoh?n rezultatin dhe as nuk fol?n fare p?r at? pun?, ?ka ishte tep?r 
shqet?suese n? ?do drejtim. U desh?n disa takime t? Fatos Nanos brenda e jasht? 
vendit e takimet dy her? n? jav? midis Berish?s, Jozefina Topallit e disa 
p?rfaq?suesve t? huaj t? caktuar p?r t?i bindur ata se mund ta pranonin Berish?n 
si kryeminist?r. Mir?po, cili ishte ?mimi?


Si e vler?soni qeverisjen e tij n? k?t? ?erek mandati?
Tre jav? mbas zgjedhjeve un? p?rgatita nj? analiz? t? vendit q? k?to zgjedhje 
z?n? n? procesin e tranzicionit si dhe analizova problemet e mundshme t? 
qeverisjes s? PD-s?, dhe kjo analiz? ?sht? e p?rfshir? n? librin tim. N? thelb 
un? identifikova shtat? probleme themelore q? do ta b?nin qeverisjen e PD-s? 
krejt?sisht inefektive dhe p?r k?t? shkak, simbas mendimit tim, shqiptar?t do t? 
humbnin edhe disa vite t? tjera. S? pari, programi i qeverisjes s? PD-s? ishte 
shum? ambicioz dhe i parealizuesh?m. S? dyti, qeveria e PD-s? do t? mbushte 
administrat?n me militant?, se nuk do t? ruante pavar?sin? e administrat?s, dhe 
se kjo sjellje e pritshme do t? krijonte shqet?sime t? m?dha. S? treti, 
koalicioni i PD-s? ?sht? shum? i paq?ndruesh?m dhe me individ? q? jan? si t? 
korruptuar ashtu si edhe i shitblehen me ?mim t? caktuar bler?sit m? t? par?. S? 
kat?rti, PD-ja nuk do t? prekte kupol?n kriminale t? Nanos, Angjelit e me 
rradh?, pra, do t? legjitimonte pasurimin e t? korruptuarve t? v?rtet? e t? 
korruptuesve. S? pesti, problemi m? i r?nd?sish?m ?sht? ai i ??shtjes komb?tare 
shqiptare dhe k?tu parashihja se qeveria e PD-s? do t? b?j? l?shime t? m?dha si 
n? jugun e shtetit shqiptar ashtu edhe n? lidhje me Kosov?n, ?ka mund ta d?mtoj? 
keqazi ??shtjen komb?tare shqiptare. S? gjashti, jan? politikat ekonomike e 
sociale q? jan? propozuar e q? nuk ishin t? realizueshme pse vendi dhe ekonomia 
ka nevoj? p?r mbrojtje e jo p?r eksperimente ekonomike q? po i d?mtojn? 
interesat e t? gjith? shqiptar?ve. M? s? fundi, kam ngritur si problem sjelljen 
e karanterin e Sali Berish?s duke sugjeruar se mund t? b?het nj? penges? e madhe 
n? realizimin e objektivave q? duhet t? arrihen e q? nuk ?sht? e v?shtir? t? 
p?rcaktohen qart?. N? k?t? pik?, opinioni im p?r qeverisjen e PD-s? dhe t? Sali 
Berish?s ?sht? se ka pasur arritje, n? disa drejtime shum? t? mira, por edhe se 
ka pasur edhe m? shum? fushata boshe, probleme e eufori, sepse asnj? nga 
problemet q? u p?rmend?n me lart nuk e kan? marr? zgjidhjen e duhur.


Besoni se ish-kryetari i par? i PD-s?, ish-presidenti dhe kryeministri Berisha 
ka ndryshuar?
Un? nuk mendoj se Sali Berisha ka ndryshuar ashtu si? nuk kan? ndryshuar as t? 
tjer?t. Nj? pari q? ?sht? p?rgatitur p?r me i sh?rbye nj? sistemi kriminal, q? 
nuk ndrron rrug?, por q? krijon nj? sistem t? st?rkorruptuar e kriminal, nuk 
mund t? sillet ndryshe, p?rve?se si kriminale. N? politik?n shqiptare njer?zit 
jan? si gjarp?ri, ?do vit nd?rrojn? l?kur?n, por jo helmin. Tash n? lidhje me 
Sali Berish?n, e v?rteta ?sht? se un? mendoj se ai ka ndryshuar p?r m? keq dhe 
p?r k?t? gj? nuk m? vjen aspak mire sepse ai ka nj? rol kryesor n? politik?n e 
sotme shqiptare. Para s? gjithash, Berisha ka probleme shqet?suese me veten e 
vet, sepse e ka shum? t? zhvilluar mosbesimin tek gjith? t? tjer?t. Krizat 
politike t? nj?pasnj?shme q? ka kaluar n? k?to vite shum? t? v?shtira edhe p?r 
t?, ia kan? kthyer k?t? sjellje mosbesuese gati n? paranoj? fikse dhe kjo e 
pengon p?r me pa qart? e me kthjellt?sin? e duhur. Kur nuk ?sht? euforik, 
Berisha ?sht? shum? i pasigurt?, edhe n? vetvete, dhe kjo shihet si nga sjellja 
e tij n? Kuvendin Popullor, ashtu edhe tek nevoja p?r fushata e populiz?m, tek 
shtysat e tij p?r t? q?n? gjithnj? n? krye t? vendit, p?r t? q?n? i pari dhe i 
paz?vend?sueshmi gjithkund e n? ?do proces. Por, Berisha nuk ka shum? zgjidhje. 
P?r shkak t? s? shkuar?s s? tij t? err?t, si dhe t? p?rgjegj?sive t? m?dha q? ai 
ka marr? para shqiptar?ve, ai e ka d?nuar veten q? mos me mund? p?r me u ndal? 
kurr? m? e p?r mos me dal? kurr? m? prej loj?s politike. Po nuk diti p?r me i 
zgjidh? problemet e veta ashtu si duhet, dhe shihet se ai nuk po din se si me i 
zgjidh? ato probleme, ato p?rgjegj?si q? ai i mban n? kurriz, do ta ndjekin si 
t? gjall? ashtu edhe t? vdekur. Ky ?sht? nj? problem p?r t? gjith? shqiptar?t 
sepse Berisha do t? synoj? gjithnj? t? mbaj? peng PD-n? e t? jet? flamurtari i 
p?rjetsh?m i luft?s kund?r komunist?ve, ashtu si edhe Nano do t? luftoj? t? 
mbaj? peng PS-n?. Po nuk u zgjidh kjo nyj? nuk ka t? ardhme p?r shqiptar?t.


N? Shqip?ri, nga kritik?t e tij, flitet shum? p?r p?rpjekjet e Kryeministrit p?r 
uzurpim t? pushteteve dhe p?rq?ndrim t? tyre n? dor?n e tij, p?r nepotiz?m, 
krahinaliz?m. Cili ?sht? komenti juaj?
Parimi i loj?s politike ?sht? se atje ku nuk ka shtet ligjor ka klane, banda, 
hordhi e tribu q? kontrollojn? shtetin. P?rq?ndrimi i pushteteve, nepotizmi dhe 
krahinalizmi jan? tre gj?ra t? ndryshme. Sali Berisha ka luftuar q? t? 
p?rq?ndroj? pushtetet n? dor?n e tij, sepse ashtu din ai p?r me punue, nuk din 
ndryshe. Por, edhe pse n? raste t? caktuara nuk ka mundur t?i shp?toj? k?tij 
problemi, ai ka treguar shum? kujdes p?r mos me ra pre e krahinalizmit. N?se 
?sht? p?r t?u folur p?r krahinaliz?m e nepotiz?m, shembulli m? i mir? ?sht? 
PS-ja q? b?ri disa qeveri pa gjetur nj? shqiptar geg? p?r me e ba minist?r, dhe 
ku kishte nj? fshat si Salaria e Tepelen?s q? kishte m? shum? qeveritar? ne 
qeverin? e Fatos Nanos se sa nj? qytet i madh si Shkodra. ?sht? PS-ja q? e ndau 
vendin me thik?, q? i shtyu tosk?t kund?r geg?ve, dhe q? e b?ri nepotizmin 
norm?n e pun?simit gjat? koh?s q? shteti drejtohej prej tyre. Gjate koh?s s? 
sundimit t? Fatos Nanos, shteti ishte i sunduar hapur e pa m?dyshje nga 
shqiptar?t e jugut e nga minoritetet. Tash, kthimi i shum? shqiptar?ve t? veriut 
n? pun? t? shtetit nga PD-ja eshte me shum? balancim se sa krahinaliz?m.
N? lidhje me nepotizmin, duhet th?n? se nga ana e Berish?s ka nj? p?rpjekje p?r 
t? krijuar nj? struktur? nepotike n? PD me kuadro besnik? t? tij. Ajo qe po b?n 
Berisha ?sht? se ai po rreket me t? gjith? forcat q? t? gjej? e t? krijoj? 
kuadro besnike t? tij, t? cilat, kur t? vij? koha e daljes se tij prej loj?s, t? 
jen? t? gatshme q? ta mbrojn? e q? ai mund t?u lej? edhe PD-n?. Mir?po edhe n? 
PD, ashtu si n? PS, t? gjith? e kan? nj? ?mim dhe Saliu e din k?t?, sepse ai 
vet? i ka bler? figurat e PD-s? me at? ?mim q? kishin. K?shtu si jane punet n? 
PD, as Topi, as Olldashi e as Topalli nuk mund ta mbrojn?, sepse t? gjith? kan? 
interesa te vetat dhe kur t? vij? koha do ta sakrifikojn?. Perpjekja e tij p?r 
t? marr? n? loj? individ? q? pa t? jan? ?zero? politike e p?r t?i ngritur n? 
loj?, n? m?nyr? q? gjithnj? t? ken? nevoj? p?r t? e p?r hijen e tij, mund t? 
ket? sukses por, rregulli ?sht? se t? gjith? manar?t e paris? politike t? 
Tiran?s shkojn? tek dora q? ?sht? e mbushur me krip?.


Nj? tem? e nxeht? n? Shqip?ri ?sht? dhe p?rpjekja p?r t? larguar Kryeprokurorin 
edhe mbas dekretit refuzues t? Presidentit. Si do ta gjykonit nj? hap t? till? 
t? maxhoranc?s qeveris?se?
Mua m? duket se t? gjitha pal?t e paris? e kan? marr? nj? mesazh t? qart? nga 
nd?rkomb?tar?t, t? cil?ve ato kan? premtuar q? do t?ju binden, nj? mesazh q? 
?sht? p?rs?ritur rregullisht e me koherenc?. T? mos harrojm?, paria shahen e 
grinden, por loj?n e b?jn? t? huajt, ata q? kan? pesh?, kuptohet. Mir?po, edhe 
pse n? shtetin shqiptar, dit?lindja e qenit t? sekretarit t? tret? t? ambasad?s 
s? nj? shteti aziatik ?sht? m? e r?nd?sishme se zgjidhja e nevojave t? 
shqiptar?ve, kur iu jan? prekur interesat e tyre t? ngushta, paria e Tiran?s ka 
ditur t? tregoj? se ajo din t? kund?rshtoj? edhe t? huajt. T?i japim hakun Sali 
Berish?s, Prokurori i P?rgjithsh?m, Theodhori Sollaku, nuk e ka levizur gishtin 
per te luftuar korrupsionin e krimin e politikan?ve gjat? koh?s q? Fatos Nano e 
Partia Socialiste ishin n? pushtet. Lista e krimeve q? u paraqit n? Kuvend nga 
PD-ja ?sht? m? shum? se bind?se; ajo ishte trondit?se. Por, nj? nga problemet e 
Sali Berish?s me Sollakun ?sht? se ai e sheh k?t? problem edhe si kryq?zat? 
personale; Saliu nuk i fal individ?t q? e lan? n? balt?, ve?an?risht mbas vitit 
1997. Megjithat?, duhet th?n? se, n? k?t? pik?, ?sht? Berisha vet?, i cili nuk 
duket i interesuar p?r t? luftuar krimin e p?r t? luftuar politikan?t kriminel? 
ashtu si duhet. Heqja e z?vend?simi i Sollakut nuk jan? e vetmja rrug? p?r t? 
zgjidhur problemet e korrupsionit t? klas?s politike. P?r shembull, Sali Berisha 
ka th?n? se i ka dosjet e krimit t? PS-s? n? PD. At?her?, le t?i ?oj? Berisha 
edhe nj? her? dosjet e Fatos Nanos, t? Sk?nder Gjinushit, t? Anastas Angjelit, 
t? Arben Duk?s e t? Shyqyri Durakut n? Prokurorin? e P?rgjithshme dhe n? 
Komisonin e Etik?s t? Kuvendit Popullor. Po qe se Sollaku nuk i ndjek ato akuza, 
at?her? jo vet?m q? duhet hequr, por edhe, simbas ligjeve ekzistuese, ai duhet 
arrestuar si mbrojt?s i krimit. Mir?po, duket sikur Sali Berisha ka nevoj? edhe 
p?r nj? argument q? t? thoj? se Theodhori Sollaku e Presidenti Moisiu nuk po m? 
l?n? q? t? b?j luft?n kund?r krimit q? dua un?, e prandaj fajin e kan? k?ta q? 
nuk e fus Nanon n? burg. K?shtu, nd?rsa n? shtyp e n? media vazhdon katrahura e 
zallamahia p?r Sollakun, t? shoqen e pronat e tyre, realisht n? Tiran? nuk ndodh 
asgj?, askujt nuk i hyn ferr? n? k?mb?, n? Kuvendin Popullor vazhdon cirku 
politik, dhe, si pasoj?, ruhen ekuilibret e marr?veshjet politike midis pal?ve 
me pesh? t? paris? s? Tiran?s.


P?rball? Berish?s kund?rshtari kryesor ?sht? Edi Rama, lider i PS-s? dhe 
opozit?s tashm? t? bashkuar. Jeni njohur me zotin Rama dhe si e mendoni rolin e 
tij n? politik?n e sotme?
Roli i Edi Ram?s ?sht? shum? delikat dhe fati i tij varet shum? nga zgjedhjet e 
pritshme vendore. N? politik?, njer?zit lidhen p?r vlera ose p?r interesa. Me 
sjelljen e tij n? t? shkuar?n e af?rt Edi Rama ka treguar se ai nuk ka ideologji 
e vlera p?r t? cilat ka hyr? n? politik? e p?r t? cilat q?ndron n? politik?. N? 
lidhje me interesat, atje ?sht? hapur shum? oreksi i interesave dhe mund?sit? e 
tij p?r me nda favore majtas e djathtas, nuk jan? ato q? kishte Fatos Nano kur 
ishte kryeminist?r. Mund?sit? e Edi Ram?s jan? t? kufizuara tek nj? leje q? 
jepet me nd?rtue pallat pa leje e me rradh?. Mandej ai pranoi t? merrte n? dor? 
nj? parti pa kurrfar? vlerash morale, t? st?rkorruptuar e t? kriminalizuar, q? 
gjat? tet? viteve t? kaluara u kthye n? nj? ort? jeni?er?sh t? m?suar q? t? 
thith? nga buxheti i shtetit dhe q? doli e humbur nga zgjedhjet. P?r m? tep?r, 
PS e ka nj? shtab hije q?, nj? e dy, do t?i kujtoj? atij e t? tjer?ve si 
metafor? e paaft?sis? s? tij t? sprovuar, t? shkuar?n e tij n? Franc?. Problem 
tjet?r i madh p?r Edi Ram?n ?sht? se strukturat e partis?, edhe kur nuk iu jan? 
besnike individ?ve t? tjer?, ato jan? t? kontrollueshme prej tyre. Gjat? viteve 
t? kaluara, Nano e disa t? tjer? i trajtuan ?kuadrot? e PD-s? si matrapaz? dhe i 
blen? shum? lir? kur ata ishin n? pushtet. Nga ana e vet, Edi Rama nuk arriti q? 
t? krijonte besnik?rin? e duhur tek strukturat e partis? s? tij. Edhe tashti, ai 
nuk ka arritur q? t?i jap? asaj drejtim si duhet. K?shtu, ai po k?rkon q? t?i 
z?vend?soj? ato kuadro drejtuese me ngut, por Fatos Nano, Gramoz Ru?i e disa t? 
tjer? q? kontrollojn? ?kasketat,? i kan? p?rzgjedhur deputet?t e kuadrot si 
manar?t. Jan? k?ta individ?t q? do t? marrin vendime n? PS deri n? zgjedhjet e 
tjera, dhe k?to ?kuadro? iu detyrohen shum? Nanos, Ru?it e disa t? tjer?ve. 
Neveria q? ndjejn? e q? shprehin sot p?r Fatosin, i cili i trajtoi pa doreza e 
si xhambaz, do t? zbehet kur ai t? nxjerr? letrat q? ka p?r to e t? b?j? pazaret 
p?r mb?shtetjen e tyre dhe Fatosi deri-diku e mban fjal?n. Koha do t? tregoj? se 
kush ?sht? me Edi Ram?n e kush ?sht? kund?r tij n? PS, dhe kjo koh? po afrohet 
shum? shpejt. Por, ai nuk ?sht? n? nj? pozit? t? lakmueshme politike, edhe pse 
t? gjith? jan? gati t? luajn? me dosjen e tij q? thuhet se ?sht? e mbushur deng 
me afera korruptive e me gjithfar? pikash t? dob?ta, dhe q? mund t? shkoj? shum? 
leht? nga Saliu tek Fatosi e anasjelltas.


Shqip?ria ?sht? n? prag t? zgjedhjeve lokale, t? cilat konsiderohen si nj? 
tjet?r test p?r demokracin? shqiptare. Si e paramendoni ju rezultatin dhe 
var?sisht atij, ?far? konsekuencash do t? ken? ato n? politik?n e sotme 
shqiptare?
Gjith?ka varet nga rezultati i zgjedhjeve, q? ?sht? her?t p?r ta parashikuar, 
sepse nuk dihet se si do t? ec? procesi e ?far? pengesash do t? dalin, pra, ende 
nuk po merret vesh qart? n? se do t? kemi zgjedhje dhe n? se k?to zgjedhje do t? 
kontestohen pa u zhvilluar a jo. Por, gjithsesi, kur t? mbahen, n?se do t? 
mbahen n? koh?n e duhur e nuk do t? shtyhen deri n? afatin e zgjedhjes s? 
presidentit, k?to zgjedhje vendore do t? tregojn? n? se do t? kemi zgjedhje t? 
parakohshme e si do t? strukturohen forcat politike kur t? mbaroj? mandati i 
presidentit Moisiu. Nga ana e tij, Saliut i duhen zgjedhjet vendore. Po t? 
fitoj? PD-ja nj? p?rqindje t? mir? votash n? nivel vendi si dhe po t? fitoj? 
edhe bashkin? e Tiran?s, at?her?, Saliu nuk do t? ket? m? frik? nga zgjedhjet e 
parakohshme kur t? vij? kriza e pritshme p?r zgjedhjen e presidentit. Ai mendon 
se ka t? ngjar? t? ndodh? k?shtu dhe prandaj n? buxhetin e shtetit, ia ka rritur 
fondin bashkis? s? Tiran?s, por edhe nj? mesazh q? po fitoi Edi Rama e ka nj? 
let?r me shum?. Duke pasur nj? num?r t? mir? votash e mb?shtetje n? elektorat, 
ai mund t? llogaris? q? ?koalicioni? i shumic?s, d.m.th. shporta e karavidheve 
politike q? e mbajn? varur n? aj?r mandatin e tij e q? po e b?jn? shum? nervoz, 
mund t? ket? nevoj? p?r nj? prov? elektorale. K?shtu, sa t? humbin n? zgjedhjet, 
parti?kat e vogla do t? treten e do t? ridimensionohen, dhe koalicioni i PD-s? 
do t? fitoj? nj? ekuilib?r t? ri p?rbrenda tij. Mandej Saliu t? jet? shum? m? i 
qet? p?r mandatin e p?r t? ardhmen e tij dhe p?r zbatimin e mar?veshjeve me 
pal?n tjet?r. Nga ana e PS-s?, gjendja e saj ?sht? shum? kritike dhe interesi i 
Edi Ram?s ?sht? t? shtyj? zgjedhjet vendore deri sa t? vij? koha kur duhet 
zgjedhur presidenti. Po t? mbahen zgjedhjet n? Dhjetor, po t? fitoj? Edi Rama n? 
Tiran? dhe po t? ket? sadopak rritje n? num?r t? votave t? marra, at?her? Edi 
Rama prap?seprap? duhet t? b?j? zgjidhjen e v?shtir? e p?r t? t? pamundur p?r 
presidentin. Kjo do t? thot? se Edi Rama duhet t? gjej? gjuh?n me Fatos Nanon e 
me dosjen e vet q? ia tundin para hund?s si Saliu ashtu edhe Fatosi. Gjithsesi 
ai ka edhe disa muaj p?r t? ndikuar n? strukturat e PS-s? dhe p?r me luftue e me 
balancue kthimin e pashmangsh?m n? politik?n e ?lart?? t? Fatos Nanos dhe 
ofensiv?n e tij t? pritshme t? katarsisit q? Nano mendon se do ta detyroj? PS-n? 
e Edi Ram?n q? ta mb?shtesin q? t? b?het president, se prandaj po ia tund 
?l?vizjen e katarsisit? tek hund?t. P?rndryshe, Nano at?her? mund t? pres? a t? 
veproj? q? Saliu t? luaj? me dosjen e Edi Ram?s dhe gjendja n? PS prap? do t? 
b?het kritike, se atje, kryetari e ?nj?shi? ?sht? ai q? t? mbush xhepin dhe 
Nano, edhe si president me kompetenca t? kufizuara, din se si ta luaj? loj?n, si 
me Berish?n ashtu dhe me ?kuadrot?e PS-s?.

Fund 




From ngahalli at yahoo.com  Thu Nov  9 03:25:10 2006
From: ngahalli at yahoo.com (Pseudonim NgaHalli)
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2006 00:25:10 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [AlbClub] Balonat e kabulit
In-Reply-To: <C177B5B9.1F17%ulyssed@wanadoo.fr>
Message-ID: <823250.66732.qm@web51508.mail.yahoo.com>

Me mbeten syte tek fundi i rreshtit te fundit. Shikoja me ngulm zbrazetine qe vijonte, thua do te dilte dicka...
   
  Faleminderit ULYSSE. 
  Po te mos ishte teper egoiste, gati gati e pacipe nga ana ime, do te te uroja qe gripi te te mbante edhe ca kohe me shume :-)!
   
  Por jo, te uroj shendet. Sidoqofte, ti nuk do ta lesh me kaq kete perkthim, apo jo?
   
  Pershendetje
  D.
  

Ulysse <ulyssed at wanadoo.fr> wrote:
  *** AlbClub Discussion List ***



Duke pare qe shkrimi i bashkengjitur nuk eshte ngjitur, po e dergoj perseri.

Ju kerkoj ndjese
YD

www.AlbClub.com
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From ngahalli at yahoo.com  Thu Nov  9 03:45:19 2006
From: ngahalli at yahoo.com (Pseudonim NgaHalli)
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2006 00:45:19 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [AlbClub] Trishtimi i Kadarese
In-Reply-To: <e17e70530611081948y33b21faey5bbbfae87fc8595e@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <820702.30191.qm@web51506.mail.yahoo.com>

E degjova edhe une tek Topi-i Ismailin teksa e shpallte Rexhep Qosen "te semure mendor qe duhet te shkoje ne psikiatri" Madje tha se duke i treguar rrugen e psikiatrise i bente nder, pasi vetem duke shpallur cmendurine e vet, ai (Qosja) mund te shfajesohej perpara botes per ato qe i kishte shkruar Ismailit !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
   
  Isha bashke me tim ate perballe TV. Une nuk fola - bluaja nder mend mesazhe albklubase, por degjova babin qe neper dhembe, me trishtim tha: "Mosha beri te veten edhe per Ismailin".
   
  Vetem disa minuta me pas pashe po aty njoftimin se emisioni i rradhes "TOP STORY" i Sokol Balles do te zhbironte (per te n here) enigmen e familjes Rrapi (Janulla & Renato).
  Nuk me erdhi mire. Cilido qofte Ismaili, duke baltosur ate, ne harrojme se baltosim edhe  dimensionin e tij "Kadare". 
  Kopuke, karektereshprishur, te shthurur e pijanece kane qene me dhjetra figura madhore te artit boteror (Balzaku, Bethoveni, Pushkimi, Heminguej, Xhek London, Fredi Mercuri, sa per te permendur nja dy), po kujt i behet vone. 
  I adhurojme per artin qe ne dhuruan - nuk mund ti shajme sepse ... nuk dinin te gatuanin trahana.
   
  NgaHalli
   
  

Ina Dushku <ina.dushku at gmail.com> wrote:
  *** AlbClub Discussion List ***



Por qe te quash Qosen te semure mendor e te cilesosh tolerancen fetare ne Shqiperi si model te percjelle nga gjenetika eshte nje budallallek i madh, gjithmone duke perjashtuar mundesine qe gazetaret e Top Channel-it t'ja kene futur kot citimeve. Perfundimisht nuk dua te merrem me Kadarene per ca kohe, madje rrezik ta kthjej "The Successor" pa e lexuar sepse perkthimi mu duk i tmerrshem (ndryshe nga pershtypja e Dritanit). 
www.AlbClub.com
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From ngahalli at yahoo.com  Thu Nov  9 04:11:05 2006
From: ngahalli at yahoo.com (Pseudonim NgaHalli)
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2006 01:11:05 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [AlbClub] Raporti i BE
Message-ID: <237671.44593.qm@web51503.mail.yahoo.com>

Kerkoj ndjese per invadimin me tre ms rradhazi por thjesht po ju dergoj linkun ku secili mund te lexoje Raportin e shumeperfolur te BE (2006):
   
  http://www.delalb.ec.europa.eu/en/news/al_sec_1383_en.pdf

 
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From diana35_1 at yahoo.com  Thu Nov  9 10:28:57 2006
From: diana35_1 at yahoo.com (D.)
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2006 07:28:57 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [AlbClub] Kunder trishtimit
Message-ID: <20061109152857.58625.qmail@web56502.mail.re3.yahoo.com>

S'e kam lexuar intrevisten e I. Kadarese. Me beri per te qeshur dikush qe akuzoi Pishakun se edhe sikur gojen te kish mbyllur Kadareja ne prape do ta shanim. Ne fakt une kam pare disa here intervista te Kadarese ne frengjisht, ai pothuaj hesht. Do ti qe me ka frymezuar megjithate. Me poshte do te gjeni versionin " le te mos trishtohemi" ose menyren time te kuptimit te absurditetit Ballkanik ne teresi, atij shqipo ne vecanti. Falje, eshte ne frengjisht, s'humbin hicgje ata qe s'dine frengjishten qe  mund te jete edhe me gabime edhe jo tek te gjithe mund provokoje zgerdhimje.
  Curiosit? balkanique via M6  Ce soir Capital transmet un reportage sur un fran?ais enrichi en Albanie.   Je pr?pare en toute effervescence une tasse de th? des montagnes albanaises, j?ajuste l??clairage du salon ? l?occasion, je m?installe sur le canap? confortablement et j?attends avec impatience le tour de l?Albanie,... apr?s Inde, Tha?lande, Russie, Pologne
  Dans le r?le du fortun? fran?ais Julien Roche : Julien Roche
  Avec la participation exceptionnelle de  : 
  Tetragnatha laboriosa, 
  Ismail Kadar? (grand ?crivain albanais)
  et
  Fatos Nano (ex-premier ministre de l?Albanie)
  Des vitrages absolument transparents, cloisonnent le grand et spacieux s?jour du pourtour chaud et ?touffant de l??t? albanais. Des meubles d?un Louis non d?chiffrable, plaqu? de bois rares, ornent les coins et allongent les bords des murs, ces derniers affichant des couleurs dans les tons d?un jaune p?le, sans vie. Le sol imite la terre cuite ?trusque, la m?moire  ne fixe que le gris des tableaux d?arts du style de r?alisme socialiste, des marins qui vainquent  la temp?te sur la mer, les fauteuils explosent dans un bleu roi aux fines arabesques blanches par dessus. Quelques reflets de lumi?re d?une piscine ? ras bord, copie de mauvais go?t de la piscine de Johnny ? Saint-Trop  ? l?ext?rieur,  rejettent des clins d??ils ? la haute soci?t? albanaise ci-pr?sente.
  La cr?me de la cr?me de la soci?t? albanaise, cultiv? dans les  serres  de concombre destin?e ? l?exportation, pr?sente sa partie masculine  dans la position pr?f?r?e d?Ali Pasha de Tepelen?, il y a de ?a deux petits si?cles ; mi-couch? sur le canap?, les gros ventres pendouillent presque par terre. Contrairement au Pacha, le male l?zardant sur le canap? ne fume pas, il v?g?te. La partie f?minine de cette Haute Soci?t? est compos?e de dames chics au go?t vestimentaire de prostitu? et de dames baba cool ? la mode John Lennon. Si le premier groupe de dames ? gel? chaque poil sur la t?te dans une allure tr?s naturelle de nylon en prenant ici le parfait aspect d?une perruque, le deuxi?me groupe appara?t sous une coiffure ? la Cro-Magnon.  Les dames ne l?zardent pas sur les canap?s, elle sont dans une position assise, dos arrondi repli?s sur la cigarette, fortement attir? par un d?bat qui ne manifeste aucun signe de la passion. Le d?bat est sans voix. 
  Julien Roche, en ma?tre des lieux, navigue entre le salon et la terrasse, il n?adh?re aucun groupe.  Abracadabra 





















le salon se vide 









ou











presque



.. 
  Un Monsieur r?siste au d?placement massif de la population de la b?tisse vers l?ext?rieur. Il est assis, son poids repose en d?s?quilibre sur la fesse gauche, le dos touche le fauteuil sur un seul et unique point, petit, ? l?infini. Il est le candidat pour le Prix Nobel, ? l?infini : Monsieur Kadare.   Sa jaquette jaune paille me rappelle les couleurs pr?f?r?e de Chaispas, personage pertinent d?une roman d?aventure pour enfant d?un auteur russe.  L?araign?e, Tetragnatha laboriosa, se d?place en cercles et ellipses sans fin au niveau de la clavicule du VIP. Elle ne rate jamais le centre de l??cran..
  On aper?oit un microphone se tendre vers Monsieur Kadare. ..
  Le journaliste : Connaissez ? vous Monsieur Julien Roche ?
  Tetragnatha laboriosa  d?passe les montagnes Epaule, elle se dirige vers le Cou. 
  I . Kadare : Oui, je le connais.
  Tetragnatha laboriosa parait essouffl?e, le col de la veste l?emp?che dans sa d?marche pour atteindre la destination Cou.  
  Le Journaliste : Depuis longtemps ?
  Tetragnatha laboriosa  descend vers la poitrine, au pas haletant. 
  I .Kadare : Oui, depuis longtemps( sourire fain?ant).
  Tetragnatha laboriosa double le pas et se d?place en dessinant des cercles, au centre de l??paule droite. 
  Le journaliste: Vous vous ?tes connus  avant la chute du communisme?  Tetragnatha laboriosa manque d?id?e, elle ne sait plus par ou trotter. Continue ses d?placements circulaires. 
  I.Kadare : Oui, oui.
  Tetragnatha laboriosa continue de bouger pareille. On dirait que son but ultime est de rester au centre de la cam?ra. 
  Sur la terrasse  Julien Roche lit un sms. 
  Le Journaliste : Un invit? en retard ?
  J. Roch : Oui le ministre d?engraissage de la dinde, vari?t? Cosas Nostrum (OGM).  
  Le Journaliste : Ah, Seigneur, quelle familiarit?  !!!!!!!!
  J. Roch( modeste) : Oui, il vient d?arriver de Bogota, il a un peu de retard. Il s?est excus?.
   Le Journaliste : Avez-vous souvent des invit?s haut plac?s ?
  J. Roch (d?sint?ress?) : Oui, oui.
  Il s??chappe ? la cam?ra
   
  Changement de d?cor. Nous nous trouvons dans le bureau du Premier Ministre Albanais. Fatos Nano appara?t, les yeux enfles, on dirait ferm?s. 
  Fatos Nano : Hahahahahahaha, venez, venez par ici. Y a toujours soif de parler fran?ais par-l?...et ha et ha et ha.
  Dans le public, un adolescent avec trois percings sur l?oreille et un sur le nez, demande ? son p?re : C?est quoi la blague du singe ?
  Le Journaliste : Connaissez-vous Julien Roch ?
  F. Nano : Oui, oui, certainement depuis tr?s longtemps.
  Le Journaliste : Il raconte votre vie priv?e dans les journaux. Cela ne vous affecte gu?re?
  F. Nano : Ben... non! Pourquoi? Devrais-je ? (explose de rire) Les journalistes sont libres de fouiller partout (rit et glousse). Je r?p?te ? ma femme chaque soir : regarde si on n?a pas un journaliste en dessous du lit ( rit, se marre ? mort, il finit par s??touffer). 
  Le Journaliste  : Vous tutoyez-vous ou vous vouvoyez-vous avec M. Roch ? 
  F. Nano (perdu entre son rire, la toux, les postillons de salive et la recherche du bon vieux mouchoir blanc en coton). Quoi ? Qui ? Julien ? O Bon Dieu ! Mais on se tutoie bien sur !(Le rire remplit l'ecran d'un crescendo fou) 
  Le documentaire finit par le rire de notre Premier M.. L?angoisse r?gne dans le public. Apr?s ce rire fr?n?tique serait-il encore en vie le Premier Ministre Albanais ?
   
   
  Ku e lame e ku na mbeti






..
   
   

 
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From no.elevator at gmail.com  Thu Nov  9 11:29:06 2006
From: no.elevator at gmail.com (Xha Xhai)
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2006 11:29:06 -0500
Subject: [AlbClub] Vorio-Epiri Diplomatik
Message-ID: <d1e7b6ac0611090829y5331acf1i1a56ccc76a5db5c@mail.gmail.com>

Kam lexuar mendime t? ndryshme n? shtyp p?r vendimin e qeveris? greke p?r
t'iu dh?n? qytetarin? greke minoritar?ve grek? n? Shqip?ri.

P?r mua, sa koh? q? Shqip?ria mbetet jasht? Bashkimit Evropian, ky vendim
rrezikon t? krijoj?, brenda Shqip?ris?, nj? kast? qytetar?sh t?
privilegjiuar n? raportet e tyre me Evrop?n.

Natyrisht, vendimi ?sht? marr? p?r minoritar?t, por t? gjith? e dim? sa t?
leht? e kan? disa qarqe, n? Greqi dhe n? Shqip?ri, p?r t'i deklaruar t?
gjith? shqiptar?t e fes? ortodokse si minoritar?. Kush do t'i pengoj? tani?
Gjendjet civile?

N? pamund?si p?r t? krijuar Vorio-Epirin, k?to qarqe po duan ta v?n?
Shqip?rin?, de facto, n? duar t? "vorio-epirot?ve"; sepse kjo kast? e
pajisur me euro-pasaporta do ta ket? t? leht? t? vendos? marr?dh?nie t?
privilegjiuara brenda kontinentit dhe m? tej.

Qeveria shqiptare v?rtet mund t? ket? qen? e pafuqishme p?r ta kund?rshtuar
k?t? vendim, por ma merr mendja se di?ka mund t? ishte b?r?, sidomos duke
futur n? loj? italian?t, t? cil?t nuk besoj se jan? shum? t? ngaz?llyer nga
k?to skenare p?r katrahura t? reja.

Nuk mund t? mos kujtoj edhe se, njohja e dyshtet?sis? q? u trumbetua dikur
me t? madhe nga Berisha me t? vet?t, tani po rrezikon t? kthehet n? nj?
k?rc?nim t? madh p?r vet? integritetin qytetar t? Shqip?ris?.
Xha Xhai
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From leila_0618 at yahoo.com  Thu Nov  9 12:02:18 2006
From: leila_0618 at yahoo.com (L G)
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2006 09:02:18 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [AlbClub] Vorio-Epiri Diplomatik
In-Reply-To: <d1e7b6ac0611090829y5331acf1i1a56ccc76a5db5c@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20061109170218.49855.qmail@web35808.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Eshte fakt i njohur qe greket kane aspirata per Vorio-Epir e per kontroll politik-ekonomik ne Shqiperi. Nuk ka rreziqe aneksimi e gllaberimi territorial, jo se nuk e duan greket, por se nuk i le njeri ta bejne. Ne mars '97, parlamenti grek rrinte i mbledhur me projekt-ligjin per dhenien e nenshtetesise minoritareve neper tavolina, ne pritje te konfirmimit te lajmit se pika e fundit qeverisese ne Shqiperi, presidenti, ishte arratisur ne Itali. Greket morren shume vrull ate kohe, pandehen se u be deti kos, dhe u desh nderhyrja e Italise, BE dhe SHBA-se qe te terhiqeshin nga endrrat e tyre.

Megjithate. Emigrantet ne Greqi kane 15 vjet qe punojne e jetojne atje. Minoritaret jane pajisur me disa leje-qendrimi e te drejte punesimi qe ne fillim. Ky favorizim i tyre beri qe edhe shqiptaret e tjere te nderrojne emrat e kombesite neper certifikata qe te perfitonin. Nuk ju ve faj qe u perpoqen te mbijetojne me cdo menyre.

Ne qe jemi ne Amerike e dime qe pas 5 vjet qendrimi te ligjshem, fitojme nenshtetesine pa asnje problem, vetem ndjekim procdeurat dhe afatet. Kanadaja e jep per 3 vjet.  Kjo gje nuk ndodh kaq lehte ne vendet e Evropes.  Dhe nese minoritaret ne Greqi akoma jane pa nenshtetesi, kjo eshte skandaloze. Greqia nuk po ju ben ndonje nder, po ju jep nje te drejte qe ju takon (nese biem dakord qe legjislacioni ne Greqi eshte i unifikuar ne keto pika me Konventat Nderkombetare dhe ligjet e BE-se.)

Patjeter qe do perpiqen te perfitojne edhe shqiptare jominoritare, dhe per mua shume mire do bejne. Nese kane 10-15 vjet qe punojne e jetojne ne Greqi dhe akoma s'jane nenshtetas, ta marrin me vrap. Asgje e keqe nuk i vjen Shqiperise se qytetaret e saj te shperndare neper bote kane dy shtetesi. Pse u dashka te quhet rrezik krijimi i kastes se privilegjuar ne raport me Evropen? Apo eshte me mire te jemi te gjithe shqiptare te perbuzur neper Evrope, vetem qe disa prej nesh te mos jene te privilegjuar?

Pavarsisht se per efekt propagande ne te dy anet e kufirit po flitet per dhenie nenshtetesie ne bllok, dhe Sabri Godo sot thoshte qe kjo eshte antikushtetuese, procedurat do jene individuale, se s'ma merr mendja qe te kete  as ligj as praktike qe lejoka dhenien e nenshtetesise ne grup. Greqia mund ta bente dhenien e nenshtetesise per gjithe shqiptaret atje pa u ndjere fare, pa bere asnje lloj deklarate, dhe ne as do dinim se c'behej. 
 
 Shteti shqiptar nuk mund te behet kundershtar i emigranteve te vet kur atyre ju ofrohen mundesira integrimi ne vendet ku jane. Mbase kjo behet nxitje per Italine qe te leshoje edhe ajo ca pe ne favor te shqiptareve atje.

Xha Xhai <no.elevator at gmail.com> wrote:                   *** AlbClub Discussion List ***



  Kam lexuar mendime t? ndryshme n? shtyp p?r vendimin e qeveris? greke p?r t'iu dh?n? qytetarin? greke minoritar?ve grek? n? Shqip?ri.
      P?r mua, sa koh? q? Shqip?ria mbetet jasht? Bashkimit Evropian, ky vendim rrezikon t? krijoj?, brenda Shqip?ris?, nj? kast? qytetar?sh t? privilegjiuar n? raportet e tyre me Evrop?n. 
  Natyrisht, vendimi ?sht? marr? p?r minoritar?t, por t? gjith? e dim? sa t? leht? e kan? disa qarqe, n? Greqi dhe n? Shqip?ri, p?r t'i deklaruar t? gjith? shqiptar?t e fes? ortodokse si minoritar?. Kush do t'i pengoj? tani? Gjendjet civile?
      N? pamund?si p?r t? krijuar Vorio-Epirin, k?to qarqe po duan ta v?n? Shqip?rin?, de facto, n? duar t? "vorio-epirot?ve"; sepse kjo kast? e pajisur me euro-pasaporta do ta ket? t? leht? t? vendos? marr?dh?nie t? privilegjiuara brenda kontinentit dhe m? tej. 
  Qeveria shqiptare v?rtet mund t? ket? qen? e pafuqishme p?r ta kund?rshtuar k?t? vendim, por ma merr mendja se di?ka mund t? ishte b?r?, sidomos duke futur n? loj? italian?t, t? cil?t nuk besoj se jan? shum? t? ngaz?llyer nga k?to skenare p?r katrahura t? reja.
    Nuk mund t? mos kujtoj edhe se, njohja e dyshtet?sis? q? u trumbetua dikur me t? madhe nga Berisha me t? vet?t, tani po rrezikon t? kthehet n? nj? k?rc?nim t? madh p?r vet? integritetin qytetar t? Shqip?ris?.
    Xha Xhai www.AlbClub.com
____________________________________________________
Alb-Club mailing list: Alb-Club at alb-net.com
To unsubscribe send email to: Alb-Club-unsubscribe at alb-net.com
http://www.alb-net.com/mailman/listinfo/alb-club

 
---------------------------------
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From bkatroshi at verizon.net  Thu Nov  9 13:39:51 2006
From: bkatroshi at verizon.net (Blerim Katroshi)
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2006 10:39:51 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [AlbClub] Vorio-Epiri Diplomatik
In-Reply-To: <20061109170218.49855.qmail@web35808.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20061109183952.68575.qmail@web84208.mail.re3.yahoo.com>

"Patjeter qe do perpiqen te perfitojne edhe shqiptare jominoritare, dhe per mua shume mire do bejne. Nese kane 10-15 vjet qe punojne e jetojne ne Greqi dhe akoma s'jane nenshtetas, ta marrin me vrap."
   
  Shume shqiptare jominoritare, por qe paraqiten te tille me dokumenta fallco ose jo, sigurisht qe do perfitojne nga nenshtetesia greke. Puna eshte se nje hap i tille i ndermarre nga qeveria shqiptare nuk u shoqerua me ndonje kembengulje nga ana e saj per lehtesimin e kushteve te integrimit per pjesen tjeter shqiptare te emigranteve, duke i lene ata ne meshiren e fshesave greke e duke i shtyre akoma me tej drejt konvertimit te detyruar nen ortodoksine fetare te greqizimit. I pare nen kete prizem, shqetesimi i Xha Xhai-t duket akoma me i justifikuar, sepse ne radhe te pare dhe per shkak te interesave te thella qe ka, eshte Greqia ajo qe duhet te ndihmoje Shqiperine per te hyre ne BE. Statusi me i larte i te drejtave qytetare qe minoritaret do gezojne si anetare te Be-se, pervec rrezikut te mundshem per t`u kthyer ne nje arme diplomatiko-politike, nuk rezonon aspak trajtimin qe gati gjysem milioni emigrantesh shqiptare pesojne nga dita ne dite ne Greqi dhe kjo eshte
 trishtuese. Mbetet per t`u pare se kur Megali-Idhea do nxjerre koken serish.   
  L G <leila_0618 at yahoo.com> wrote:
  *** AlbClub Discussion List ***



Eshte fakt i njohur qe greket kane aspirata per Vorio-Epir e per kontroll politik-ekonomik ne Shqiperi. Nuk ka rreziqe aneksimi e gllaberimi territorial, jo se nuk e duan greket, por se nuk i le njeri ta bejne. Ne mars '97, parlamenti grek rrinte i mbledhur me projekt-ligjin per dhenien e nenshtetesise minoritareve neper tavolina, ne pritje te konfirmimit te lajmit se pika e fundit qeverisese ne Shqiperi, presidenti, ishte arratisur ne Itali. Greket morren shume vrull ate kohe, pandehen se u be deti kos, dhe u desh nderhyrja e Italise, BE dhe SHBA-se qe te terhiqeshin nga endrrat e tyre.

Megjithate. Emigrantet ne Greqi kane 15 vjet qe punojne e jetojne atje. Minoritaret jane pajisur me disa leje-qendrimi e te drejte punesimi qe ne fillim. Ky favorizim i tyre beri qe edhe shqiptaret e tjere te nderrojne emrat e kombesite neper certifikata qe te perfitonin. Nuk ju ve faj qe u perpoqen te mbijetojne me cdo menyre.

Ne qe jemi ne Amerike e dime qe pas 5 vjet qendrimi te ligjshem, fitojme nenshtetesine pa asnje problem, vetem ndjekim procdeurat dhe afatet. Kanadaja e jep per 3 vjet.  Kjo gje nuk ndodh kaq lehte ne vendet e Evropes.  Dhe nese minoritaret ne Greqi akoma jane pa nenshtetesi, kjo eshte skandaloze. Greqia nuk po ju ben ndonje nder, po ju jep nje te drejte qe ju takon (nese biem dakord qe legjislacioni ne Greqi eshte i unifikuar ne keto pika me Konventat Nderkombetare dhe ligjet e BE-se.)

Patjeter qe do perpiqen te perfitojne edhe shqiptare jominoritare, dhe per mua shume mire do bejne. Nese kane 10-15 vjet qe punojne e jetojne ne Greqi dhe akoma s'jane nenshtetas, ta marrin me vrap. Asgje e keqe nuk i vjen Shqiperise se qytetaret e saj te shperndare neper bote kane dy shtetesi. Pse u dashka te quhet rrezik krijimi i kastes se privilegjuar ne raport me Evropen? Apo eshte me mire te jemi te gjithe shqiptare te perbuzur neper Evrope, vetem qe disa prej nesh te mos jene te privilegjuar?

Pavarsisht se per efekt propagande ne te dy anet e kufirit po flitet per dhenie nenshtetesie ne bllok, dhe Sabri Godo sot thoshte qe kjo eshte antikushtetuese, procedurat do jene individuale, se s'ma merr mendja qe te kete  as ligj as praktike qe lejoka dhenien e nenshtetesise ne grup. Greqia mund ta bente dhenien e nenshtetesise per gjithe shqiptaret atje pa u ndjere fare, pa bere asnje lloj deklarate, dhe ne as do dinim se c'behej. 

Shteti shqiptar nuk mund te behet kundershtar i emigranteve te vet kur atyre ju ofrohen mundesira integrimi ne vendet ku jane. Mbase kjo behet nxitje per Italine qe te leshoje edhe ajo ca pe ne favor te shqiptareve atje.

Xha Xhai <no.elevator at gmail.com> wrote:  *** AlbClub Discussion List ***



  Kam lexuar mendime t? ndryshme n? shtyp p?r vendimin e qeveris? greke p?r t'iu dh?n? qytetarin? greke minoritar?ve grek? n? Shqip?ri.
  P?r mua, sa koh? q? Shqip?ria mbetet jasht? Bashkimit Evropian, ky vendim rrezikon t? krijoj?, brenda Shqip?ris?, nj? kast? qytetar?sh t? privilegjiuar n? raportet e tyre me Evrop?n. 
  Natyrisht, vendimi ?sht? marr? p?r minoritar?t, por t? gjith? e dim? sa t? leht? e kan? disa qarqe, n? Greqi dhe n? Shqip?ri, p?r t'i deklaruar t? gjith? shqiptar?t e fes? ortodokse si minoritar?. Kush do t'i pengoj? tani? Gjendjet civile?
  N? pamund?si p?r t? krijuar Vorio-Epirin, k?to qarqe po duan ta v?n? Shqip?rin?, de facto, n? duar t? "vorio-epirot?ve"; sepse kjo kast? e pajisur me euro-pasaporta do ta ket? t? leht? t? vendos? marr?dh?nie t? privilegjiuara brenda kontinentit dhe m? tej. 
  Qeveria shqiptare v?rtet mund t? ket? qen? e pafuqishme p?r ta kund?rshtuar k?t? vendim, por ma merr mendja se di?ka mund t? ishte b?r?, sidomos duke futur n? loj? italian?t, t? cil?t nuk besoj se jan? shum? t? ngaz?llyer nga k?to skenare p?r katrahura t? reja.
  Nuk mund t? mos kujtoj edhe se, njohja e dyshtet?sis? q? u trumbetua dikur me t? madhe nga Berisha me t? vet?t, tani po rrezikon t? kthehet n? nj? k?rc?nim t? madh p?r vet? integritetin qytetar t? Shqip?ris?.
Xha Xhai www.AlbClub.com
____________________________________________________
Alb-Club mailing list: Alb-Club at alb-net.com
To unsubscribe send email to: Alb-Club-unsubscribe at alb-net.com
http://www.alb-net.com/mailman/listinfo/alb-club
    
---------------------------------
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To unsubscribe send email to: Alb-Club-unsubscribe at alb-net.com
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From cun-tirone at hotmail.com  Thu Nov  9 13:30:48 2006
From: cun-tirone at hotmail.com (Cun Tirone)
Date: Thu, 09 Nov 2006 13:30:48 -0500
Subject: [AlbClub] Trishtimi i Kadarese
In-Reply-To: <e17e70530611081948y33b21faey5bbbfae87fc8595e@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <BAY106-F28643D74D1D77CD729670091F00@phx.gbl>

Mbase keshilla e Kadarese per Qosen eshte ca e vonuar dhe s'ben me fajde. 
Qosja duhet ta kishte bere viziten mjekesore kohe me pare, kur quante halen 
e 97' "revolucion te vonuar demokratik." Duke pare bemat e fundit, ku i ka 
hapur librin e shpise Molit, e ku e nxjerr spiun rrugesh, etj., mbase s'ka 
mo dermon.



Qe t'i kthehemi muhabetit te LIBRAVE, mesa duket kjo eshte menyra e re e 
gjykimit te tyre dhe autoreve perkates, pra duke pare c'thone "ekspertet" e 
Top Channel apo Kanali i tope.... Ajo menyra e vjeter qe konsistonte ne 
hapjen e librit faqe me faqe dhe e soditjes se germave ne cdo faqe, duket qe 
eshte tejkaluar tashme. Kishte te drejte Marksi kur fliste per rritje 
rendimenti ne kapitalizem.



Qe eshte mulli me ere e morra vesht - tha, po uji nga i vjen?
Mbase nga Kanali - iu pergjegj.


?un Tirone




>From: "Ina Dushku" <ina.dushku at gmail.com>
>To: "Cun Tirone" <cun-tirone at hotmail.com>
>CC: alb-club at alb-net.com
>Subject: Re: [AlbClub] Trishtimi i Kadarese
>Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2006 22:48:42 -0500
>
>Por qe te quash Qosen te semure mendor e te cilesosh tolerancen fetare ne
>Shqiperi si model te percjelle nga gjenetika eshte nje budallallek i madh,
>gjithmone duke perjashtuar mundesine qe gazetaret e Top Channel-it t'ja 
>kene
>futur kot citimeve. Perfundimisht nuk dua te merrem me Kadarene per ca 
>kohe,
>madje rrezik ta kthjej "The Successor" pa e lexuar sepse perkthimi mu duk i
>tmerrshem (ndryshe nga pershtypja e Dritanit).

_________________________________________________________________
All-in-one security and maintenance for your PC.  Get a free 90-day trial! 
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From no.elevator at gmail.com  Thu Nov  9 13:56:53 2006
From: no.elevator at gmail.com (Xha Xhai)
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2006 13:56:53 -0500
Subject: [AlbClub] Vorio-Epiri Diplomatik
In-Reply-To: <20061109170218.49855.qmail@web35808.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <d1e7b6ac0611090829y5331acf1i1a56ccc76a5db5c@mail.gmail.com>
	<20061109170218.49855.qmail@web35808.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <d1e7b6ac0611091056h6a286b0aic07f59261060a61@mail.gmail.com>

L., kam frik? se po flasim p?r gj?ra t? ndryshme. Lexo t? lutem nj? artikull
t? Panajot Bark?s sot n? gazet?n "Shqip":

http://gazeta-shqip.com/artikull.php?id=5826

P?r t? par? si shtrohet ??shtja. Nuk ?sht? fjala p?r t'u njohur shtet?sin?
greke qytetar?ve shqiptar? t? minoritetit n? Greqi (who cares?), por p?r t'u
njohur shtet?sin? greke *qytetar?ve shqiptar? t? minoritetit grek n?
Shqip?ri*.

"Vendimi i Athin?s p?r t'u dh?n? shtet?sin? greke an?tar?ve t? minoritetit
grek n? Shqip?ri, duhet par? si nj? dritare q? i hapet Shqip?ris? p?r n?
Evrop?" thot? Barka.

Kjo nuk m? duket se lidhet me emigracionin nga Shqip?ria n? Greqi.

"Vendimi i qeveris? greke p?r t'i dh?n? edhe shtet?si greke an?tar?ve t?
komunitetit t? minoritetit etnik grek n? Shqip?ri, p?rb?n nj? risi t? re jo
vet?m p?r Shqip?rin? apo Greqin? dhe marr?dh?niet midis tyre, por p?r gjith?
Ballkanin. Mbi t? gjitha, b?het fjal? p?r nj? risi pozitive. Nj? pjes? e
popullsis? s? nj? vendi (nuk ka r?nd?si numri) b?het, p?r shkak t? etnis? s?
vet, pjes? e Bashkimit Evropian."

?'t? thuash m? tep?r se kaq? Si u b?ka nj? pjes? e popullsis? s? nj? vendi
sovran pjes? e Bashkimit Evropian? Po pse, bashkim etnish, ?sht? Bashkimi
Evropian? T? thuash gjepura t? tilla n? publik pa t'u dridhur qerpiku, don
t? thot? se i ke shpatullat p?rnjimend shum?, shum? t? ngrohta.

Vazhdon Barka:

"N? k?t? kuad?r jan? t? pakuptimta rezervat dhe dyshimet e shfaqura si
shprehje e nj? nacionalizmi t? tejshkuar. N? k?t? rast, reagimet e k?tij
standardi jo vet?m q? e mbajn? peng n? streha nacionaliste opinionin publik
shqiptar, por, duke qen? nj? vazhdim?si, po kthehen n? mjet presioni
nacionalist mbi an?tar?t e minoriteti etnik grek. N? k?t? rast, kan? p?r
motiv real zilin? provinciale q? rrjedh nga privilegjet q? sjell nj?
pasaport? evropiane."

Thua se vendimi i qeveris? greke nuk qenka frym?zuar nga nacionalizmi grek!
P?rkundrazi, reagimet shqiptare, duke p?rfshir? modestisht edhe timin, kan?
t? b?jn? me shqet?simin p?r t? ruajtur integritetin e Shqip?ris? si shtet.
Se qeveria e Tiran?s nuk po vete t'u ofroj? shtet?sin? shqiptare ?am?ve
ortodoks? q? kan? mbetur t? fshehur n? Epirin grek!

Xha Xhai


On 11/9/06, L G <leila_0618 at yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> Eshte fakt i njohur qe greket kane aspirata per Vorio-Epir e per kontroll
> politik-ekonomik ne Shqiperi. Nuk ka rreziqe aneksimi e gllaberimi
> territorial, jo se nuk e duan greket, por se nuk i le njeri ta bejne. Ne
> mars '97, parlamenti grek rrinte i mbledhur me projekt-ligjin per dhenien e
> nenshtetesise minoritareve neper tavolina, ne pritje te konfirmimit te
> lajmit se pika e fundit qeverisese ne Shqiperi, presidenti, ishte arratisur
> ne Itali. Greket morren shume vrull ate kohe, pandehen se u be deti kos, dhe
> u desh nderhyrja e Italise, BE dhe SHBA-se qe te terhiqeshin nga endrrat e
> tyre.
>
> Megjithate. Emigrantet ne Greqi kane 15 vjet qe punojne e jetojne atje.
> Minoritaret jane pajisur me disa leje-qendrimi e te drejte punesimi qe ne
> fillim. Ky favorizim i tyre beri qe edhe shqiptaret e tjere te nderrojne
> emrat e kombesite neper certifikata qe te perfitonin. Nuk ju ve faj qe u
> perpoqen te mbijetojne me cdo menyre.
>
> Ne qe jemi ne Amerike e dime qe pas 5 vjet qendrimi te ligjshem, fitojme
> nenshtetesine pa asnje problem, vetem ndjekim procdeurat dhe afatet.
> Kanadaja e jep per 3 vjet.  Kjo gje nuk ndodh kaq lehte ne vendet e
> Evropes.  Dhe nese minoritaret ne Greqi akoma jane pa nenshtetesi, kjo eshte
> skandaloze. Greqia nuk po ju ben ndonje nder, po ju jep nje te drejte qe ju
> takon (nese biem dakord qe legjislacioni ne Greqi eshte i unifikuar ne keto
> pika me Konventat Nderkombetare dhe ligjet e BE-se.)
>
> Patjeter qe do perpiqen te perfitojne edhe shqiptare jominoritare, dhe per
> mua shume mire do bejne. Nese kane 10-15 vjet qe punojne e jetojne ne Greqi
> dhe akoma s'jane nenshtetas, ta marrin me vrap. Asgje e keqe nuk i vjen
> Shqiperise se qytetaret e saj te shperndare neper bote kane dy shtetesi. Pse
> u dashka te quhet rrezik krijimi i kastes se privilegjuar ne raport me
> Evropen? Apo eshte me mire te jemi te gjithe shqiptare te perbuzur neper
> Evrope, vetem qe disa prej nesh te mos jene te privilegjuar?
>
> Pavarsisht se per efekt propagande ne te dy anet e kufirit po flitet per
> dhenie nenshtetesie ne bllok, dhe Sabri Godo sot thoshte qe kjo eshte
> antikushtetuese, procedurat do jene individuale, se s'ma merr mendja qe te
> kete  as ligj as praktike qe lejoka dhenien e nenshtetesise ne grup. Greqia
> mund ta bente dhenien e nenshtetesise per gjithe shqiptaret atje pa u ndjere
> fare, pa bere asnje lloj deklarate, dhe ne as do dinim se c'behej.
>
> Shteti shqiptar nuk mund te behet kundershtar i emigranteve te vet kur
> atyre ju ofrohen mundesira integrimi ne vendet ku jane. Mbase kjo behet
> nxitje per Italine qe te leshoje edhe ajo ca pe ne favor te shqiptareve
> atje.
>
> *Xha Xhai <no.elevator at gmail.com>* wrote:
>
> *** AlbClub Discussion List ***
>
>
>
> Kam lexuar mendime t? ndryshme n? shtyp p?r vendimin e qeveris? greke p?r
> t'iu dh?n? qytetarin? greke minoritar?ve grek? n? Shqip?ri.
> P?r mua, sa koh? q? Shqip?ria mbetet jasht? Bashkimit Evropian, ky vendim
> rrezikon t? krijoj?, brenda Shqip?ris?, nj? kast? qytetar?sh t?
> privilegjiuar n? raportet e tyre me Evrop?n.
> Natyrisht, vendimi ?sht? marr? p?r minoritar?t, por t? gjith? e dim? sa t?
> leht? e kan? disa qarqe, n? Greqi dhe n? Shqip?ri, p?r t'i deklaruar t?
> gjith? shqiptar?t e fes? ortodokse si minoritar?. Kush do t'i pengoj? tani?
> Gjendjet civile?
> N? pamund?si p?r t? krijuar Vorio-Epirin, k?to qarqe po duan ta v?n?
> Shqip?rin?, de facto, n? duar t? "vorio-epirot?ve"; sepse kjo kast? e
> pajisur me euro-pasaporta do ta ket? t? leht? t? vendos? marr?dh?nie t?
> privilegjiuara brenda kontinentit dhe m? tej.
> Qeveria shqiptare v?rtet mund t? ket? qen? e pafuqishme p?r ta
> kund?rshtuar k?t? vendim, por ma merr mendja se di?ka mund t? ishte b?r?,
> sidomos duke futur n? loj? italian?t, t? cil?t nuk besoj se jan? shum? t?
> ngaz?llyer nga k?to skenare p?r katrahura t? reja.
> Nuk mund t? mos kujtoj edhe se, njohja e dyshtet?sis? q? u trumbetua dikur
> me t? madhe nga Berisha me t? vet?t, tani po rrezikon t? kthehet n? nj?
> k?rc?nim t? madh p?r vet? integritetin qytetar t? Shqip?ris?.
> Xha Xhai www.AlbClub.com
> ____________________________________________________
> Alb-Club mailing list: Alb-Club at alb-net.com
> To unsubscribe send email to: Alb-Club-unsubscribe at alb-net.com
> http://www.alb-net.com/mailman/listinfo/alb-club
>
>
> ------------------------------
> Cheap Talk? Check out<http://us.rd.yahoo.com/mail_us/taglines/postman8/*http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=39663/*http://voice.yahoo.com>Yahoo! Messenger's low PC-to-Phone call rates.
>
>
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From leila_0618 at yahoo.com  Thu Nov  9 14:02:46 2006
From: leila_0618 at yahoo.com (L G)
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2006 11:02:46 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [AlbClub] Vorio-Epiri Diplomatik
In-Reply-To: <20061109183952.68575.qmail@web84208.mail.re3.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20061109190246.2443.qmail@web35806.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Kerkoj ndjese per mesazhin e meparshem. Me kish shpetuar nje "detaj" fort i rendesishem, qenkesh fjala per minoritaret ne Shqiperi jo per emigrantet minoritare ne Greqi. 




Blerim Katroshi <bkatroshi at verizon.net> wrote: "Patjeter qe do perpiqen te perfitojne edhe shqiptare jominoritare, dhe per mua shume mire do bejne. Nese kane 10-15 vjet qe punojne e jetojne ne Greqi dhe akoma s'jane nenshtetas, ta marrin me vrap."
   
  Shume shqiptare jominoritare, por qe paraqiten te tille me dokumenta fallco ose jo, sigurisht qe do perfitojne nga nenshtetesia greke. Puna eshte se nje hap i tille i ndermarre nga qeveria shqiptare nuk u shoqerua me ndonje kembengulje nga ana e saj per lehtesimin e kushteve te integrimit per pjesen tjeter shqiptare te emigranteve, duke i lene ata ne meshiren e fshesave greke e duke i shtyre akoma me tej drejt konvertimit te detyruar nen ortodoksine fetare te greqizimit. I pare nen kete prizem, shqetesimi i Xha Xhai-t duket akoma me i justifikuar, sepse ne radhe te pare dhe per shkak te interesave te thella qe ka, eshte Greqia ajo qe duhet te ndihmoje Shqiperine per te hyre ne BE. Statusi me i larte i te drejtave qytetare qe minoritaret do  gezojne si anetare te Be-se, pervec rrezikut te mundshem per t`u kthyer ne nje arme diplomatiko-politike, nuk rezonon aspak trajtimin qe gati gjysem milioni emigrantesh shqiptare pesojne nga dita ne dite ne Greqi dhe kjo eshte
 trishtuese. Mbetet per t`u pare se kur Megali-Idhea do nxjerre koken serish.   
  L G <leila_0618 at yahoo.com> wrote:
  *** AlbClub Discussion List ***



Eshte fakt i njohur qe greket kane aspirata per Vorio-Epir e per kontroll politik-ekonomik ne Shqiperi. Nuk ka rreziqe aneksimi e gllaberimi territorial, jo se nuk e duan greket, por se nuk i le njeri ta bejne. Ne mars '97, parlamenti grek rrinte i mbledhur me projekt-ligjin per dhenien e nenshtetesise minoritareve neper tavolina, ne pritje te konfirmimit te lajmit se pika e fundit qeverisese ne Shqiperi, presidenti, ishte arratisur ne Itali.  Greket morren shume vrull ate kohe, pandehen se u be deti kos, dhe u desh nderhyrja e Italise, BE dhe SHBA-se qe te terhiqeshin nga endrrat e tyre.

Megjithate. Emigrantet ne Greqi kane 15 vjet qe punojne e jetojne atje. Minoritaret jane pajisur me disa leje-qendrimi e te drejte punesimi qe ne fillim. Ky favorizim i tyre beri qe edhe shqiptaret e tjere te nderrojne emrat e kombesite neper certifikata qe te perfitonin. Nuk ju ve faj qe u perpoqen te mbijetojne me cdo menyre.

Ne qe jemi ne Amerike e dime qe pas 5 vjet qendrimi te ligjshem, fitojme nenshtetesine pa asnje problem, vetem ndjekim procdeurat dhe afatet. Kanadaja e jep per 3 vjet.  Kjo gje nuk ndodh kaq lehte ne vendet e Evropes.  Dhe nese minoritaret ne Greqi akoma jane pa nenshtetesi, kjo eshte skandaloze. Greqia nuk po ju ben ndonje nder, po ju jep nje te drejte qe ju takon (nese biem dakord qe legjislacioni ne Greqi eshte i unifikuar ne keto pika me Konventat Nderkombetare dhe ligjet e  BE-se.)

Patjeter qe do perpiqen te perfitojne edhe shqiptare jominoritare, dhe per mua shume mire do bejne. Nese kane 10-15 vjet qe punojne e jetojne ne Greqi dhe akoma s'jane nenshtetas, ta marrin me vrap. Asgje e keqe nuk i vjen Shqiperise se qytetaret e saj te shperndare neper bote kane dy shtetesi. Pse u dashka te quhet rrezik krijimi i kastes se privilegjuar ne raport me Evropen? Apo eshte me mire te jemi te gjithe shqiptare te perbuzur neper Evrope, vetem qe disa prej nesh te mos jene te privilegjuar?

Pavarsisht se per efekt propagande ne te dy anet e kufirit po flitet per dhenie nenshtetesie ne bllok, dhe Sabri Godo sot thoshte qe kjo eshte antikushtetuese, procedurat do jene individuale, se s'ma merr mendja qe te kete  as ligj as praktike qe lejoka dhenien e nenshtetesise ne grup. Greqia mund ta bente dhenien e nenshtetesise per gjithe shqiptaret atje pa u ndjere fare, pa bere asnje lloj deklarate, dhe ne as do dinim se c'behej. 

Shteti  shqiptar nuk mund te behet kundershtar i emigranteve te vet kur atyre ju ofrohen mundesira integrimi ne vendet ku jane. Mbase kjo behet nxitje per Italine qe te leshoje edhe ajo ca pe ne favor te shqiptareve atje.

Xha Xhai <no.elevator at gmail.com> wrote:  *** AlbClub Discussion List ***



  Kam lexuar mendime t? ndryshme n? shtyp p?r vendimin e qeveris? greke p?r t'iu dh?n? qytetarin? greke minoritar?ve grek? n? Shqip?ri.
  P?r mua, sa koh? q? Shqip?ria mbetet jasht? Bashkimit Evropian, ky vendim rrezikon t? krijoj?, brenda Shqip?ris?, nj? kast? qytetar?sh t? privilegjiuar n? raportet e tyre me Evrop?n. 
  Natyrisht, vendimi ?sht? marr? p?r minoritar?t, por t? gjith? e dim? sa t? leht? e kan? disa qarqe, n? Greqi dhe n? Shqip?ri, p?r t'i deklaruar t?  gjith? shqiptar?t e fes? ortodokse si minoritar?. Kush do t'i pengoj? tani? Gjendjet civile?
  N? pamund?si p?r t? krijuar Vorio-Epirin, k?to qarqe po duan ta v?n? Shqip?rin?, de facto, n? duar t? "vorio-epirot?ve"; sepse kjo kast? e pajisur me euro-pasaporta do ta ket? t? leht? t? vendos? marr?dh?nie t? privilegjiuara brenda kontinentit dhe m? tej. 
  Qeveria shqiptare v?rtet mund t? ket? qen? e pafuqishme p?r ta kund?rshtuar k?t? vendim, por ma merr mendja se di?ka mund t? ishte b?r?, sidomos duke futur n? loj? italian?t, t? cil?t nuk besoj se jan? shum? t? ngaz?llyer nga k?to skenare p?r katrahura t? reja.
  Nuk mund t? mos kujtoj edhe se, njohja e dyshtet?sis? q? u trumbetua dikur me t? madhe nga Berisha me t? vet?t, tani po rrezikon t? kthehet n? nj? k?rc?nim t? madh p?r vet? integritetin qytetar t? Shqip?ris?.
Xha  Xhai www.AlbClub.com
____________________________________________________
Alb-Club mailing list: Alb-Club at alb-net.com
To unsubscribe send email to: Alb-Club-unsubscribe at alb-net.com
http://www.alb-net.com/mailman/listinfo/alb-club
    
---------------------------------
  Cheap Talk? Check out Yahoo! Messenger's low PC-to-Phone call rates.www.AlbClub.com
____________________________________________________
Alb-Club mailing list: Alb-Club at alb-net.com
To unsubscribe send email to: Alb-Club-unsubscribe at alb-net.com
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From bashkesia at hotmail.com  Thu Nov  9 15:01:14 2006
From: bashkesia at hotmail.com (bashkesia shqiptare)
Date: Thu, 09 Nov 2006 20:01:14 +0000
Subject: [AlbClub] Lajmerim
Message-ID: <BAY18-F21EA478DBD13A5BCEC14FBA2F00@phx.gbl>

Pershendetje te gjitheve,
Nepermjet ketij mesazhi, ju njoftojme te gjithe anetareve te komunitetit
shqipetar te Montrealit se diten e shtune dt. 11 nendor ora 11 :00 ne
ndertesen ku zhvillon veprimtarine e saj shkolla e gjuhes shqipe, do te
mblidhe asambleja e pergjitheshme per te bere zgjedhjet e reja per keshillin
drejtues te Bashkesise sone.
Pikat e rendit te dites do te jene :
1)	Rraporti i keshillit ekzistues.
2)	Disa propozime per ndryshime ne statutin e Bashkesise.
3)	Diskutime per rraportin dhe propozimet.
4)	Antarsimet e reja.
5)	Zgjedhjet e reja per Keshillin Drejtues.
Suksesin e ksaj veprimtarie te rendesishme per vazdimesine e Bashkesise sone
e siguron vetem pjesmarja juaj e gjere, mendimet tuaja per shtimin  e
aktiviteteve qe perkojne me interesat tuaja dhe vota juaj per te zgjedhur ne
keshillin drejtues njerezit me te perkushtuar.
Per ata persona qe nuk e dine vendndodhjen adresa eshte:
75, square Sir-Georges-Etienne-Cartier dhe ndodhet prane Metro ?Place
St-Henri
Te fala te gjitheve
Keshilli Drejtues i Bashkesise

_________________________________________________________________
Say hello to the next generation of Search. Live Search ? try it now. 
http://www.live.com/?mkt=en-ca



From info at mjaft.org  Thu Nov  9 15:13:53 2006
From: info at mjaft.org (info at mjaft.org)
Date: Thu, 09 Nov 2006 15:13:53 -0500
Subject: [AlbClub] Te premten, ora 17.00!/Friday, 5 p.m!
Message-ID: <E1GiGHZ-0001q6-2r@server1.yellowdns.com>

Te premten, ora 17.00!

Aksioni Civil ju fton t? merrni pjes? dit?n e premte, 10 nentor, n? nj? manifestim paq?sor kund?r autoritarizmit q? po pushton sot jet?n publike dhe institucionale t? Shqip?ris?.
N? or?n 17.00 t? dit?s s? premte, do t? mblidhemi t? gjith? p?rpara Kryeministris? p?r t? mbrojtur t? drejtat dhe lirit? e t? qytetar?ve, me bindjen, se Shqip?ria e vitit 2006 nuk mund t? jet? si Shqip?ria e disa viteve m? par?.
Ne ftojm? t? gjith? pensionist?t, t? cil?t vazhdimisht jan? mashtruar me rritje artificiale t? pensioneve, diferenca e t? cilave u del pastaj n? m?nyr? t? pajustifikueshme n? ?mimet e rritura t? shum? produkteve jet?sore apo n? heqjen nga lista t? ila?eve t? rimbursueshme.
N? ftojm? t? gjith? t? rinjt?, t? cil?t k?rkojn? t? marrin pjes? n? nj? jet? t? lir? universitare, autonome nga ?do lloj tendence kontrolli t? centralizuar, ashtu si? po ndodh me projektligjin e ri p?r arsimin e lart?, ku vet?m p?r autonomi universitare nuk mund t? flasim.
N? ftojm? t? gjith? pronar?t e ligjsh?m t? k?tij vendi, t? cil?t vazhdojn? t? shikojn? se si me arroganc? u vidhet prona duke u premtuar kompensime t? parealizueshme.
Ne ftojm? t? gjith? ata specialist? t? administrat?s t? cil?t papritur e kan? gjetur veten n? rrug?t e qytetit dhe jasht? zyr?s s? tyre vet?m e vet?m se nuk b?jn? pjes? n? asnj? parti e nuk kan? qen? asnj?her? militant? t? ndonj? force politike, por kane investuar vetem ne drejtim te rritjes profesionale.
Ne ftojm? n? k?t? manifestim paq?sor, q? do t? jet? nj? shembull i qytetaris?, t? gjith? ata qytetar? t? k?tij vendi q? shikojn? cdo dit? t?u shkelen t? drejtat, ata qytetar? q? pa asnj? arsye jan? ndaluar nga policia e cila, n? vend t? merret me kriminel?t e v?rtet?, kujdeset p?r t? kositur barin e ?do banori t? ?do fshati n? ?do cep t? Shqip?ris?!
Ne ftojm? t? gjith? ata p?rfaq?sues t? familjeve q? kan? n? p?rb?rje t? tyre ish ushtarak?, si edhe vete ata ushtarake t? l?n? n? harres? me nj? mosmir?njohje t? q?llimshme ndaj kontributeve t? tyre shum?vjecare n? mbrojtje t? k?tij vendi.
Ne ftojm? n? k?t? manifestim, t? gjith? ata qytetar? t? cil?t u mashtruan se do t? mund t? paguanin m? pak taksa n? biznesin e tyre, por u gjend?n pastaj papritur p?rpara faturave t? reja, q? nuk kishin asgj? t? p?rbashk?t me premtimet elektorale q? d?gjuan dhunsh?m p?r muaj t? t?r?.
Ne ftojm? n? k?t? manifestim q? nuk do t? ket? asgj? t? p?rbashk?t me asnj? protest? t? kujtdo force politike t? s? kaluar?s, t? gjith? ata qytetar? q? nuk shikojn? asnj? shpres? apo mund?si p?r prosperim n? k?t? vend.
Ftojm? t? bashkohen me ne, t? gjith? ata intelektual? q? ndjejn? cdo dit? e m? shum? se z?ri i tyre i lir? po ngushtohet e burgoset nga autoritarizmi i atyre pushtetar?ve q? nuk jan? m?suar t? d?gjojn? nj? mendim ndryshe apo alternativ.
Ne do te manifestojm? dit?n e nes?rme, me bindjen se demokracia ?sht? di?ka shum? e shtrenjt? p?r t\'u l?n? n? dor?n e nj? njeriu t? vet?m. 
Do te jet? nj? manifestim paq?sor, q? do t? nis? me muzik? p?rpara Kryeministris? dhe do t? vijoj? deri pas or?s 18.00. 

TE PREMTEN, 10 NENTOR, NE OREN 17.00, NE BULEVARDIN \"DESHMORET E KOMBIT\", PERBALLE KRYEMINISTRISE

AKSIONI CIVIL


Friday, 5 p.m!

Civil Action invites you to join us on Friday, November 10 at 17.00 for a peaceful manifestation against the authoritarianism that has recently entrapped both the Albanian public and its institutions.
On Friday at 17.00 we will all gather in front of the Prime Minister?s Office to safeguard our rights and our freedom.  We are convinced that the Albania of 2006 cannot be like the Albania of the past.
We invite all the pensioners who have continuously been deceived by the artificial increases in their pensions to join us on Friday.  Increases in their pensions have been undermined by increases in other basic products as well as decreases in the number of medications that are reimbursable.  
We invite the youngsters, who seek to attend free and autonomous universities without the shackles of centralized control, to join us on Friday.  Recent draft laws that are attempting to curtail educational autonomy must be revoked.  
We invite all our nation?s businessmen, whose property has been stolen and never compensated for, to join us on Friday.
We invite all the experts of the public administration who have suddenly found themselves in the streets outside their offices only because they did not ardently follow either party, but have invested their time to increase their professional growth, to join us on Friday.
We invite everyone to this peaceful manifestation, everyone who would like to be a model of civil society.  We invite all the citizens of this country that notice the daily violations of the law, all the citizens that have been accosted by the police without motive, while actual criminals are not apprehended.
We invite all members of the military and their families, who have been marginalized and denied their commendation, to join us on Friday.
We invite all of the citizens who have been deceived by the promise of lower business tax to join us on Friday. Rather than pay less tax they have found themselves with new bills that were never mentioned in the zealous pre-electoral campaigns.
We invite everyone, all the citizens who see no hope of a prosperous future in this country, to the manifestation.  It will have nothing in common with past political protests because it stems from civil society, not from political parties. 
We invite all the intellectuals who feel that their free voice is being choked by this administration?s authoritarianism, an administration that is intolerant of opinions that differ from its own, to join us on Friday.  
We will manifest on Friday based on the belief that democracy is sacred, too sacred to be neglected by a single person. 
It will be a peaceful manifestation that will commence with music in front of the Prime Minister?s Office and will last until 18.00.  

ON FRIDAY, NOVEMBER 10th, AT 17.00, ON BOULEVARD ?DESHMORET E KOMBIT,? IN FRONT OF THE PRIME MINISTER?S OFFICE

CIVIL ACTION






From cun-tirone at hotmail.com  Thu Nov  9 16:58:21 2006
From: cun-tirone at hotmail.com (Cun Tirone)
Date: Thu, 09 Nov 2006 16:58:21 -0500
Subject: [AlbClub] Endrra e kuajve
Message-ID: <BAY106-F40049B81A4BC03A0ADE5391F00@phx.gbl>

Thone se ne fund fare, para se te shqyen nga ujqit, kuajt mbyllin syte
me shpresen te jete enderr.


Pak a shume kjo eshte historia e re me ish fqinjet jugore, qe tashme jane 
zot shtepie.


Ekspansioni i mireorganizuar grek filloi me Janullatosin, vazhdoi me berjen 
monopol
te degeve jetike te ekonomise, blerjen e politikaneve, gazetareve, apo kujdo 
qe do i duhej.
Intervista e Z. Shinasi Rama hedh drite mbi kete ceshtje qe ne veze.
A ishte Ramizi me kelyshe ne ndonje bordero apo jo, shkoni e pyesni burezin 
e leshit.


Me tej u qendis 97' ..., por u kuptua qe s'kishte pse te beheshin gjerat me 
buje.
Leri dardhat te piqen se do bien vete nga pema.


Kur ndonje jo shume modhern ngrinte zerin, i mbyllej goja me shtupen e 
"kombetarizmit."
Nderkohe qe nacionalizmi shqiptar mbeti vec si kujtim.


Keshtu qe vertet une ?uditem me ?udine tuaj per cka po ndodh.
Nuk ishte e nuk eshte enderr, por tashme mbase eshte vone te zgjohesh.



Dikur nderruam emer nga arber ne shqipetare, mbase eshte koha per
nje nderrim me radical, e sidomos me me bereqet.


?un Tirone

_________________________________________________________________
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From cun-tirone at hotmail.com  Thu Nov  9 21:25:16 2006
From: cun-tirone at hotmail.com (Cun Tirone)
Date: Thu, 09 Nov 2006 21:25:16 -0500
Subject: [AlbClub] Trishtimi i Kadarese
In-Reply-To: <e17e70530611091745k8d6c440g6dda2f19b7323cec@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <BAY106-F245A5D505A77BEC2513D1991F70@phx.gbl>

Une do te te sugjeroja, te mos harxhosh kaq shume energji.
Po s'ta kapi heren e pare mos u lodh me.
S'ja vlen te lexosh tre here te njejtin mesazh.


?un Tirone

>From: "Ina Dushku" <ina.dushku at gmail.com>
>To: "Cun Tirone" <cun-tirone at hotmail.com>
>CC: alb-club at alb-net.com
>Subject: Re: [AlbClub] Trishtimi i Kadarese
>Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2006 20:45:17 -0500
>
>Kurse menyra e re e leximit te asaj qe shkruajne te tjeret eshte ta lexosh
>nje here, dy, ndoshta edhe tre, te mos e kuptosh fare, e pastaj te
>komentosh.
>
>On 11/9/06, Cun Tirone <cun-tirone at hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>                  *** AlbClub Discussion List ***
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>Mbase keshilla e Kadarese per Qosen eshte ca e vonuar dhe s'ben me fajde.
>>Qosja duhet ta kishte bere viziten mjekesore kohe me pare, kur quante
>>halen
>>e 97' "revolucion te vonuar demokratik." Duke pare bemat e fundit, ku i ka
>>hapur librin e shpise Molit, e ku e nxjerr spiun rrugesh, etj., mbase s'ka
>>mo dermon.
>>
>>
>>
>>Qe t'i kthehemi muhabetit te LIBRAVE, mesa duket kjo eshte menyra e re e
>>gjykimit te tyre dhe autoreve perkates, pra duke pare c'thone "ekspertet"
>>e
>>Top Channel apo Kanali i tope.... Ajo menyra e vjeter qe konsistonte ne
>>hapjen e librit faqe me faqe dhe e soditjes se germave ne cdo faqe, duket
>>qe
>>eshte tejkaluar tashme. Kishte te drejte Marksi kur fliste per rritje
>>rendimenti ne kapitalizem.
>>
>>
>>
>>Qe eshte mulli me ere e morra vesht - tha, po uji nga i vjen?
>>Mbase nga Kanali - iu pergjegj.
>>
>>
>>?un Tirone
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> >From: "Ina Dushku" <ina.dushku at gmail.com>
>> >To: "Cun Tirone" <cun-tirone at hotmail.com>
>> >CC: alb-club at alb-net.com
>> >Subject: Re: [AlbClub] Trishtimi i Kadarese
>> >Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2006 22:48:42 -0500
>> >
>> >Por qe te quash Qosen te semure mendor e te cilesosh tolerancen fetare 
>>ne
>> >Shqiperi si model te percjelle nga gjenetika eshte nje budallallek i
>>madh,
>> >gjithmone duke perjashtuar mundesine qe gazetaret e Top Channel-it t'ja
>> >kene
>> >futur kot citimeve. Perfundimisht nuk dua te merrem me Kadarene per ca
>> >kohe,
>> >madje rrezik ta kthjej "The Successor" pa e lexuar sepse perkthimi mu 
>>duk
>>i
>> >tmerrshem (ndryshe nga pershtypja e Dritanit).
>>
>>_________________________________________________________________
>>All-in-one security and maintenance for your PC.  Get a free 90-day trial!
>>
>>http://clk.atdmt.com/MSN/go/msnnkwlo0050000002msn/direct/01/?href=http://www.windowsonecare.com/?sc_cid=msn_hotmail
>>
>>
>>
>>www.AlbClub.com
>>____________________________________________________
>>Alb-Club mailing list: Alb-Club at alb-net.com
>>To unsubscribe send email to: Alb-Club-unsubscribe at alb-net.com
>>http://www.alb-net.com/mailman/listinfo/alb-club
>>
>>

_________________________________________________________________
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From ina.dushku at gmail.com  Thu Nov  9 20:45:17 2006
From: ina.dushku at gmail.com (Ina Dushku)
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2006 20:45:17 -0500
Subject: [AlbClub] Trishtimi i Kadarese
In-Reply-To: <BAY106-F28643D74D1D77CD729670091F00@phx.gbl>
References: <e17e70530611081948y33b21faey5bbbfae87fc8595e@mail.gmail.com>
	<BAY106-F28643D74D1D77CD729670091F00@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <e17e70530611091745k8d6c440g6dda2f19b7323cec@mail.gmail.com>

Kurse menyra e re e leximit te asaj qe shkruajne te tjeret eshte ta lexosh
nje here, dy, ndoshta edhe tre, te mos e kuptosh fare, e pastaj te
komentosh.

On 11/9/06, Cun Tirone <cun-tirone at hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>                  *** AlbClub Discussion List ***
>
>
>
>
>
> Mbase keshilla e Kadarese per Qosen eshte ca e vonuar dhe s'ben me fajde.
> Qosja duhet ta kishte bere viziten mjekesore kohe me pare, kur quante
> halen
> e 97' "revolucion te vonuar demokratik." Duke pare bemat e fundit, ku i ka
> hapur librin e shpise Molit, e ku e nxjerr spiun rrugesh, etj., mbase s'ka
> mo dermon.
>
>
>
> Qe t'i kthehemi muhabetit te LIBRAVE, mesa duket kjo eshte menyra e re e
> gjykimit te tyre dhe autoreve perkates, pra duke pare c'thone "ekspertet"
> e
> Top Channel apo Kanali i tope.... Ajo menyra e vjeter qe konsistonte ne
> hapjen e librit faqe me faqe dhe e soditjes se germave ne cdo faqe, duket
> qe
> eshte tejkaluar tashme. Kishte te drejte Marksi kur fliste per rritje
> rendimenti ne kapitalizem.
>
>
>
> Qe eshte mulli me ere e morra vesht - tha, po uji nga i vjen?
> Mbase nga Kanali - iu pergjegj.
>
>
> ?un Tirone
>
>
>
>
> >From: "Ina Dushku" <ina.dushku at gmail.com>
> >To: "Cun Tirone" <cun-tirone at hotmail.com>
> >CC: alb-club at alb-net.com
> >Subject: Re: [AlbClub] Trishtimi i Kadarese
> >Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2006 22:48:42 -0500
> >
> >Por qe te quash Qosen te semure mendor e te cilesosh tolerancen fetare ne
> >Shqiperi si model te percjelle nga gjenetika eshte nje budallallek i
> madh,
> >gjithmone duke perjashtuar mundesine qe gazetaret e Top Channel-it t'ja
> >kene
> >futur kot citimeve. Perfundimisht nuk dua te merrem me Kadarene per ca
> >kohe,
> >madje rrezik ta kthjej "The Successor" pa e lexuar sepse perkthimi mu duk
> i
> >tmerrshem (ndryshe nga pershtypja e Dritanit).
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> All-in-one security and maintenance for your PC.  Get a free 90-day trial!
>
> http://clk.atdmt.com/MSN/go/msnnkwlo0050000002msn/direct/01/?href=http://www.windowsonecare.com/?sc_cid=msn_hotmail
>
>
>
> www.AlbClub.com
> ____________________________________________________
> Alb-Club mailing list: Alb-Club at alb-net.com
> To unsubscribe send email to: Alb-Club-unsubscribe at alb-net.com
> http://www.alb-net.com/mailman/listinfo/alb-club
>
>
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From dritan68 at aol.com  Thu Nov  9 17:56:09 2006
From: dritan68 at aol.com (dritan68 at aol.com)
Date: Thu, 09 Nov 2006 17:56:09 -0500
Subject: [AlbClub] Trishtimi i Kadarese
In-Reply-To: <BAY106-F29CA02239229E16EB9141F91F10@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <8C8D26961B7A614-BC0-5F1A@MBLK-M34.sysops.aol.com>

 Nje pyetje kisha. A e ke lexuar Dimrin dhe nese po, kur (per here te pare)? 
Te siguroj se nuk me intereson aspak mosha jote, por me mire te sqarohemi, 
sesa te kerkojme celesin atje ku ka drite. 
 
?un Tirone "
E kam lexuar aty nga mesi i viteve 80.mbaj mend qe kishte dialoge te epike te "shokut enver" me hrushovin.Eren e ftohte qe vinte nga stepat e rusise.Entuziazmi i shqipove ne kafshimin e dores qe i ushqente.Ndoshta ajo shkeputje nga ruset i shpetoi shqiptaret nga "sovietizimi" si pretendon kadareja.Ne 15 vjet marredhenie me ruset barinjte shqiptare mesuan te fluturonin aeroplane, drejtonin nendetese , te ndertojne hidrocentrale rruge etj.Kuadrot qe u trajnuan ne BS apo mesuan nen specialistet ruse ishin te vetmet kuadro te hajrit qe pati shqiperia.Ajo perleshje me ruset nuk ishte lufte per mbrojtjen e pavaresise si sugjeron Kadareja por lufte per mbrojtjen e pushtetit te Enverit.Hrushovi u perpoq ta heqe si beri me stalinistet e tjere ne europen lindore po ne shqiperi i doli huq.Shqipot i kane qejf burrat e pashem qe fryhen si gjela e keshtu ia perplasin ne fytyre atij e ashtu ia bejne ketij.Ia  perplasi ne fytyre hrushovit shoku Enver pa cope le te behet s'ka rendesi nese ngordhim per buke.Thone qe eshte Dimri i madh eshte monumet i dykuptimesise.Ashtu qofte.Ata qe duan te besojne ne kete kane te drejten e tyre.Per mua nese do te ishte antikomunist i bindur mund te kishte shkruar per ndonje teme tjeter. 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: cun-tirone at hotmail.com
To: alb-club at alb-net.com
Sent: Wed, 8 Nov 2006 1:42 AM
Subject: Re: [AlbClub] Trishtimi i Kadarese


                  *** AlbClub Discussion List ***




Nje pyetje kisha. A e ke lexuar Dimrin dhe nese po, kur (per here te pare)? 
Te siguroj se nuk me intereson aspak mosha jote, por me mire te sqarohemi, 
sesa te kerkojme celesin atje ku ka drite. 
 
?un Tirone 
 
>From: dritan68 at aol.com 
>To: alb-club at alb-net.com 
>Subject: Re: [AlbClub] Trishtimi i Kadarese 
>Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2006 16:05:50 -0500 
> 
> *** AlbClub Discussion List *** 
> 
>kadareja u tregua pak hipokrit ne kritiken ndaj milos.Ai per vete shkroi >dimrin e madh .Nuk besoj se i vune koburen ne koke dhe e detyruan te >shkruante nje liber ku i thurrte lavde enverit per shkeputjen nga ruset e >cila i ngordhi shqiptaret per buke. 
>Megjithate ai mbetet shkrimtar i madh.100 vjet me pas do te kujtohet vetem >per vepren e tij dhe jo per situatat politike ne te cilat jetoi. 
 
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www.AlbClub.com
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Alb-Club mailing list: Alb-Club at alb-net.com
To unsubscribe send email to: Alb-Club-unsubscribe at alb-net.com
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From Fisnik21 at aol.com  Thu Nov  9 16:12:17 2006
From: Fisnik21 at aol.com (Fisnik21 at aol.com)
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2006 16:12:17 EST
Subject: [AlbClub] Trishtimi i Kadarese
Message-ID: <c18.83c7752.3284f3b1@aol.com>

 
Tani po degjoj intervisten e Janulla Rrapit, mbi ceshtjen Kadare. Si  histori 
me duket plotesisht e besueshme. Me duket interesant fakti mbi statutory  
rape. Ata ishin te dy te mitur dhe is e tille, nuk ka ligj ne Amerike per te  
denuar dike. Keshtu qe ju lutem mos na dilni ne mbrojtje te ketij ligji. Me  
duket interesante qe njerezit akoma vazhdojne te mbrojne e diskutojne me idene e  
kultit te individit. Eshte fakt qe te gjithe e dine qe Kadareja eshte nje  
shkrimtar i madh, dhe nese e njeh permes letrave, ai eshte vertet i  
mrekullueshem. Por nuk mund te presesh nga askush te jete perfekt kudo. Kjo  eshte nje 
ceshtje personale nga nje ane, por nga ana tjeter, kur kjo ceshtje u  hap, dhe u 
be ceshtje publike, per me teper kur Kadareja eshte nje person  publik. Per 
mua kjo eshte nje shembje e idhujve per disa, por per disa te tjere,  nuk ka 
rendesi, shkrimtari vleresohet nga vlera e librave dhe letrave. 
 
 
In a message dated 11/7/2006 4:36:21 AM Central European Standard Ti,  
dxhezo at aol.com writes:

*** AlbClub Discussion  List ***





<<
Le t? jemi t? sinqert?. Intervista e  Kadares? ishte banale, fund e krye 
banale. P?r nivelin e shkrimtarit Kadare  ishte madje e turpshme. Fajin nuk mund t?
ia v?m? intervistuesit, por vet?  Kadares?, i cili mund t?i kishte t?rhequr 
v?mendjen gazetarit duke i th?n?: ?I  nderuar gazetar, p?r hir t? inteligjenc?s 
s? shikuesve le t? flasim p?r gj?ra  m? t? r?nd?sishme: p.sh. p?r artin, 
let?rsin?, shoq?rin?, shqiptarin?, etj.  Un? k?tu jam n? studio televizive, jo n? 
klubin e kombinatit t? tekstileve  Stalin dhe as n? bar/restorantin modern  
Berluskoni?.
Mir?po Kadareja parap?lqeu t? thot? fjali  t? tilla si: ?More qen bir qeni, 
pse paska r?nd?si q? kritikohem un?, ?far?  jam un?, Hitler jam un??.
Personalisht e ndjej veten n? siklet. Por  jo p?r Kadaren?. P?r mua ka vite 
q? Kadareja shkrimtar i magjish?m ec?n n?  binar? t? ndrysh?m nga Kadareja 
individ apo person publiko/politik. E ndjej  veten n? siklet p?r ata q? e mbrojn? 
Kadaren? nga kritika, duke e ngritur at?  mbi vet? kritik?n si parim.
>>

Qe te jemi fare, fare te sinqerte, do te na  duhet ta pranojme se per disa 
njerez, cfaredo qe te thoshte Kadareja, cilado  qe te kete qene ngjarja per te 
cilen diskutohet pas 20 vjetesh, Kadareja  perseri do te ngelet me faj, ndoshta 
per arsye qe nuk kane fare te bejne  me  ato cka  diskutohet. Tjetri eshte 
vene - sic u tha ketu - para  nje gjyqi popullor, perpara furise se shtypit, dhe 
nuk ngeli gjysem-analist e  gjysem-gazetar me gjysem-balluke ne balle, pa na 
u ngritur ne kete mbledhje  fronti, e te recitoje indinjaten e tij te thelle 
ndaj Kadarese. Tjetri thirret  ne interviste ne tv, i behen pyetje, e 
trajtohet, dhe i pritet fjala, tamam  sikur dikush ti bertiste nga salla: "zbertheu 
para kolektivit, burgjez!" Dhe  po te filloje Kadareja te flase per artin, 
letersine etj., atehere  inkuizitoret e kane gati ate formulen tjeter: "O, tashti 
filloi e po na flet  per artin e gjepura te tjera, i shmanget muhabetit se e ka 
mizen nen kesule,  do ta ktheje atje ku i vete me mire, po neve nuk na e hedh 
dot dobici".  Pishakut i duket banale intervista e Kadarese, por nuk i duket 
aspak banal i  gjithe ky proces denigrimi i porositur ne shtyp. Ndoshta i duket 
banale  intervista, pasi i akuzuari vendosi ti pergjigjet drejtperdrejt dhe 
hapur,  banaliteteve me te cilat i eshte dashur te perballet. Damned if you do, 
damned  if you don't! Tha.

Kadare ka folur per artin, e letersine e shoqerine e  gjithe te tjerat, kur 
ka qene vakti, por akuzuesit nuk jane aspak te  interesuar per keto. Cfare 
kritikash? Qe te vjen nje e shkalluar dhe te thyen  dritaret e deren e shtepise 
dhe te kerkon me dhune vajzen 15-vjecare per nuse,  duke te uluritur, duke te 
kercenuar, e duke te share nga rruga? Sipas vete  fjaleve te kesaj Janulles, 
djali i saj paska konsumuar vepren penale te  kryerjes se marrdhenieve seksuale 
me nje te mitur (statutory rape) dhe ajo  vete paska konsumuar vepren penale te 
ndihmes dhe inkurajimit te ketij akti.  Pervec dhunimit te baneses, prishjes 
se qetesise publike, dhe kercenimit e  ofendimit te personit. Te dy pra, ne 
cdo shtet demokratik, duhej te kishin  perfunduar ne burg. Vetem ne nje shtet 
diktatorial, ku diktatures i  interesonte ti mbante nen presion intelektualet, 
kjo u denua me nje "slap on  the wrist", pune riedukuese per dy muaj, per tu 
lene e lire edhe per dy vjet  te tjera, qe te vazhdonte zullumet qe kishte 
nisur. Tani na del ne kete  histori edhe nje ish-juriste e Kuvendit, e cila ne vend 
qe te futet sa me  thelle poshte ndonje rrogozi, na dalka hapur te deklaroje 
tru-shkulesine dhe  mungesen e saj te profesionalizmit, teksa paska mbrojtur 
nje akt te tille ne  instancat me te larta te shtetit, per arsye jashte-ligjore 
(sepse ia paska  kerkuar mamaja per hir te nje borxhi te vjeter qe i kishte 
gjyshit te  Janulles). I mean come-the-fkn-on! Per me teper, sipas ligjeve ne 
Amerike, ky  Renatua, do te duhej te regjistrohej si "sex-offender" ne lagjen 
ne te cilen  jeton aktualisht, ne rajonin e policise, pune etj, dhe ky 
regjistrim do te  duhej ta ndiqte nga pas kudo qe te vente. Per gjithe jeten. Une them 
qe  Kadareja, shume i njerezishem qenka treguar, teksa paska kerkuar me 
shkrim qe  ta lene te lire. E paskan futur ne cmendine kete djale? Po shume mire e 
paskan  bere, per ta kuruar, kur ky e kish provuar ne publik, mu ne mes te 
Tiranes,  cmendurine e tij.

Po, na sqaroni kete, o kritikues te medhenj: Qysh  paska mundesi, qe kjo 
grua, te lihet e lire per dy vjet, qe te vazhdoje te  bertase e te ulurase perpara 
shtepise se nje funksionari te larte te shtetit?  Nuk ishte se ne Shqiperi 
kishte procese te gjata gjyqesore, ku vazhdonin  seancat me vite te tera, me 
argumenta e kunder-argumenta te holla ligjore. Ne  ate kohe, po te zune, ta vune. 
Buke, te thoje nuk ka ne dyqan, perfundoje ne  Spac per 
agjitacion-propagande. Atehere me sa di une, as avokat mbrojtes nuk  ka pasur ne seancat gjyqesore. 
Atehere, si paska mundesi?


dritan68,  tha:
<<kadareja u tregua pak hipokrit ne kritiken ndaj milos.Ai per  vete shkroi 
dimrin e madh .Nuk besoj se i vune koburen ne koke dhe e detyruan  te shkruante 
nje liber ku i thurrte lavde enverit per shkeputjen nga ruset e  cila i 
ngordhi shqiptaret per buke.>>

Padyshim, faji perseri  Kadarese i ngelet. Ai me duket se botoi nje variant 
tjeter te "dimrit" me  pare, po e derguan per nja dy a tre vjet andej nga Fieri 
apo nga Berati, qe ti  vinte gishtin kokes e ta rishkruante ate liber. Po e 
beri si e beri, nga qejfi  apo nga zori, ajo ishte kohe tjeter. Po ju cfare 
alibie keni tani, qe akoma  brohorisni per Enverin, kur e gjithe bota e mori vesh 
se cfare monstre paska  qene. KE nxorri nje rezolute per denimin e krimeve te 
komunizmit, atehere kujt  i sherben ky karshillek kaq blatant, ne mbrojtje te 
katilit.  
  
____________________________________
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(http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/1615326657x4311227241x4298082137/aol?redir=http://www.aol.com/newaol) . Most comprehensive set of 
free  safety and security tools, free access to millions of high-quality videos 
from  across the web, free AOL Mail and  more.



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____________________________________________________
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To unsubscribe send email to:  Alb-Club-unsubscribe at alb-net.com
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From kokonozi at gmail.com  Thu Nov  9 17:08:18 2006
From: kokonozi at gmail.com (D. Kokonozi)
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2006 23:08:18 +0100
Subject: [AlbClub] Burrat e Kabulit
Message-ID: <4e84d6690611091408m1b20aa30ka137c9562b44cac0@mail.gmail.com>

Nje reportazh i A. Rados te revista Nouvel Observateur te ngjethte mishin.
Bente fjale per grate afgane, shume prej te cilave cdo dite digjeshin per se
gjalli, per ti shpetuar trajtimit te rende qe u benin burrat e tyre.

Reportazhi ishte perqendruar te Gololai, nje vajze e re 20 vjece qe u dogj
ne oborrin e shtepise deri ne masen 90 perqind te trupit. Ajo kishte
shprazur nje bidon vaguri mbi vete dhe po vete i kishte vene zjarrin.
zjarrin..

Dhe nderkohe, i shoqi qe ishte ulur pak me tej, as qe i ngiti syte nga
gazeta qe po lexonte. Brenda ne dhome, vjerri dhe vjerra e saj vazhdonin te
ndiqnin nje program te TV-se.

Ata e lane per dy ore rresht vajzen duke agonizuar. U desh te vinte e ema e
saj, qe e kishte lajmeruar dikush, qe te merrte e ta dergonte ne spital.

Ketu autorja tregon se transporti i te djegurave behet naten. Sepse nje grua
kurre nuk duhet te dali nga shtepia pa burka (ferexhe), e meqense nje te
djegure nuk mund tja veshin ate per shkak te plageve, atehere ajo duhet te
transportohet naten...

Me tutje reporterja shkon ne spital dhe aty i thone se raste te tilla ka cdo
dite. Nuk i kuptoj keto grate e sotme, i kishte thene nje plake gazetares,
hane nje dajak dhe i vene zjarrin vetes.

Jane kryesisht gra qe nuk durojne te rrihen kafsherisht nga burrat e tyre,
nga burrat e Kabulit.


DK
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From cun-tirone at hotmail.com  Thu Nov  9 21:43:31 2006
From: cun-tirone at hotmail.com (Cun Tirone)
Date: Thu, 09 Nov 2006 21:43:31 -0500
Subject: [AlbClub] Trishtimi i Kadarese
In-Reply-To: <e17e70530611091831y7e189e76q7c24b07896bfc538@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <BAY106-F3393321D92693A28503BFA91F70@phx.gbl>

Me duket shume e veshtire te dish tine, sa here i lexoj mesazhe une.

Kurse besoj se ka probabilitet shume me te madh te dish
sa here i lecit vete. Po s'ka nevoje te na e thuash here tjeter.

Pra duke krahasuar dy probabilitet, them qe po flet per vehten tende.

Eshte dhe ne traditen e klubit qe seciil flet per vehte,
nuk para perdoret delegimi.


?un Tirone



>From: "Ina Dushku" <ina.dushku at gmail.com>
>To: "Cun Tirone" <cun-tirone at hotmail.com>, Alb-club <alb-club at alb-net.com>
>Subject: Re: [AlbClub] Trishtimi i Kadarese
>Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2006 21:31:44 -0500
>
>cuni cuni, don't do it again: i was talking about you not understanding me
>
>On 11/9/06, Cun Tirone <cun-tirone at hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>Une do te te sugjeroja, te mos harxhosh kaq shume energji.
>>Po s'ta kapi heren e pare mos u lodh me.
>>S'ja vlen te lexosh tre here te njejtin mesazh.
>>
>>
>>?un Tirone
>>
>> >From: "Ina Dushku" <ina.dushku at gmail.com>
>> >To: "Cun Tirone" <cun-tirone at hotmail.com>
>> >CC: alb-club at alb-net.com
>> >Subject: Re: [AlbClub] Trishtimi i Kadarese
>> >Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2006 20:45:17 -0500
>> >
>> >Kurse menyra e re e leximit te asaj qe shkruajne te tjeret eshte ta
>>lexosh
>> >nje here, dy, ndoshta edhe tre, te mos e kuptosh fare, e pastaj te
>> >komentosh.
>> >
>> >On 11/9/06, Cun Tirone <cun-tirone at hotmail.com> wrote:
>> >>
>> >>                  *** AlbClub Discussion List ***
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>Mbase keshilla e Kadarese per Qosen eshte ca e vonuar dhe s'ben me
>>fajde.
>> >>Qosja duhet ta kishte bere viziten mjekesore kohe me pare, kur quante
>> >>halen
>> >>e 97' "revolucion te vonuar demokratik." Duke pare bemat e fundit, ku i
>>ka
>> >>hapur librin e shpise Molit, e ku e nxjerr spiun rrugesh, etj., mbase
>>s'ka
>> >>mo dermon.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>Qe t'i kthehemi muhabetit te LIBRAVE, mesa duket kjo eshte menyra e re 
>>e
>> >>gjykimit te tyre dhe autoreve perkates, pra duke pare c'thone
>>"ekspertet"
>> >>e
>> >>Top Channel apo Kanali i tope.... Ajo menyra e vjeter qe konsistonte ne
>> >>hapjen e librit faqe me faqe dhe e soditjes se germave ne cdo faqe,
>>duket
>> >>qe
>> >>eshte tejkaluar tashme. Kishte te drejte Marksi kur fliste per rritje
>> >>rendimenti ne kapitalizem.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>Qe eshte mulli me ere e morra vesht - tha, po uji nga i vjen?
>> >>Mbase nga Kanali - iu pergjegj.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>?un Tirone
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> >From: "Ina Dushku" <ina.dushku at gmail.com>
>> >> >To: "Cun Tirone" <cun-tirone at hotmail.com>
>> >> >CC: alb-club at alb-net.com
>> >> >Subject: Re: [AlbClub] Trishtimi i Kadarese
>> >> >Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2006 22:48:42 -0500
>> >> >
>> >> >Por qe te quash Qosen te semure mendor e te cilesosh tolerancen 
>>fetare
>> >>ne
>> >> >Shqiperi si model te percjelle nga gjenetika eshte nje budallallek i
>> >>madh,
>> >> >gjithmone duke perjashtuar mundesine qe gazetaret e Top Channel-it
>>t'ja
>> >> >kene
>> >> >futur kot citimeve. Perfundimisht nuk dua te merrem me Kadarene per 
>>ca
>> >> >kohe,
>> >> >madje rrezik ta kthjej "The Successor" pa e lexuar sepse perkthimi mu
>> >>duk
>> >>i
>> >> >tmerrshem (ndryshe nga pershtypja e Dritanit).
>> >>
>> >>_________________________________________________________________
>> >>All-in-one security and maintenance for your PC.  Get a free 90-day
>>trial!
>> >>
>> >>
>>http://clk.atdmt.com/MSN/go/msnnkwlo0050000002msn/direct/01/?href=http://www.windowsonecare.com/?sc_cid=msn_hotmail
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>www.AlbClub.com
>> >>____________________________________________________
>> >>Alb-Club mailing list: Alb-Club at alb-net.com
>> >>To unsubscribe send email to: Alb-Club-unsubscribe at alb-net.com
>> >>http://www.alb-net.com/mailman/listinfo/alb-club
>> >>
>> >>
>>
>>_________________________________________________________________
>>Add a Yahoo! contact to Windows Live Messenger for a chance to win a free
>>trip!
>>
>>http://www.imagine-windowslive.com/minisites/yahoo/default.aspx?locale=en-us&hmtagline
>>
>>

_________________________________________________________________
Try Search Survival Kits: Fix up your home and better handle your cash with 
Live Search! 
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From cun-tirone at hotmail.com  Thu Nov  9 22:16:12 2006
From: cun-tirone at hotmail.com (Cun Tirone)
Date: Thu, 09 Nov 2006 22:16:12 -0500
Subject: [AlbClub] Trishtimi i Kadarese
In-Reply-To: <e17e70530611091903l270291cfrfa2659d461cbe80c@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <BAY106-F67B4D2486B112A00F681391F70@phx.gbl>

Meqe po merresh me rrenjet, po flisnim per Dimrin, dhe une po pyesja dike 
tjeter.
Ti kerceve nga Topi, tek Pasardhesi, deri...ne rolin e fjalorit per te 
shpjeguar kuptimin
tend te fjaleve, si psh delegimi.  Pa permendur berjen e fallxhorit qe 
"sheh" c'ben mileti
me mesazhet e klubit.

Po te pakten u kthjellove me se fundi.

Interneti, mban shume gjera ne kurriz, keshtu qe mos e kurse fare.


?un Tirone

>From: "Ina Dushku" <ina.dushku at gmail.com>
>To: "Cun Tirone" <cun-tirone at hotmail.com>, Alb-club <alb-club at alb-net.com>
>Subject: Re: [AlbClub] Trishtimi i Kadarese
>Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2006 22:03:44 -0500
>
>Ta fillojme nga fundi: delegimi nuk ka lidhje me ate qe thua ti, fjale me e
>pershtatshme mund te ishte p.sh. 'spekullim'. Se dyti, une perdorja fjalen
>'ndoshta' per numrin e leximeve - me ndoshta flitet per te tjeret e jo per
>veten, se vete e di une se sa here i lexoj gjerat. Se fundi, ajo qe nuk
>kuptove ti te fjalia ime per Pasardhesin eshte qe une Pasardhesin po e
>lexoja, po nuk pelqeva ate qe lexova - lidhja me Topin eshte pjelle e
>fantazise tende. Je me i qarte tani?
>
>Po ja le fajin per paqartesine internetit, sepse mendoj se mund te merremi
>te dy me gjera me te mira se ky debat 'cfare thashe une cfare the ti, 
>c'doja
>te thoja une, c'doje te thoje ti'.
>
>Ina
>
>On 11/9/06, Cun Tirone <cun-tirone at hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>Me duket shume e veshtire te dish tine, sa here i lexoj mesazhe une.
>>
>>Kurse besoj se ka probabilitet shume me te madh te dish
>>sa here i lecit vete. Po s'ka nevoje te na e thuash here tjeter.
>>
>>Pra duke krahasuar dy probabilitet, them qe po flet per vehten tende.
>>
>>Eshte dhe ne traditen e klubit qe seciil flet per vehte,
>>nuk para perdoret delegimi.
>>
>>
>>?un Tirone
>>
>>
>>
>> >From: "Ina Dushku" <ina.dushku at gmail.com>
>> >To: "Cun Tirone" <cun-tirone at hotmail.com>, Alb-club 
>><alb-club at alb-net.com
>> >
>> >Subject: Re: [AlbClub] Trishtimi i Kadarese
>> >Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2006 21:31:44 -0500
>> >
>> >cuni cuni, don't do it again: i was talking about you not understanding
>>me
>> >
>> >On 11/9/06, Cun Tirone <cun-tirone at hotmail.com> wrote:
>> >>
>> >>Une do te te sugjeroja, te mos harxhosh kaq shume energji.
>> >>Po s'ta kapi heren e pare mos u lodh me.
>> >>S'ja vlen te lexosh tre here te njejtin mesazh.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>?un Tirone
>> >>
>> >> >From: "Ina Dushku" <ina.dushku at gmail.com>
>> >> >To: "Cun Tirone" <cun-tirone at hotmail.com>
>> >> >CC: alb-club at alb-net.com
>> >> >Subject: Re: [AlbClub] Trishtimi i Kadarese
>> >> >Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2006 20:45:17 -0500
>> >> >
>> >> >Kurse menyra e re e leximit te asaj qe shkruajne te tjeret eshte ta
>> >>lexosh
>> >> >nje here, dy, ndoshta edhe tre, te mos e kuptosh fare, e pastaj te
>> >> >komentosh.
>> >> >
>> >> >On 11/9/06, Cun Tirone <cun-tirone at hotmail.com> wrote:
>> >> >>
>> >> >>                  *** AlbClub Discussion List ***
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >>Mbase keshilla e Kadarese per Qosen eshte ca e vonuar dhe s'ben me
>> >>fajde.
>> >> >>Qosja duhet ta kishte bere viziten mjekesore kohe me pare, kur 
>>quante
>> >> >>halen
>> >> >>e 97' "revolucion te vonuar demokratik." Duke pare bemat e fundit, 
>>ku
>>i
>> >>ka
>> >> >>hapur librin e shpise Molit, e ku e nxjerr spiun rrugesh, etj., 
>>mbase
>> >>s'ka
>> >> >>mo dermon.
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >>Qe t'i kthehemi muhabetit te LIBRAVE, mesa duket kjo eshte menyra e
>>re
>> >>e
>> >> >>gjykimit te tyre dhe autoreve perkates, pra duke pare c'thone
>> >>"ekspertet"
>> >> >>e
>> >> >>Top Channel apo Kanali i tope.... Ajo menyra e vjeter qe konsistonte
>>ne
>> >> >>hapjen e librit faqe me faqe dhe e soditjes se germave ne cdo faqe,
>> >>duket
>> >> >>qe
>> >> >>eshte tejkaluar tashme. Kishte te drejte Marksi kur fliste per 
>>rritje
>> >> >>rendimenti ne kapitalizem.
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >>Qe eshte mulli me ere e morra vesht - tha, po uji nga i vjen?
>> >> >>Mbase nga Kanali - iu pergjegj.
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >>?un Tirone
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >> >From: "Ina Dushku" <ina.dushku at gmail.com>
>> >> >> >To: "Cun Tirone" <cun-tirone at hotmail.com>
>> >> >> >CC: alb-club at alb-net.com
>> >> >> >Subject: Re: [AlbClub] Trishtimi i Kadarese
>> >> >> >Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2006 22:48:42 -0500
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >Por qe te quash Qosen te semure mendor e te cilesosh tolerancen
>> >>fetare
>> >> >>ne
>> >> >> >Shqiperi si model te percjelle nga gjenetika eshte nje budallallek
>>i
>> >> >>madh,
>> >> >> >gjithmone duke perjashtuar mundesine qe gazetaret e Top Channel-it
>> >>t'ja
>> >> >> >kene
>> >> >> >futur kot citimeve. Perfundimisht nuk dua te merrem me Kadarene 
>>per
>> >>ca
>> >> >> >kohe,
>> >> >> >madje rrezik ta kthjej "The Successor" pa e lexuar sepse perkthimi
>>mu
>> >> >>duk
>> >> >>i
>> >> >> >tmerrshem (ndryshe nga pershtypja e Dritanit).
>> >> >>
>> >> >>_________________________________________________________________
>> >> >>All-in-one security and maintenance for your PC.  Get a free 90-day
>> >>trial!
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >>
>>http://clk.atdmt.com/MSN/go/msnnkwlo0050000002msn/direct/01/?href=http://www.windowsonecare.com/?sc_cid=msn_hotmail
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >>www.AlbClub.com
>> >> >>____________________________________________________
>> >> >>Alb-Club mailing list: Alb-Club at alb-net.com
>> >> >>To unsubscribe send email to: Alb-Club-unsubscribe at alb-net.com
>> >> >>http://www.alb-net.com/mailman/listinfo/alb-club
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >>
>> >>_________________________________________________________________
>> >>Add a Yahoo! contact to Windows Live Messenger for a chance to win a
>>free
>> >>trip!
>> >>
>> >>
>>http://www.imagine-windowslive.com/minisites/yahoo/default.aspx?locale=en-us&hmtagline
>> >>
>> >>
>>
>>_________________________________________________________________
>>Try Search Survival Kits: Fix up your home and better handle your cash
>>with
>>Live Search!
>>
>>http://imagine-windowslive.com/search/kits/default.aspx?kit=improve&locale=en-US&source=hmtagline
>>
>>

_________________________________________________________________
Find a local pizza place, music store, museum and more?then map the best 
route!  http://local.live.com?FORM=MGA001



From fmyrtaj at sympatico.ca  Thu Nov  9 22:20:11 2006
From: fmyrtaj at sympatico.ca (Faruk Myrtaj)
Date: Thu, 09 Nov 2006 22:20:11 -0500
Subject: [AlbClub] Endrra e kuajve
In-Reply-To: <BAY106-F40049B81A4BC03A0ADE5391F00@phx.gbl>
References: <BAY106-F40049B81A4BC03A0ADE5391F00@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <op.tir57xw9y7md41@franz>


Ke shume te drejte ne kete ndjesi te shperfaqur me humor te dhimbshem.

Tashme, ne kete situate, s'mund te shmagemi perballe fakteve te dhunshem:  
do behemi te gjithe kombetarist!

Une dhe kryeministri e kishim kuptuar ndryshe zedhenesin e qeverise greke:  
sikur ajo u dhuronte shtetesine shqiptareve ne Athine.

Madje, une shkova ndermend se ata, greket pra, kishin ndermend ta linin  
Shqiperine pa zgjedhes: kot te beheshin dy pale zgjedhje. me mire jepu  
shtetsine greke edhe shqiptareve, dhe behen nje pale zgjedhje, europiane,  
pa falsifikime, pa KQZ, pa perleshje ne Parlamentin shqiptar.

Me tej akoma, prej ketyre shqiptareve tashme me pasha-porte greke, ca do  
te zgjidheshin lirshem si deputete ne parlamentin grek, per te rikrijuar  
imazhin
e legjendes per kontributin e shqiptareve ne pavaresimin dhe ngritjen e  
shtetit grek. Meqe edhe Juropa kishte zene ngoje minoritetet ne greqi,  
greket shkuan edhe me tej: po kujdesen per tere popullin minoritar jetim  
shqiptar...

Nuk di ende reagimin e Ministrise se jashtme Shqiptare: kam frike se jane  
duke u marrw me ndonje reagim te ri ndaj Ismail Kadarese; ose, meqe eshte  
stine hapje-dosjesh kane probleme me te rendesishme se ai me fqinjin e  
ngrohte jugor.

Por mund te jete edhe me indirekte kjo mesele: mbase kemi rene dakord qe,  
per kembim qe Tiranes po i japin Kosoven, ajo eshte gati ta lere jashte  
kufijve tere Gjinokastren, me tere argjiro-kastritet, ku jane e ku s'jane.  
Keshtu Kadareja shmang fatin e keq qe vjen nga nje populli vogel, por edhe  
te tjerat bjene rehat pa Kadarene, qe i ka bere te tere ziliqare, jeloze  
dhe psikopate...

Nga ana tjeter, se? kam nje merak per shendetin e fqinjeve une: sa here qe  
ndjejne se kane per te pesuar nje drejtesi, ata sajojne ndonje rreng.
Dhe, s'mund te mos behemi serioz kur themi sa per muhabet: nuk eshte e  
lehte te behesh burre shteti ne Shqiperi...

faruk Myrtaj




On Thu, 09 Nov 2006 16:58:21 -0500, Cun Tirone <cun-tirone at hotmail.com>  
wrote:

>                   *** AlbClub Discussion List ***
>
>
>




From ina.dushku at gmail.com  Thu Nov  9 21:31:44 2006
From: ina.dushku at gmail.com (Ina Dushku)
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2006 21:31:44 -0500
Subject: [AlbClub] Trishtimi i Kadarese
In-Reply-To: <BAY106-F245A5D505A77BEC2513D1991F70@phx.gbl>
References: <e17e70530611091745k8d6c440g6dda2f19b7323cec@mail.gmail.com>
	<BAY106-F245A5D505A77BEC2513D1991F70@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <e17e70530611091831y7e189e76q7c24b07896bfc538@mail.gmail.com>

cuni cuni, don't do it again: i was talking about you not understanding me

On 11/9/06, Cun Tirone <cun-tirone at hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> Une do te te sugjeroja, te mos harxhosh kaq shume energji.
> Po s'ta kapi heren e pare mos u lodh me.
> S'ja vlen te lexosh tre here te njejtin mesazh.
>
>
> ?un Tirone
>
> >From: "Ina Dushku" <ina.dushku at gmail.com>
> >To: "Cun Tirone" <cun-tirone at hotmail.com>
> >CC: alb-club at alb-net.com
> >Subject: Re: [AlbClub] Trishtimi i Kadarese
> >Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2006 20:45:17 -0500
> >
> >Kurse menyra e re e leximit te asaj qe shkruajne te tjeret eshte ta
> lexosh
> >nje here, dy, ndoshta edhe tre, te mos e kuptosh fare, e pastaj te
> >komentosh.
> >
> >On 11/9/06, Cun Tirone <cun-tirone at hotmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >>                  *** AlbClub Discussion List ***
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>Mbase keshilla e Kadarese per Qosen eshte ca e vonuar dhe s'ben me
> fajde.
> >>Qosja duhet ta kishte bere viziten mjekesore kohe me pare, kur quante
> >>halen
> >>e 97' "revolucion te vonuar demokratik." Duke pare bemat e fundit, ku i
> ka
> >>hapur librin e shpise Molit, e ku e nxjerr spiun rrugesh, etj., mbase
> s'ka
> >>mo dermon.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>Qe t'i kthehemi muhabetit te LIBRAVE, mesa duket kjo eshte menyra e re e
> >>gjykimit te tyre dhe autoreve perkates, pra duke pare c'thone
> "ekspertet"
> >>e
> >>Top Channel apo Kanali i tope.... Ajo menyra e vjeter qe konsistonte ne
> >>hapjen e librit faqe me faqe dhe e soditjes se germave ne cdo faqe,
> duket
> >>qe
> >>eshte tejkaluar tashme. Kishte te drejte Marksi kur fliste per rritje
> >>rendimenti ne kapitalizem.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>Qe eshte mulli me ere e morra vesht - tha, po uji nga i vjen?
> >>Mbase nga Kanali - iu pergjegj.
> >>
> >>
> >>?un Tirone
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> >From: "Ina Dushku" <ina.dushku at gmail.com>
> >> >To: "Cun Tirone" <cun-tirone at hotmail.com>
> >> >CC: alb-club at alb-net.com
> >> >Subject: Re: [AlbClub] Trishtimi i Kadarese
> >> >Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2006 22:48:42 -0500
> >> >
> >> >Por qe te quash Qosen te semure mendor e te cilesosh tolerancen fetare
> >>ne
> >> >Shqiperi si model te percjelle nga gjenetika eshte nje budallallek i
> >>madh,
> >> >gjithmone duke perjashtuar mundesine qe gazetaret e Top Channel-it
> t'ja
> >> >kene
> >> >futur kot citimeve. Perfundimisht nuk dua te merrem me Kadarene per ca
> >> >kohe,
> >> >madje rrezik ta kthjej "The Successor" pa e lexuar sepse perkthimi mu
> >>duk
> >>i
> >> >tmerrshem (ndryshe nga pershtypja e Dritanit).
> >>
> >>_________________________________________________________________
> >>All-in-one security and maintenance for your PC.  Get a free 90-day
> trial!
> >>
> >>
> http://clk.atdmt.com/MSN/go/msnnkwlo0050000002msn/direct/01/?href=http://www.windowsonecare.com/?sc_cid=msn_hotmail
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>www.AlbClub.com
> >>____________________________________________________
> >>Alb-Club mailing list: Alb-Club at alb-net.com
> >>To unsubscribe send email to: Alb-Club-unsubscribe at alb-net.com
> >>http://www.alb-net.com/mailman/listinfo/alb-club
> >>
> >>
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Add a Yahoo! contact to Windows Live Messenger for a chance to win a free
> trip!
>
> http://www.imagine-windowslive.com/minisites/yahoo/default.aspx?locale=en-us&hmtagline
>
>
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From ina.dushku at gmail.com  Thu Nov  9 22:03:44 2006
From: ina.dushku at gmail.com (Ina Dushku)
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2006 22:03:44 -0500
Subject: [AlbClub] Trishtimi i Kadarese
In-Reply-To: <BAY106-F3393321D92693A28503BFA91F70@phx.gbl>
References: <e17e70530611091831y7e189e76q7c24b07896bfc538@mail.gmail.com>
	<BAY106-F3393321D92693A28503BFA91F70@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <e17e70530611091903l270291cfrfa2659d461cbe80c@mail.gmail.com>

Ta fillojme nga fundi: delegimi nuk ka lidhje me ate qe thua ti, fjale me e
pershtatshme mund te ishte p.sh. 'spekullim'. Se dyti, une perdorja fjalen
'ndoshta' per numrin e leximeve - me ndoshta flitet per te tjeret e jo per
veten, se vete e di une se sa here i lexoj gjerat. Se fundi, ajo qe nuk
kuptove ti te fjalia ime per Pasardhesin eshte qe une Pasardhesin po e
lexoja, po nuk pelqeva ate qe lexova - lidhja me Topin eshte pjelle e
fantazise tende. Je me i qarte tani?

Po ja le fajin per paqartesine internetit, sepse mendoj se mund te merremi
te dy me gjera me te mira se ky debat 'cfare thashe une cfare the ti, c'doja
te thoja une, c'doje te thoje ti'.

Ina

On 11/9/06, Cun Tirone <cun-tirone at hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> Me duket shume e veshtire te dish tine, sa here i lexoj mesazhe une.
>
> Kurse besoj se ka probabilitet shume me te madh te dish
> sa here i lecit vete. Po s'ka nevoje te na e thuash here tjeter.
>
> Pra duke krahasuar dy probabilitet, them qe po flet per vehten tende.
>
> Eshte dhe ne traditen e klubit qe seciil flet per vehte,
> nuk para perdoret delegimi.
>
>
> ?un Tirone
>
>
>
> >From: "Ina Dushku" <ina.dushku at gmail.com>
> >To: "Cun Tirone" <cun-tirone at hotmail.com>, Alb-club <alb-club at alb-net.com
> >
> >Subject: Re: [AlbClub] Trishtimi i Kadarese
> >Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2006 21:31:44 -0500
> >
> >cuni cuni, don't do it again: i was talking about you not understanding
> me
> >
> >On 11/9/06, Cun Tirone <cun-tirone at hotmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >>Une do te te sugjeroja, te mos harxhosh kaq shume energji.
> >>Po s'ta kapi heren e pare mos u lodh me.
> >>S'ja vlen te lexosh tre here te njejtin mesazh.
> >>
> >>
> >>?un Tirone
> >>
> >> >From: "Ina Dushku" <ina.dushku at gmail.com>
> >> >To: "Cun Tirone" <cun-tirone at hotmail.com>
> >> >CC: alb-club at alb-net.com
> >> >Subject: Re: [AlbClub] Trishtimi i Kadarese
> >> >Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2006 20:45:17 -0500
> >> >
> >> >Kurse menyra e re e leximit te asaj qe shkruajne te tjeret eshte ta
> >>lexosh
> >> >nje here, dy, ndoshta edhe tre, te mos e kuptosh fare, e pastaj te
> >> >komentosh.
> >> >
> >> >On 11/9/06, Cun Tirone <cun-tirone at hotmail.com> wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >>                  *** AlbClub Discussion List ***
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>Mbase keshilla e Kadarese per Qosen eshte ca e vonuar dhe s'ben me
> >>fajde.
> >> >>Qosja duhet ta kishte bere viziten mjekesore kohe me pare, kur quante
> >> >>halen
> >> >>e 97' "revolucion te vonuar demokratik." Duke pare bemat e fundit, ku
> i
> >>ka
> >> >>hapur librin e shpise Molit, e ku e nxjerr spiun rrugesh, etj., mbase
> >>s'ka
> >> >>mo dermon.
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>Qe t'i kthehemi muhabetit te LIBRAVE, mesa duket kjo eshte menyra e
> re
> >>e
> >> >>gjykimit te tyre dhe autoreve perkates, pra duke pare c'thone
> >>"ekspertet"
> >> >>e
> >> >>Top Channel apo Kanali i tope.... Ajo menyra e vjeter qe konsistonte
> ne
> >> >>hapjen e librit faqe me faqe dhe e soditjes se germave ne cdo faqe,
> >>duket
> >> >>qe
> >> >>eshte tejkaluar tashme. Kishte te drejte Marksi kur fliste per rritje
> >> >>rendimenti ne kapitalizem.
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>Qe eshte mulli me ere e morra vesht - tha, po uji nga i vjen?
> >> >>Mbase nga Kanali - iu pergjegj.
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>?un Tirone
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> >From: "Ina Dushku" <ina.dushku at gmail.com>
> >> >> >To: "Cun Tirone" <cun-tirone at hotmail.com>
> >> >> >CC: alb-club at alb-net.com
> >> >> >Subject: Re: [AlbClub] Trishtimi i Kadarese
> >> >> >Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2006 22:48:42 -0500
> >> >> >
> >> >> >Por qe te quash Qosen te semure mendor e te cilesosh tolerancen
> >>fetare
> >> >>ne
> >> >> >Shqiperi si model te percjelle nga gjenetika eshte nje budallallek
> i
> >> >>madh,
> >> >> >gjithmone duke perjashtuar mundesine qe gazetaret e Top Channel-it
> >>t'ja
> >> >> >kene
> >> >> >futur kot citimeve. Perfundimisht nuk dua te merrem me Kadarene per
> >>ca
> >> >> >kohe,
> >> >> >madje rrezik ta kthjej "The Successor" pa e lexuar sepse perkthimi
> mu
> >> >>duk
> >> >>i
> >> >> >tmerrshem (ndryshe nga pershtypja e Dritanit).
> >> >>
> >> >>_________________________________________________________________
> >> >>All-in-one security and maintenance for your PC.  Get a free 90-day
> >>trial!
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >>
> http://clk.atdmt.com/MSN/go/msnnkwlo0050000002msn/direct/01/?href=http://www.windowsonecare.com/?sc_cid=msn_hotmail
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>www.AlbClub.com
> >> >>____________________________________________________
> >> >>Alb-Club mailing list: Alb-Club at alb-net.com
> >> >>To unsubscribe send email to: Alb-Club-unsubscribe at alb-net.com
> >> >>http://www.alb-net.com/mailman/listinfo/alb-club
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >>
> >>_________________________________________________________________
> >>Add a Yahoo! contact to Windows Live Messenger for a chance to win a
> free
> >>trip!
> >>
> >>
> http://www.imagine-windowslive.com/minisites/yahoo/default.aspx?locale=en-us&hmtagline
> >>
> >>
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Try Search Survival Kits: Fix up your home and better handle your cash
> with
> Live Search!
>
> http://imagine-windowslive.com/search/kits/default.aspx?kit=improve&locale=en-US&source=hmtagline
>
>
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From dxhezo at aol.com  Fri Nov 10 01:44:23 2006
From: dxhezo at aol.com (dxhezo at aol.com)
Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2006 01:44:23 -0500
Subject: [AlbClub] Vorio-Epiri Diplomatik
In-Reply-To: <d1e7b6ac0611091056h6a286b0aic07f59261060a61@mail.gmail.com>
References: <d1e7b6ac0611090829y5331acf1i1a56ccc76a5db5c@mail.gmail.com>	<20061109170218.49855.qmail@web35808.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<d1e7b6ac0611091056h6a286b0aic07f59261060a61@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <8C8D2AACB110E4F-230-8287@FWM-D31.sysops.aol.com>

 Disa gjera qe thote Barka ne shkrimin e tij qe jane me te vertete rrenqethese. Si, psh:
 
 <<Konstatimi i b?r? koh?t e fundit se shqiptar?t konvertonin p?rkat?sin? fetare jo p?r shkak t? besimit, por p?r shkak t? interesit, ?sht? n? k?t? rast i vlefsh?m edhe p?r elementin nd?rgjegj?sor t? p?rkat?sis? etnike dhe jo vet?m n? lidhje me minoritetin, por edhe m? gjer?. K?shtu q? asnj? mjet politik nuk mund t? frenoj? fenomene t? k?saj natyre.>>  
 Dmth ne nje menyre ose ne nje tjeter, Barka i shikon homogjenet potenciale, ne nje hapesire shume me te gjere se sa minoriteti grek. Dhe gjendjet civile te Shqiperise, edhe sikur me te ndershmet te jene, nuk hyjne fare me ne pune, pasi per ta marre ate karte dhe per tu deklaruar si grek, mjaftoka edhe vetem dokumenti i pagezimit, te cilin po Janullatosi e ka ne dore. Dhe natyrisht edhe duhet te provosh besnikerine ndaj helenizmit. Kjo pervecse - ashtu sic tha xhaxhai - krijon dy kasta te pabarabarta qytetaresh ne Shqiperi, i jep qeverise greke mjetet e duhura per ta trazuar popullsine e Shqiperise si ti deshiroje qejfi, edhe pa u marre fare me keto kukullat qeveritare me te cilat eshte marre deri tani. Do Greqia te kete 1 milione qytetare te saj brenda territorit te Shqiperise? Fare lehte mund ta realizoje kete per dy ose tre vjet, dhe te mos thoje njeri qe keta nuk u bene greke pa deshiren e tyre. Barka e ka shume mire kur thote se shqiptaret me deshire e nderruan perkatesine fetare, dhe me deshire do ta nderrojne edhe perkatesine etnike.
 
 Ajo qe dua te dij eshte se cfare bisedoi dhe cfare marveshjesh te fshehta beri Berisha kur ishte ne Athine. Kjo ka lidhje direkte me ate vizite, pasi ministri i brendshem grek tha se "a lingering problem was addressed" (ert.gr) dhe se kjo erdhi pas bisedimeve me qeverine shqiptare dhe ndryshimeve konstitucionale. Ambasadori i Shqiperise ne Athine, ben te paditurin, dhe Berisha vet flet sikur nuk e ka idene se per cfare eshte fjala. Dhe nuk eshte hera e pare qe ndodh kjo, qe marreveshjet njoftohen kur jane bere fakt i kryer; para disa kohesh, publiku shqiptar papritur e pakujtuar u gjend para suprizes se qeveria e Shqiperise kishte rene dakort me Greqine per ndryshimin e tekseve te historise qe mesohet ne shkollat shqiptare, per te hequr sic u tha shtremberimet historike. Dhe kete e mesoi jo nga zyrtaret shqiptare, por nga ata greke, ashtu sic mesoi edhe kete bomben e fundit.
 
 Me rastin e vizites se shtatorit, per shtypin u thane disa fjale te pergjithshme per marrdheniet dypaleshe, u ideua nje hekurudhe hipotetike qe do te duhej te lidhte te dy vendet ne te ardhmen, u pergezuan mardheniet energjitike etj. Kyeministri grek iu referua gjithashtu edhe "c?shtjeve q? lidhen me pakicat greke q? jetojn? n? vendin fqinj" por pa u futur ne hollesira. Lajmi i ketij takimi, ndodhet ne kete faqje: http://www.keshilliministrave.al/shqip/lajm.asp?id=6636 
 
 Ne kete lajm zyrtar nuk ndodhet as edhe nje fjale qe te permendi keto bisedime te cilave u referohet pala greke. Nuk eshte ne traditen e institucioneve shqiptare qe transkriptet e ketyre bisedave t'i vihen ne dispozicion publikut, dhe as ne eksperiencen e medias qe ti kerkoje keto transkripte. Rrjedhimisht, edhe ajo se cfare diskutohet apo vendoset ne keto takime, nuk ka rrezik te debatohet me gjere ne publik, me te mirat apo te keqijat qe i sjellin vendit keto vendime. Ne hije eshte publiku edhe persa i perket perfitimeve personale qe mund te nxjerrin "negociatoret", duke negociuar ceshtje qe mesa duket, ata nuk kane interes t'ia bejne te ditura publikut. Psh, nje raport i vaket por jo kritikues nga institucionet nderkombetare mund te jete mjaft i vlefshem personalisht per nje politikan, por nuk ben asgje per vendin aq me teper po te vihet ne balance me rrezikun e marrveshjeve te fshehta.
 
 Kjo mungese blatante e transparences institucionale eshte rast tipik i korrupsionit politik. Dmth, kur dikush e perdor postin qeveritar, per tu mbeshtetur ne menyre te jashte-ligjeshme ne nje konfiguracion forcash qe perceptohen se jane te rendesishme ne ruajtjen e ketij posti per veten e vet. Ne shoqeri me tradita te dobeta demokratike, mungesa e transparences qeveritare e ben edhe me te lehte qe zyrtare te pandershem, te mbeshteten ne forca te cilat qendrojne jashte sferes se influences se zgjedhesve, ne kembim te se ciles mbeshtetje ata marrin vendime e nenshkruajne marrveshje te cilat nuk jane ne interesin e pergjithshem te ketyre zgjedhesve, shpesh here fshehtas dijenise se zgjedhesve. Prandaj, i takon Berishes si kreu i qeverise qe paska qene pale ne keto marrveshje, te sqaroje publikun se per cfare konkretisht eshte biseduar dhe cilat jane keto garanci per te cilat flet pala greke, si dhe ti beje publike transkriptet e bisedave. Ne te njejten kohe, qeveria e Shqiperise duhet te marre te gjitha masat per te perballuar rrezikun qe i vjen integritetit te Republikes, nga nje situate e tille, pasi kjo eshte detyre e saj konstitucionale. Ne te kunderten, zgjedhesit kane plotesisht te drejte te kerkojne koken e Sali Berishes ne tepsi te argjendte.
 
 Si mund te perballohet nje situate e tille? Meqenese Greqia ka vendosur te fusi duart direkt ne popullaten e Republikes se Shqiperise, dhe i jep i vetes te drejte te caktoje kush mund te jete grek aty, jashte kontrollit te institucioneve shqiptare, atehere edhe Shqiperia ka te drejte ta eliminoje dyshtetesine, dhe ti pajisi shqiptaret etnike, ashtu sic e percakton ajo nje shqiptar etnik, me karta te ngjashme "homogjeniteti" qe u jep atyre te njejtat te drejta me ate te shtetesise se humbur. Dhe si shtet sovran Shqiperia ka plotesisht te drejte, te vendose nje regjim vizash reciproke me cilin do vend tjeter, dhe ti vendosi vete kriteret per dhenien e ketyre vizave.
 
 
 
  
 -----Original Message-----
 From: no.elevator at gmail.com
 To: leila_0618 at yahoo.com
 Cc: Alb-Club at alb-net.com
 Sent: Thu, 9 Nov 2006 1:56 PM
 Subject: Re: [AlbClub] Vorio-Epiri Diplomatik
 
                    *** AlbClub Discussion List ***



    L., kam frik? se po flasim p?r gj?ra t? ndryshme. Lexo t? lutem nj? artikull t? Panajot Bark?s sot n? gazet?n "Shqip": http://gazeta-shqip.com/artikull.php?id=5826 P?r t? par? si shtrohet ??shtja. Nuk ?sht? fjala p?r t'u njohur shtet?sin? greke qytetar?ve shqiptar? t? minoritetit n? Greqi (who cares?), por p?r t'u njohur shtet?sin? greke qytetar?ve shqiptar? t? minoritetit grek n? Shqip?ri.  "Vendimi i Athin?s p?r t'u dh?n? shtet?sin? greke an?tar?ve t? minoritetit grek n? Shqip?ri, duhet par? si nj? dritare q? i hapet Shqip?ris? p?r n? Evrop?" thot? Barka. Kjo nuk m? duket se lidhet me emigracionin nga Shqip?ria n? Greqi.  "Vendimi i qeveris? greke p?r t'i dh?n? edhe shtet?si greke an?tar?ve t? komunitetit t? minoritetit etnik grek n? Shqip?ri, p?rb?n nj? risi t? re jo vet?m p?r Shqip?rin? apo Greqin? dhe marr?dh?niet midis tyre, por p?r gjith? Ballkanin. Mbi t? gjitha, b?het fjal? p?r nj? risi pozitive. Nj? pjes? e popullsis? s? nj? vendi (nuk ka r?nd?si numri) b?het, p?r shkak t? etnis? s? vet, pjes? e Bashkimit Evropian." ?'t? thuash m? tep?r se kaq? Si u b?ka nj? pjes? e popullsis? s? nj? vendi sovran pjes? e Bashkimit Evropian? Po pse, bashkim etnish, ?sht? Bashkimi Evropian? T? thuash gjepura t? tilla n? publik pa t'u dridhur qerpiku, don t? thot? se i ke shpatullat p?rnjimend shum?, shum? t? ngrohta. Vazhdon Barka: "N? k?t? kuad?r jan? t? pakuptimta rezervat dhe dyshimet e shfaqura si shprehje e nj? nacionalizmi t? tejshkuar. N? k?t? rast, reagimet e k?tij standardi jo vet?m q? e mbajn? peng n? streha nacionaliste opinionin publik shqiptar, por, duke qen? nj? vazhdim?si, po kthehen n? mjet presioni nacionalist mbi an?tar?t e minoriteti etnik grek. N? k?t? rast, kan? p?r motiv real zilin? provinciale q? rrjedh nga privilegjet q? sjell nj? pasaport? evropiane."  Thua se vendimi i qeveris? greke nuk qenka frym?zuar nga nacionalizmi grek! P?rkundrazi, reagimet shqiptare, duke p?rfshir? modestisht edhe timin, kan? t? b?jn? me shqet?simin p?r t? ruajtur integritetin e Shqip?ris? si shtet. Se qeveria e Tiran?s nuk po vete t'u ofroj? shtet?sin? shqiptare ?am?ve ortodoks? q? kan? mbetur t? fshehur n? Epirin grek! Xha Xhai 
 
 On 11/9/06, L G <leila_0618 at yahoo.com> wrote: Eshte fakt i njohur qe greket kane aspirata per Vorio-Epir e per kontroll politik-ekonomik ne Shqiperi. Nuk ka rreziqe aneksimi e gllaberimi territorial, jo se nuk e duan greket, por se nuk i le njeri ta bejne. Ne mars '97, parlamenti grek rrinte i mbledhur me projekt-ligjin per dhenien e nenshtetesise minoritareve neper tavolina, ne pritje te konfirmimit te lajmit se pika e fundit qeverisese ne Shqiperi, presidenti, ishte arratisur ne Itali. Greket morren shume vrull ate kohe, pandehen se u be deti kos, dhe u desh nderhyrja e Italise, BE dhe SHBA-se qe te terhiqeshin nga endrrat e tyre. 
 
 Megjithate. Emigrantet ne Greqi kane 15 vjet qe punojne e jetojne atje. Minoritaret jane pajisur me disa leje-qendrimi e te drejte punesimi qe ne fillim. Ky favorizim i tyre beri qe edhe shqiptaret e tjere te nderrojne emrat e kombesite neper certifikata qe te perfitonin. Nuk ju ve faj qe u perpoqen te mbijetojne me cdo menyre. 
 
 Ne qe jemi ne Amerike e dime qe pas 5 vjet qendrimi te ligjshem, fitojme nenshtetesine pa asnje problem, vetem ndjekim procdeurat dhe afatet. Kanadaja e jep per 3 vjet. Kjo gje nuk ndodh kaq lehte ne vendet e Evropes. Dhe nese minoritaret ne Greqi akoma jane pa nenshtetesi, kjo eshte skandaloze. Greqia nuk po ju ben ndonje nder, po ju jep nje te drejte qe ju takon (nese biem dakord qe legjislacioni ne Greqi eshte i unifikuar ne keto pika me Konventat Nderkombetare dhe ligjet e BE-se.) 
 
 Patjeter qe do perpiqen te perfitojne edhe shqiptare jominoritare, dhe per mua shume mire do bejne. Nese kane 10-15 vjet qe punojne e jetojne ne Greqi dhe akoma s'jane nenshtetas, ta marrin me vrap. Asgje e keqe nuk i vjen Shqiperise se qytetaret e saj te shperndare neper bote kane dy shtetesi. Pse u dashka te quhet rrezik krijimi i kastes se privilegjuar ne raport me Evropen? Apo eshte me mire te jemi te gjithe shqiptare te perbuzur neper Evrope, vetem qe disa prej nesh te mos jene te privilegjuar?
 
 Pavarsisht se per efekt propagande ne te dy anet e kufirit po flitet per dhenie nenshtetesie ne bllok, dhe Sabri Godo sot thoshte qe kjo eshte antikushtetuese, procedurat do jene individuale, se s'ma merr mendja qe te kete as ligj as praktike qe lejoka dhenien e nenshtetesise ne grup. Greqia mund ta bente dhenien e nenshtetesise per gjithe shqiptaret atje pa u ndjere fare, pa bere asnje lloj deklarate, dhe ne as do dinim se c'behej. 
 
 Shteti shqiptar nuk mund te behet kundershtar i emigranteve te vet kur atyre ju ofrohen mundesira integrimi ne vendet ku jane. Mbase kjo behet nxitje per Italine qe te leshoje edhe ajo ca pe ne favor te shqiptareve atje. 
 
 Xha Xhai <no.elevator at gmail.com> wrote: *** AlbClub Discussion List ***
 
 
 
 Kam lexuar mendime t? ndryshme n? shtyp p?r vendimin e qeveris? greke p?r t'iu dh?n? qytetarin? greke minoritar?ve grek? n? Shqip?ri. P?r mua, sa koh? q? Shqip?ria mbetet jasht? Bashkimit Evropian, ky vendim rrezikon t? krijoj?, brenda Shqip?ris?, nj? kast? qytetar?sh t? privilegjiuar n? raportet e tyre me Evrop?n.  Natyrisht, vendimi ?sht? marr? p?r minoritar?t, por t? gjith? e dim? sa t? leht? e kan? disa qarqe, n? Greqi dhe n? Shqip?ri, p?r t'i deklaruar t? gjith? shqiptar?t e fes? ortodokse si minoritar?. Kush do t'i pengoj? tani? Gjendjet civile?  N? pamund?si p?r t? krijuar Vorio-Epirin, k?to qarqe po duan ta v?n? Shqip?rin?, de facto, n? duar t? "vorio-epirot?ve"; sepse kjo kast? e pajisur me euro-pasaporta do ta ket? t? leht? t? vendos? marr?dh?nie t? privilegjiuara brenda kontinentit dhe m? tej.  Qeveria shqiptare v?rtet mund t? ket? qen? e pafuqishme p?r ta kund?rshtuar k?t? vendim, por ma merr mendja se di?ka mund t? ishte b?r?, sidomos duke futur n? loj? italian?t, t? cil?t nuk besoj se jan? shum? t? ngaz?llyer nga k?to skenare p?r katrahura t? reja.  Nuk mund t? mos kujtoj edhe se, njohja e dyshtet?sis? q? u trumbetua dikur me t? madhe nga Berisha me t? vet?t, tani po rrezikon t? kthehet n? nj? k?rc?nim t? madh p?r vet? integritetin qytetar t? Shqip?ris?.  Xha Xhai www.AlbClub.com
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From ngahalli at yahoo.com  Fri Nov 10 03:53:15 2006
From: ngahalli at yahoo.com (Pseudonim NgaHalli)
Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2006 00:53:15 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [AlbClub] Vorio-Epiri Diplomatik
In-Reply-To: <20061109190246.2443.qmail@web35806.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20061110085315.53737.qmail@web51510.mail.yahoo.com>

Ne dijenine time, minoritare (greke a maqedonas qofshin) kuptohen VETEM ata qe shteti shqiptar (nder vite dhe jo sot) ka njohur si te tille, ndryshe ata qe ne certifikatat e tyre ne gjendjen civile, tek zeri kombesia kane te shkruajtur ate greke (ne rastin ne fjale). Keta shtetas shqiptare e kane patur kete specifikim qe nga koha e Enverit, vazhdojne ta kene edhe aktualisht. Numri i tyre nuk eshte shume i madh, ndonese edhe ata si te gjithe njerezit jane shtuar nder vite. Per me teper, shumica dermuese e tyre (besoj se mbi 85%) gjendet aktualisht ne Greqi (vec te moshuarve apo atyre te martuar me shqiptare puro).
  Keta persona, pothuajse kane te gjithe te ashtuquajturat "karta te omogjenitetit" me skadenca 3 vjecare (te rinovuara sefundi ne 10 vjecare). Me keto karta ata mund te levizin pa asnje problem neper te gjithe vendet e BE (por jo ne Britani). Te tjere besoj se do ta kene te veshtire qe qofte edhe kundrejt pagesave te nderrojne te dhenat e tyre ne gjendjen civile. Edhe nese do te kete raste, do te jene sporadike (per gjera te tilla perfundon ne burg). 
   
  Nuk jam shume i qarte gjithashtu per impaktin  politik qe mund te kete dhenia e pashaportave; masen e te cilit nuk jam i afte ta vleresoj (mund te jete edhe i paperfillshem, mund edhe te mos jete). 
  Ne perfundim, ajo qe dua te them eshte se ata shqiptare qe per cfaredolloj arsyeje e kane ndare mendjen te greqizohen, do ta vazhdojne procesin me apo pa "letra".
  Natyrisht, kjo nuk duhet te jete nje shfajsim per shtetin shqiptar qe te zere nje cep e te shohe pasiv se c'behet.
  Nga media te krijohet pershtypja se qeveria eshte dakort (dje ne parlament asnje, as edhe nje per be, nga deputetet e djathte - djep i supozuar i nacionalizmit - nuk foli as edhe nje fjale te vetme ne debatin qe nxiten socialistet "e djegur" per memedhene). 

 
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From cun-tirone at hotmail.com  Fri Nov 10 01:41:47 2006
From: cun-tirone at hotmail.com (Cun Tirone)
Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2006 01:41:47 -0500
Subject: [AlbClub] Roli i Kadarese
In-Reply-To: <8C8D26961B7A614-BC0-5F1A@MBLK-M34.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <BAY106-F3386672E8149B6A31B02C391F70@phx.gbl>

Dritan,


Jam plotesisht dakord me ty per anen historike. Enveri u shkeput nga
ruset sepse ndjeu se po i rrezikohej skeptri, si i brezit stalinist
qe ishte. Prishja me ruset, nga tjeter, ishte nje rast i florinjte
per Shqiperine te krijonte lidhje me perendimin, mjaftonte qe Enveri
te kishte nje fraksion te trurit apo patriotizmit te Titos (per
popullin e vet), dhe po te ndodhte kjo, mbase statuja e Enverit do
te ishte dhe sot e florinjte ne mes te Tiranes. Bile Hrushovi, duke
mos i shkuar dot ne mendje se deri ku shkonte gomarlleku i Hoxhes, e
akuzoi se ishte shitur per dyzet aspra tek perendimi. Dhe vertet,
vetem heqja e bazes se Vlores nuk e di sa billion do te paguhej nga
perendimi. Por ja qe na qelluan per hise ca kriminele qe urrenin
popullin e vet.



Kjo eshte historia dhe Kadareja apo ndonje tokesor tjeter nuk e
ndryshonte dot. Por ta shkruaje kete histori sic ishte, duke
perifrazuar vete Kadarene, do te ishte ekuivalente me djegjen me
benzine ne mes te bulevardid, ne mos me keq, se do pervelohej fisi e
rrethi deri ne brezin e dyzete. Dhe askush qe nuk u be vete
fishekziar, nuk ka te drejte t'ia kerkoje Kadarese nje gje te tille
sot.



Pse zgjodhi Kadare te shkruante per prishjen me ruset, une nuk e di
dhe mbase s'ka shume rendesi ta di. Por nje gje eshte e sigurte, qe
Enverit e Co. i kendohej nga megjesi ne mengjes, nga martesat deri
ne morte etj. Pra nje furce me pak a me shume qofte e Kadarese nuk
eshte se ndryshonte gje. Dhe jane pikerisht ato furcet Enverit, qe
bene te mundur publikimin e Dimrit. Por thelbi i Dimrit nuk jane
keto furce, eshte gjithe pjesa tjeter. Per here te pare heroi
komunist, Besniku e te tjere nuk ishin Lejfener, pra u punonte
truri. Por nje tru qe punon eshte mine per diktature, sepse heret
a vone ky tru do te kuptonte absurditetin e dikatures, sic po e kuptonte,
mbase dhe vete Kadare. Me tej fshikullohet sigurimi i Xoxes, qe
ne fakt s'kishte asnje ndryshim nga ai i Hoxhes e keshtu me radhe.


Dalja e Dimrit ishte nje shok per miletin. Per here te pare i flitej
me nje gjuhe ndryshe, i thirrej te mendonte, jo te brohoriste. Pra i
ashtuquajturi "kuptimi i dyfishte" nuk ishte shkruar me ndonje boje
simpatike. Mesa duket arti i madh, per default, eshte armik i
djallit. Dhe kjo eshte merita  e Kadarese. Ai e perdori talentin per
te krijuar Artin e madh, qe patjeter do te shoqerohej me pjesen
harac diktatures. Ai nuk ishte antikomunist, as disident, sepse
thjesht nuk mund te ishe i tille ne ate kohe, e njekohesisht te ishe
mbi dhe, aq me pak te publikoheshe. Nga ana tjeter, nuk e di ne
c'liber te shenjte eshte shkruar qe Kadare duhej te ishte
antikomunist. Vertet Lasgushi nuk ndyu penen, por autosyrgjyni i tij
nuk e vlejti lexuesit.



Duke menduar per rolin e Kadarese ne ate kohe, gjithmone me vjen ne
mendje nje tregim i tij. Behej fjale per nje nenpunes turk, detyra e
te cilit ishte te conte kokat e prera te armiqeve te sulltanit per
tek kamarja e turpit. Gjate rruges per Stamboll, nenpunesi ne fjale
e kishte bere zakon te jepte shfaqje me kokat ne fshatrat e humbura
e te pergjumura te perandorise. Kjo vazhdoi deri diten kur koka e
tij fluturoi, mbasi u konsiderua shume e rrezikshme "zgjimi" me
shfaqje kokash te atij mileti, te cilit po i behej lavazh truri. Te
pakten mua e rrethit tim veprat e Kadarese i kane sherbyer ne menyre
te ngjashme si antidot per lavazhin e trurit prej diktatures. Por
kam pershtypjen se ndikim te ngjashem ai ka patur mbi shumicen e
shqiptareve.



Mbase sot ky kontribut duket teper modest, por s'po flasim per sot,
ndaj dhe te pyeta kur e ke lexuar Kadarene.


Ka uje pafund ne det, por cdo pike uji vlen me shume se ari ne
shkretetire. Dhe ne ishim ne ate shkretetire.


?un Tirone





>From: dritan68 at aol.com
>To: alb-club at alb-net.com
>Subject: Re: [AlbClub] Trishtimi i Kadarese
>Date: Thu, 09 Nov 2006 17:56:09 -0500
>
>                   *** AlbClub Discussion List ***
>
>
>Cun Tirone "
>E kam lexuar aty nga mesi i viteve 80.mbaj mend qe kishte dialoge te epike 
>te "shokut enver" me hrushovin.Eren e ftohte qe vinte nga stepat e 
>rusise.Entuziazmi i shqipove ne kafshimin e dores qe i ushqente.Ndoshta ajo 
>shkeputje nga ruset i shpetoi shqiptaret nga "sovietizimi" si pretendon 
>kadareja.Ne 15 vjet marredhenie me ruset barinjte shqiptare mesuan te 
>fluturonin aeroplane, drejtonin nendetese , te ndertojne hidrocentrale 
>rruge etj.Kuadrot qe u trajnuan ne BS apo mesuan nen specialistet ruse 
>ishin te vetmet kuadro te hajrit qe pati shqiperia.Ajo perleshje me ruset 
>nuk ishte lufte per mbrojtjen e pavaresise si sugjeron Kadareja por lufte 
>per mbrojtjen e pushtetit te Enverit.Hrushovi u perpoq ta heqe si beri me 
>stalinistet e tjere ne europen lindore po ne shqiperi i doli huq.Shqipot i 
>kane qejf burrat e pashem qe fryhen si gjela e keshtu ia perplasin ne 
>fytyre atij e ashtu ia bejne ketij.Ia  perplasi ne fytyre hrushovit shoku 
>Enver pa cope le te behet s'ka rendesi nese ngordhim per buke.Thone qe 
>eshte Dimri i madh eshte monumet i dykuptimesise.Ashtu qofte.Ata qe duan te 
>besojne ne kete kane te drejten e tyre.Per mua nese do te ishte 
>antikomunist i bindur mund te kishte shkruar per ndonje teme tjeter.
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: cun-tirone at hotmail.com
>To: alb-club at alb-net.com
>Sent: Wed, 8 Nov 2006 1:42 AM
>Subject: Re: [AlbClub] Trishtimi i Kadarese
>
>
>                   *** AlbClub Discussion List ***
>
>
>
>
>Nje pyetje kisha. A e ke lexuar Dimrin dhe nese po, kur (per here te pare)?
>Te siguroj se nuk me intereson aspak mosha jote, por me mire te sqarohemi,
>sesa te kerkojme celesin atje ku ka drite.
>
>??un Tirone
>
> >From: dritan68 at aol.com
> >To: alb-club at alb-net.com
> >Subject: Re: [AlbClub] Trishtimi i Kadarese
> >Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2006 16:05:50 -0500
> >
> > *** AlbClub Discussion List ***
> >
> >kadareja u tregua pak hipokrit ne kritiken ndaj milos.Ai per vete shkroi 
> >dimrin e madh .Nuk besoj se i vune koburen ne koke dhe e detyruan te 
> >shkruante nje liber ku i thurrte lavde enverit per shkeputjen nga ruset e 
> >cila i ngordhi shqiptaret per buke.
> >Megjithate ai mbetet shkrimtar i madh.100 vjet me pas do te kujtohet 
>vetem >per vepren e tij dhe jo per situatat politike ne te cilat jetoi.
>
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From dxhezo at aol.com  Fri Nov 10 03:14:31 2006
From: dxhezo at aol.com (dxhezo at aol.com)
Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2006 03:14:31 -0500
Subject: [AlbClub] Trishtimi i Kadarese
In-Reply-To: <c18.83c7752.3284f3b1@aol.com>
References: <c18.83c7752.3284f3b1@aol.com>
Message-ID: <8C8D2B76230EBD0-230-8344@FWM-D31.sysops.aol.com>

 <<Me duket interesant fakti mbi statutory rape. Ata ishin te dy te mitur dhe is e tille, nuk ka ligj ne Amerike per te denuar dike. Keshtu qe ju lutem mos na dilni ne mbrojtje te ketij ligji.>>
 
 Une nuk dal ne mbrojtje te ketij ligji, dhe ligjin mbi statutory rape nuk e kam hartuar une. Ai ekziston ne Amerike, dhe megjithese ndryshon nga shteti ne shtet, ne thelb eshte pak a shume i njejte. Ju mund te konsultoni me qindra faqje legale qe jane ne internet per kete ceshtje. Megjithate ligji amerikan nuk ka fare rendesi, pasi krimi u krye ne Shqiperi ne nje moment te caktuar. Une nuk i di detajet e ligjit qe ka qene ne fuqi ne 1982 ne Shqiperi per kete ceshtje, por di qe kryerja e marrdhenieve seksuale me te mitur (nen nje moshe legale), eshte i ndaluar me ligj aktualisht ne Shqiperi. Di gjithashtu edhe nje rast konkret, ne regjimin e vjeter, kur dikush qe sa kishte perfunduar shkollen e mesme u kap ne flagrance ne klase me nje gjimnaziste. Ai perfundoi ne burg, ndersa ajo jo, megjithese ishin pak a shume te se njejtes shtrese shoqerore.
 
 Ju e besoni Janullen. Une nuk e besoj se genjeshtrat e saj me duken shume te trasha. Edhe sikur ta besoja (dhe me shkrimin tim ju referova fjaleve te saj), perseri me duket se Kadareja ka qene brenda te drejtes se tij, te mbronte vajzen e tij minorene, dhe te kerkonte denimin maksimal te fajtoreve sipas ligjit. Megjithate ai i fali. Janulla dhe shoqeria shqiptare, jo vetem nuk i japin Kadarese te drejten qe i takon, por nuk e falin as tani. Gjithsekush beson cfare te doje ne kete histori, dhe ky nuk eshte ndonje qamet i madh. Por me duket hipokrizi sublime, qe ky rast te perdoret per ta akuzuar Kadarene si perserkutor te regjimit, aq me teper qe krimet e atij regjimi njihen aq mire, dhe persekutoret e vertete rrijne tani e zgerdhejne dhembet me Kadarene. Dhe ky me duket si indikatori me real i moralit te shoqerise shqiptare.
 
 I lexova edhe ato qe kishte thene Kadare mbi Qosen, dhe me erdhi me te vertete keq qe i kishte thene. Eshte me te vertete papergjegjesi dhe mungese civilizimi te degjenerojne argumentat publike ne kete menyre, dhe ketu fajin e ka Kadareja. Une nuk e kam ngritur Kadarene ne kult, dhe arkivat e listes duhet ta kene mesazhin tim kur Kadareja diskutonte me Qosen per ceshtje identiteti. Megjithate disa anetare te listes jane kaq te ngujuar ne trashete partiake/ideologjike, sa nuk ja vlen te shpresosh per nje debat racional, pasi per sa kohe qe nuk mendon si ata, do te ishe me i preferuar po te shkruaje poezi per henen.
 
 
    
 
 -----Original Message-----
 From: Fisnik21 at aol.com
 To: alb-club at alb-net.com
 Sent: Thu, 9 Nov 2006 4:12 PM
 Subject: Re: [AlbClub] Trishtimi i Kadarese
 
                    *** AlbClub Discussion List ***



       Tani po degjoj intervisten e Janulla Rrapit, mbi ceshtjen Kadare. Si histori me duket plotesisht e besueshme. Me duket interesant fakti mbi statutory rape. Ata ishin te dy te mitur dhe is e tille, nuk ka ligj ne Amerike per te denuar dike. Keshtu qe ju lutem mos na dilni ne mbrojtje te ketij ligji. Me duket interesante qe njerezit akoma vazhdojne te mbrojne e diskutojne me idene e kultit te individit. Eshte fakt qe te gjithe e dine qe Kadareja eshte nje shkrimtar i madh, dhe nese e njeh permes letrave, ai eshte vertet i mrekullueshem. Por nuk mund te presesh nga askush te jete perfekt kudo. Kjo eshte nje ceshtje personale nga nje ane, por nga ana tjeter, kur kjo ceshtje u hap, dhe u be ceshtje publike, per me teper kur Kadareja eshte nje person publik. Per mua kjo eshte nje shembje e idhujve per disa, por per disa te tjere, nuk ka rendesi, shkrimtari vleresohet nga vlera e librave dhe letrave.      In a message dated 11/7/2006 4:36:21 AM Central European Standard Ti, dxhezo at aol.com writes:  *** AlbClub Discussion List ***
 
 
 
 
 
  <<
  Le t? jemi t? sinqert?. Intervista e Kadares? ishte banale, fund e krye banale. P?r nivelin e shkrimtarit Kadare ishte madje e turpshme. Fajin nuk mund t?ia v?m? intervistuesit, por vet? Kadares?, i cili mund t?i kishte t?rhequr v?mendjen gazetarit duke i th?n?: ?I nderuar gazetar, p?r hir t? inteligjenc?s s? shikuesve le t? flasim p?r gj?ra m? t? r?nd?sishme: p.sh. p?r artin, let?rsin?, shoq?rin?, shqiptarin?, etj. Un? k?tu jam n? studio televizive, jo n? klubin e kombinatit t? tekstileve Stalin dhe as n? bar/restorantin modern Berluskoni?.   Mir?po Kadareja parap?lqeu t? thot? fjali t? tilla si: ?More qen bir qeni, pse paska r?nd?si q? kritikohem un?, ?far? jam un?, Hitler jam un??.   Personalisht e ndjej veten n? siklet. Por jo p?r Kadaren?. P?r mua ka vite q? Kadareja shkrimtar i magjish?m ec?n n? binar? t? ndrysh?m nga Kadareja individ apo person publiko/politik. E ndjej veten n? siklet p?r ata q? e mbrojn? Kadaren? nga kritika, duke e ngritur at? mbi vet? kritik?n si parim. >>
 
 Qe te jemi fare, fare te sinqerte, do te na duhet ta pranojme se per disa njerez, cfaredo qe te thoshte Kadareja, cilado qe te kete qene ngjarja per te cilen diskutohet pas 20 vjetesh, Kadareja perseri do te ngelet me faj, ndoshta per arsye qe nuk kane fare te bejne me ato cka diskutohet. Tjetri eshte vene - sic u tha ketu - para nje gjyqi popullor, perpara furise se shtypit, dhe nuk ngeli gjysem-analist e gjysem-gazetar me gjysem-balluke ne balle, pa na u ngritur ne kete mbledhje fronti, e te recitoje indinjaten e tij te thelle ndaj Kadarese. Tjetri thirret ne interviste ne tv, i behen pyetje, e trajtohet, dhe i pritet fjala, tamam sikur dikush ti bertiste nga salla: "zbertheu para kolektivit, burgjez!" Dhe po te filloje Kadareja te flase per artin, letersine etj., atehere inkuizitoret e kane gati ate formulen tjeter: "O, tashti filloi e po na flet per artin e gjepura te tjera, i shmanget muhabetit se e ka mizen nen kesule, do ta ktheje atje ku i vete me mire, po neve nuk na e hedh dot dobici". Pishakut i duket banale intervista e Kadarese, por nuk i duket aspak banal i gjithe ky proces denigrimi i porositur ne shtyp. Ndoshta i duket banale intervista, pasi i akuzuari vendosi ti pergjigjet drejtperdrejt dhe hapur, banaliteteve me te cilat i eshte dashur te perballet. Damned if you do, damned if you don't! Tha.
 
 Kadare ka folur per artin, e letersine e shoqerine e gjithe te tjerat, kur ka qene vakti, por akuzuesit nuk jane aspak te interesuar per keto. Cfare kritikash? Qe te vjen nje e shkalluar dhe te thyen dritaret e deren e shtepise dhe te kerkon me dhune vajzen 15-vjecare per nuse, duke te uluritur, duke te kercenuar, e duke te share nga rruga? Sipas vete fjaleve te kesaj Janulles, djali i saj paska konsumuar vepren penale te kryerjes se marrdhenieve seksuale me nje te mitur (statutory rape) dhe ajo vete paska konsumuar vepren penale te ndihmes dhe inkurajimit te ketij akti. Pervec dhunimit te baneses, prishjes se qetesise publike, dhe kercenimit e ofendimit te personit. Te dy pra, ne cdo shtet demokratik, duhej te kishin perfunduar ne burg. Vetem ne nje shtet diktatorial, ku diktatures i interesonte ti mbante nen presion intelektualet, kjo u denua me nje "slap on the wrist", pune riedukuese per dy muaj, per tu lene e lire edhe per dy vjet te tjera, qe te vazhdonte zullumet qe kishte nisur. Tani na del ne kete histori edhe nje ish-juriste e Kuvendit, e cila ne vend qe te futet sa me thelle poshte ndonje rrogozi, na dalka hapur te deklaroje tru-shkulesine dhe mungesen e saj te profesionalizmit, teksa paska mbrojtur nje akt te tille ne instancat me te larta te shtetit, per arsye jashte-ligjore (sepse ia paska kerkuar mamaja per hir te nje borxhi te vjeter qe i kishte gjyshit te Janulles). I mean come-the-fkn-on! Per me teper, sipas ligjeve ne Amerike, ky Renatua, do te duhej te regjistrohej si "sex-offender" ne lagjen ne te cilen jeton aktualisht, ne rajonin e policise, pune etj, dhe ky regjistrim do te duhej ta ndiqte nga pas kudo qe te vente. Per gjithe jeten. Une them qe Kadareja, shume i njerezishem qenka treguar, teksa paska kerkuar me shkrim qe ta lene te lire. E paskan futur ne cmendine kete djale? Po shume mire e paskan bere, per ta kuruar, kur ky e kish provuar ne publik, mu ne mes te Tiranes, cmendurine e tij.
 
 Po, na sqaroni kete, o kritikues te medhenj: Qysh paska mundesi, qe kjo grua, te lihet e lire per dy vjet, qe te vazhdoje te bertase e te ulurase perpara shtepise se nje funksionari te larte te shtetit? Nuk ishte se ne Shqiperi kishte procese te gjata gjyqesore, ku vazhdonin seancat me vite te tera, me argumenta e kunder-argumenta te holla ligjore. Ne ate kohe, po te zune, ta vune. Buke, te thoje nuk ka ne dyqan, perfundoje ne Spac per agjitacion-propagande. Atehere me sa di une, as avokat mbrojtes nuk ka pasur ne seancat gjyqesore. Atehere, si paska mundesi?
 
 
 dritan68, tha:
 <<kadareja u tregua pak hipokrit ne kritiken ndaj milos.Ai per vete shkroi dimrin e madh .Nuk besoj se i vune koburen ne koke dhe e detyruan te shkruante nje liber ku i thurrte lavde enverit per shkeputjen nga ruset e cila i ngordhi shqiptaret per buke.>>
 
 Padyshim, faji perseri Kadarese i ngelet. Ai me duket se botoi nje variant tjeter te "dimrit" me pare, po e derguan per nja dy a tre vjet andej nga Fieri apo nga Berati, qe ti vinte gishtin kokes e ta rishkruante ate liber. Po e beri si e beri, nga qejfi apo nga zori, ajo ishte kohe tjeter. Po ju cfare alibie keni tani, qe akoma brohorisni per Enverin, kur e gjithe bota e mori vesh se cfare monstre paska qene. KE nxorri nje rezolute per denimin e krimeve te komunizmit, atehere kujt i sherben ky karshillek kaq blatant, ne mbrojtje te katilit.        Check out the new AOL. Most comprehensive set of free safety and security tools, free access to millions of high-quality videos from across the web, free AOL Mail and more.
  
 
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From kokonozi at gmail.com  Fri Nov 10 08:08:52 2006
From: kokonozi at gmail.com (D. Kokonozi)
Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2006 14:08:52 +0100
Subject: [AlbClub] 1 miliard dollare
Message-ID: <4e84d6690611100508m351194b3o5b41d0bf6f036ac9@mail.gmail.com>

Autoritet vietnameze i dhane miratimin Intel-it te filloje investimin prej
nje miliard dollaresh ne vendin e tyre.

Fillimisht ishte fjala per nje investim prej 300 milionesh, qe shume  u
rishikua nga Intel-i.

Marreveshja u arrit nje jave para vizites se Bushit ne Vietnam.
---------

Pyetje:
A vazhdon te jete me ajo "dallandyshja e pare" me emrin coca cola aty ne te
dale te Tiranes, apo i kane vene zjarrin perseri?

Se sikur te mos na mjaftonin vende qe po i konkurojme me dinjitet shembellor
si  Polonia, Cekia, sllovakia, Bullgaria, Rumania etj, ku po zhvendoset
gjysma e industrise evropiano perendimore, tani na doli edhe Vietnami si
konkurrent terheqjesh investimesh:-))
================




HO CHI MINH VILLE (Reuters) - Les autorit?s vietnamiennes ont d?livr? ?
Intel une licence d'investissement ? hauteur d'un milliard de dollars dans
le pays, conform?ment au souhait du num?ro un mondial des semi-conducteurs.

Intel avait initialement pr?vu d'investir 300 millions de dollars, avant de
revoir son offre ? la hausse.

La remise de la licence, qui a donn? lieu ? une c?r?monie ? Ho Chi Minh, la
capitale ?conomique du pays, intervient ? une semaine de la visite du
pr?sident am?ricain George Bush ? Hano?.

Le projet de 300 millions de dollars d?voil? en f?vrier constituait d?j? le
plus important investissement d'un groupe am?ricain au Vi?tnam.

Le pays est devenu mardi membre de l'Organisation mondiale du commerce et
accueille la semaine prochaine le sommet Forum de coop?ration ?conomique
Asie-Pacifique.
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From xagolli at gmail.com  Fri Nov 10 12:12:25 2006
From: xagolli at gmail.com (XA)
Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2006 12:12:25 -0500
Subject: [AlbClub] One Man's Herculean Study
Message-ID: <4554B2F9.5020201@gmail.com>

Dear clubbers,

I once met a deaf man at an alma mater party, and I communicated with 
him by writing on pieces of paper. This is a very lonely man in his 
sixities or so. Whenever he shows up at local alumni seminars and 
parties, he sits in his chair, eats his cheese, drinks his wine and 
falls asleep--because he can't hear anything (nothing can be done about 
it anymore), and I have noticed that most people who know that he is 
deaf avoid him. I cannot blame them, but it also makes me feel terrible 
when he shows up. I want to engage him so that he won't feel as lonely 
and aloof, but it's difficult to extricate yourself once you start 
writing notes to him.  So anyway, this man engages himself in a study 
that I'm sure keeps him occupied. He feels very passionate about his 
study and will talk about it as soon as there is opportunity to do so. A 
totally crazy study, mind you, a mindfuck really, which it didn't take 
me long to realize from those original exchanges I had with him. For 
more on the nature of the study please refer to the attached 
document--his email to me. It requires some patience, and it may give a 
kick to some of you, and perhaps even a thrill to Xha Xhai.

Because the man has nothing to occupy himself with in his life, no 
family, no children, no job, etc., I cannot (and do not wish to) tell 
him that he's hit the wrong path (to someone else I'd have said: you're 
full of shit), I'd like to just send him whatever titles any of you may 
come up with. More specifically:

"I would like, specifically to obtain lists of books that
answer to these questions:

        1) What is the oldest Albanian historical work?
        2) What are the oldest Albanian literary works?
        3) What is considered to be the best one-volume overall history ofAlbania?
        4) What are considered to be the best multi-volume overall histories of Albania?

And, for each of the books such as might appear on such lists, has the book
been translated into English? If it has not been translated into English,
has it been translated into another Western European language (Latin,
French, German or Italian)? If there are any universities in America that
teach Albanian, perhaps a professor who teaches such a language class would
know the answers to the questions. Or perhaps someone might write to the
Albanian ambassador to the United States, and the ambassador could contact
a librarian in Albania to obtain the information."


Thanks so much for any info/titles you may provide. Please respond  
directly to me with any titles and suggestions, not through the list.

XA


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From Dritan68 at aol.com  Fri Nov 10 22:38:52 2006
From: Dritan68 at aol.com (Dritan68 at aol.com)
Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2006 22:38:52 EST
Subject: [AlbClub] 1 miliard dollare
Message-ID: <4be.ad95be3.32869fcc@aol.com>

 
In a message dated 11/10/2006 7:29:53 A.M. Central Standard Time,  
kokonozi at gmail.com writes:

Pyetje:
A vazhdon te jete me ajo "dallandyshja e pare" me emrin coca cola aty ne  te 
dale te Tiranes, apo i kane vene zjarrin perseri? 
 
Se sikur te mos na mjaftonin vende qe po i konkurojme me dinjitet  shembellor 
si  Polonia, Cekia, sllovakia, Bullgaria,  Rumania etj, ku po zhvendoset 
gjysma e industrise evropiano  perendimore, tani na doli edhe Vietnami si 
konkurrent terheqjesh  investimesh:-)) 



Per te terhequr investimet duhen njohuri dhe para.Shqipot nuk kane as  njeren 
as tjetren.
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From Dritan68 at aol.com  Fri Nov 10 22:50:22 2006
From: Dritan68 at aol.com (Dritan68 at aol.com)
Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2006 22:50:22 EST
Subject: [AlbClub] Vorio-Epiri Diplomatik
Message-ID: <c07.92aef13.3286a27e@aol.com>

Shqiperia eshte vene ne shitje per 1 euro dhe asnje nuk po qaset per ta  
blere .Juve u ka zene frika se greket do te na marrin  shqiperine.
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From bkopliku at gmail.com  Sat Nov 11 03:49:56 2006
From: bkopliku at gmail.com (Bashkim Kopliku--->Gmail  Home)
Date: Sat, 11 Nov 2006 09:49:56 +0100
Subject: [AlbClub] Dosjet e gjalla
Message-ID: <003201c7056e$5eac7390$0301a8c0@pc>



Ka nj? rr?muj? q?ndrimesh, edhe n? mjediset e analist?ve, p?r gjetjen e pseve t? 
sjelljeve politike dhe ekonomike t? shoq?ris? shqiptare aktuale, p?r 
diagnostikimin e drejt? t? s?mundjes s? saj.  Pjes? e k?saj rr?muje jan? edhe 
ul?rimat p?r hapjen e dosjeve, si mjet i njohjes t? s? kaluar?s s? personave q? 
jan? aktiv? sot.  Njer?zit duhet t? kuptojn? se n? Shqip?rin? ton?, ?dosjet? 
jan? thjesht? disa dokumente t? manipuluara, t? falsifikuara nga mashtrues 
profesionist?.  E kaluara jon? mund t? njihet shum? m? mir?, nga debati publik i 
t? gjall?ve, pra nga ?dosjet e gjalla?, ku Gazeta Shqiptare ka nj? rol pionier.

Bashkim Kopliku
Phone: +355(0)52 23663
Mobile: +355(0)682200590
E-mail:<bkopliku at gmail.com>
optional <koplikub at yahoo.com>; <bkopliku at email.it>;<bkopliku at infinito.it>



                                Dosjet e gjalla
                        [Gazeta Shqiptare, 11.11.2006]

Ka nj? rr?muj? q?ndrimesh, edhe n? mjediset e analist?ve, p?r gjetjen e pseve t? 
sjelljeve politike dhe ekonomike t? shoq?ris? shqiptare aktuale, p?r 
diagnostikimin e drejt? t? s?mundjes s? saj.  Pjes? e k?saj rr?muje jan? edhe 
ul?rimat p?r hapjen e dosjeve, si mjet i njohjes t? s? kaluar?s s? personave q? 
jan? aktiv? sot.  Njer?zit duhet t? kuptojn? se n? Shqip?rin? ton?, ?dosjet? 
jan? thjesht? disa dokumente t? manipuluara, t? falsifikuara nga mashtrues 
profesionist?.  E kaluara jon? mund t? njihet shum? m? mir?, nga debati publik i 
t? gjall?ve, pra nga ?dosjet e gjalla?, ku Gazeta Shqiptare ka nj? rol pionier.

Do t? ishte gabim fatal t? merren si t? mir?qena ato dosjet q? i tundin nj?ri 
tjetrit politikan?t, ato t? sigurimit, apo t? partis? komuniste, apo dhe ato t? 
berishizmit.  Detyra q? kam kryer gjat? vitit 1992-93 (minist?r i rendit 
publik), m? ka njohur me disa manipulime t? kryera mbi ato dosje, para vitit 
1992 (sidomos djegien e disave prej tyre).  Tani po thuhet se dhe pas vitit 
1992, paska vazhduar manipulimi me to, gj? q? un? personalisht nuk e kam 
p?rjetuar, por q? nuk e p?rjashtoj si t? mundshme.  Fetishizimi i k?tyre 
dokumenteve, do t? b?nte q? shoq?ria aktuale shqiptare t? binte pre e nj? zjarri 
t? kryq?zuar enveristo-berishist, gj? q? do t? shkaktonte nj? skizofreni 
kolektive, nga ku t? fituar do t? dilnin vet?m fajtor?t e v?rtet?.  Prandaj ato 
dosje duhen sjellur si prova, me kujdes dhe me mosbesimin m? t? madh.

?Dosjet? m? t? besueshme jan? d?shmit? e gjalla q? na vijn? nga e kaluara, t? 
fark?tuara n? kurdh?n e debatit t? sot?m publik, p?r to.  D?shmit? e gjalla, si 
ato q? na i sjellin kujtimet dhe analizat e diskutuesve rreth ??shtjeve si 
Kadare, ?uli, etj., e tani s? fundmi ato q? na sjell z.Sh?nasi Rama, nga 
Amerika, p?r vitin 1990 t? Tiran?s son?, ato po q? jan? ?dosje e kaluar dosjes?. 
N?p?rmjet tyre mund t? njohim se ??ka ndodhur realisht gjat? l?vizjeve 
studentore, e gjat? viteve n? thell?sin? e err?sir?s komuniste.

Natyrisht, shum? njer?z q? nuk duan t? lodhin mendjen me analiza, indiferent?t, 
mund edhe mos t?i lexojn?, mund edhe t? mos vrasin mendjen fare p?r faktin se 
Berisha e shum? t? tjer?, paskan pas? ardhur tek student?t, si t? d?rguar t? 
regjimit, p?r t?i hequr l?vizjes studentore vrullin e qart? antikomunist, duke e 
kthyer n? nj? l?vizje thjesht? antienveriste, apo kund?r ekseseve t? nj? regjimi 
q? dhe mund t? modifikohej, p.sh. duke e kthyer n? nj? komuniz?m t? ?mb?l; apo 
m? tej, q? n? krye t? student?ve mund t? ishte si Nano si Berisha, meq? n? 
princip pak gj? luante etj. etj.?xhan?m, indiferent?t nuk do t?u vinin mendjen 
as hapjes s? dosjeve komuniste, edhe sikur mos t? ishin fare t? manipuluara.

Por nj? analist, apo nj? politikan, apo dhe kushdo qe e konsideron veten se 
merret me politik?, nuk duhet t? anashkaloj? k?t? hapje dosjesh t? gjalla, sepse 
kan? t? b?jn? me diagnostikimin e patologjis?, s?mundjes son? t? sotme.  Duke 
ditur m?nyr?n e t? menduarit t? ?nism?tar?ve?, mund t? kuptohen shum? l?vizje t? 
m?vonshme, dhe duke i kuptuar, mund t? rekomandohen receta p?r t? sotmen.  Besoj 
se t? gjith? jemi t? nj? mendje, q? ila?et q? duhet t? marrim, duhet t? jen? sa 
m? t? mira, e jo ?t? skaduara? apo ?q? nuk b?jn? p?r s?mundjen ton??.  Nj? ila? 
efikas, q? mund ta jap? secili, ?sht? vota n? zgjedhjet q? po vijn?.

Shoq?ria jon? nuk i ka siguruar vetes sakt?sin? q? japin dokumentet, si? ia kan? 
siguruar vetes italian?t, gjerman?t etj., fal? sakt?sis? s? n?pun?sit t? tyre, 
t? mentalitetit t? tyre.  Ne shqipot jemi mashtrues, dhe i kemi fallsifikuar 
r?ndsh?m e vazhdimisht, dokumentacionet tona, natyrisht kur na interesonin.  Ne 
kemi fallsifikuar jo vet?m dosjet e sigurimit apo t? partis? komuniste, por deri 
dhe dokumentet e pronave, saq? po na dalin pronar? edhe aty ku ?para 1945 ka 
pasur vet?m det, e jo tok??, apo po vrasin ?v?llai v?llan?? thjesht? p?r 
fallsifikimet me pron?sit?.

Na duhet t? paguajm? hara?in e hileve tona t? vazhdueshme: t? njohim t? kaluar?n 
ton? n?p?rmjet nj? procesi t? st?rmundimsh?m, kujtimeve t? protagonist?ve?sa 
jan? akoma gjall?, e sa kan? akoma guximin t? flasin.  Ky proces bart mjaft 
pasakt?si, por t? shpie m? af?r t? v?rtet?s, sesa ato dosjet q? disponohen.

Bashkim Kopliku
8.11.2006 


begin 666 DosjetGjalla.doc
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From no.elevator at gmail.com  Sat Nov 11 11:42:23 2006
From: no.elevator at gmail.com (Xha Xhai)
Date: Sat, 11 Nov 2006 11:42:23 -0500
Subject: [AlbClub] Vorio-Epiri Diplomatik
Message-ID: <d1e7b6ac0611110842v4da3c1a7xd2657965f12ecbe2@mail.gmail.com>

Dritan68 shkruan:

Shqiperia eshte vene ne shitje per 1 euro dhe asnje nuk po qaset per ta
blere. Juve u ka zene frika se greket do te na marrin Shqiperine.

Nuk jam nga ata q? i ka "z?n? frika se greket do te na marrin Shqip?rin?".
K?t? akuz? e lexoj tani edhe n? shkrimet e n? deklaratat e disa figurave
publike e analist?ve, si Panajot Barka, Adrian Dule, Stavri Marko e t?
tjer?.

Me fjal? t? tjera, q? shqet?simi p?r dh?nien e qytetaris? greke minoritetit
grek n? Shqip?ri qenka shprehje e "nacionalizmit" arkaik shqiptar.

Thuase k?to g?lbaza t? shovinizmit grek nuk e din? se pik?risht vendimi i
qeveris? greke ?sht? shprehje e nacionalizmit grek, shum? t? rreziksh?m p?r
stabilitetin e Shqip?ris? si shtet dhe t? Ballkanit n? t?r?si.

Nga ana tjet?r, shoh nj? balet zyrtar?sh n? shtypin e sot?m p?r ta paraqitur
vendimin sikur ka t? b?j? me emigrant?t qytetar? shqiptar? n? Greqi. Si t?
jet? puna?

?sht? e natyrshme q? njer?z q? jetojn? e punojn? n? Greqi prej vitesh t?
marrin qytetarin? greke. ?sht? nj?lloj e qart?, gjithashtu, q? vendimi i
qeveris? greke kish t? b?nte me minoritetin grek n? Shqip?ri, jo me at?
pjes? t? minoritetit q? ka emigruar n? Greqi.

At?her? pse ky "spin" i papritur?

Stavri Marko dje n? "Koha Jon?" fliste p?r "dhjet?ra-mij?ra minoritar? grek?
q? jetojn? n? kryeqytetin e Shqip?ris?". Pik?risht k?tyre k?rkon t'u jap?
qytetarin? greke Athina, q? t? sh?rbejn? si "flamurtar? t? afrimit t?
Shqip?ris? me Evrop?n".

Natyrisht, nuk mund ta b?sh me faj as minoritetin grek, as Athin?n, q?
qeverit? brek?varura t? Tiran?s nuk e organizuan dot kurr? nj? regjistrim t?
sakt? t? popullsis? n? Shqip?ri. N? munges? statistikash t? pranuara, secili
mund t? thot? ?'t? doj?.

Nga ana tjet?r, v?rtet Greqia nuk "e merr" Shqip?rin? edhe sikur t'ia
fal?sh, por nj? pjes? e mir? e grek?ve, sidomos n? provinc?, besojn? v?rtet
se shqiptar?t e fes? ortodokse, ose t? ashtuquajturit "vorio-epirot?" jan?
n? t? v?rtet? "grek?". Shtypja e k?tyre martir?ve nga "turqit" shqiptar? (pa
p?rmendur t? frikshmit "papist?" katolik? t? Veriut) p?rb?n nj? narrativ?
fikse t? mitit komb?tarist grek, krah p?r krah me gjepura t? tjera p?r Azin?
e Vog?l, Maqedonin?, Bizantin e k?shtu me radh?.

Prandaj faktori politik i brendsh?m n? Greqi gjithnj? duhet mbajtur
parasysh.

Mendoj se strategjia afatmesme e Greqis? ?sht? ta b?j? p?r vete elementin
shqiptar  ortodoks n? Shqip?ri, duke e korruptuar me privilegje reale si ky
i qytetaris? greke dhe t? tjera k?sisoj, dhe ta mbaj? n? krye t? pun?ve n?
Tiran? e gjetiu; sepse ashtu mund t'i kontrolloj? m? leht? shqiptar?t n?
p?rgjith?si.

Mendoj gjithashtu se nj? strategji e till? dinake nuk ?sht? n? interes as t?
Shqip?ris?, as t? shqiptar?ve ortodoks?, t? cil?t historikisht kan? qen?
faktor jasht?zakonisht i gjall? madje vendimtar n? konsolidimin dhe
p?rparimin e shtetit shqiptar.

Xha Xhai
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From cun-tirone at hotmail.com  Sat Nov 11 11:58:44 2006
From: cun-tirone at hotmail.com (Cun Tirone)
Date: Sat, 11 Nov 2006 11:58:44 -0500
Subject: [AlbClub] Vorio-Epiri Diplomatik
Message-ID: <BAY106-F33587C26B65A3E705DAF8791F60@phx.gbl>

Ajo 1 euro eshte si pune bakshishi (tip).

Greket kane patur goxha shpenzime per
te blere gjithe halete e Shqiperise gjer me sot.
Ne fakt i kane dhene nje dore dhe vete shqipot.
Kkot i paguajme tarifat e celularit sa 10 fishin e
botes ne? Eshte si bixhim takse e vellazerim-helenizimit.

Pse ore, placken tone do blejme dy here ne - tha greku.

?un Tirone


PS.
Ku i dihet, mbase greku eshte aq trap
sa ta donje Vorio apo Mega Epirin.
Sic i dhane dhe Camerine me zor.



>From: Dritan68 at aol.com
>To: alb-club at alb-net.com
>Subject: Re: [AlbClub] Vorio-Epiri Diplomatik
>Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2006 22:50:22 EST
>
>                   *** AlbClub Discussion List ***
>
>
>


>Shqiperia eshte vene ne shitje per 1 euro dhe asnje nuk po qaset per ta
>blere .Juve u ka zene frika se greket do te na marrin  shqiperine.


>www.AlbClub.com
>____________________________________________________
>Alb-Club mailing list: Alb-Club at alb-net.com
>To unsubscribe send email to: Alb-Club-unsubscribe at alb-net.com
>http://www.alb-net.com/mailman/listinfo/alb-club

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From fmyrtaj at sympatico.ca  Sat Nov 11 12:48:58 2006
From: fmyrtaj at sympatico.ca (Faruk Myrtaj)
Date: Sat, 11 Nov 2006 12:48:58 -0500
Subject: [AlbClub] Vorio-Epiri Diplomatik
In-Reply-To: <d1e7b6ac0611110842v4da3c1a7xd2657965f12ecbe2@mail.gmail.com>
References: <d1e7b6ac0611110842v4da3c1a7xd2657965f12ecbe2@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <op.tiu43wpwy7md41@franz>



Xha xhai eshte korrekt ne kete mesazh. Eshte pikerisht ashtu.

Te ben pershtypje se emrat ne perdorim jane po ata qe lulezuan shtypin e  
dukjen publicistike-poilitike me 1996-1997-en!

Prej P.Barkes, S.Markos (anes tjeter te medaljes se Nderit te Kombit Petro  
Marko), gjer tek emri i Sali Berishes, qe si cuditerisht, edhe pse serish  
ne pushtet, duket sikur mban qendrim krejt te tjetert kesaj radhe. Nuk kam  
energjine e mjaftueshme te besoj se kjo vjen prej shefit te kabinetit te  
tij!

Kadare, ne kuadrin e hapjes se dosjeve, por edhe per shkak te te qenit  
kryetar nderi i Mjaft, ka nje rast shume te volitshem, kesaj radhe, per  
t'i thene mjaft lojes se keqe, provinciale me marrezite ballkanike.

As qe shtrohet me problemi i madhimit apo vogelimit te shqiperise si  
shtet; Por se paku prej vitit 1998-1999, shqiptaret kane nisur te ndjehen  
si komunitet i barabarte ne sofren ballkanike. Pranimi i Kosoves si shtet,  
eshte nje nger? i madh per ata qe nuk mund ta perfytyrojne ballkanin si  
nje mundesi per paqe dhe qetesi te vertete, te sinqerte.

Nuk e shoh me shqetesim pajisjen me dokumente greke te minoritareve greke  
ne Shqiperi, dhe as pajisjen keshtu te shqiptareve qe kane emigruar ne  
Athine. Te shkosh ndermend rivendikime territoriale greke tashme, eshte  
njelloj si te kesh frike nga nje zoterim i heshtur apo rebelim i papritur  
i Athines prej shqiptareve atje!

Me shqeteson me shume mosperpjekja per t'i qetesuar gjerat, duke i  
paralajmeruar ndodhite. Historia e ndodhur duhet shkalafitur qe dy popujt  
te mos e veshtrojne njeri tjetrin me dyshim. Lideret shpirterore te  
popujve, organizatat joqeveritare, i kane duart e gojen me te lire ta  
bejne kete gje.

Politikanet dihet, do vazhdojne te luajne mbi shpinen e popujve te vete!  
Kufijte, jane per popujt, ata jane te privuar nga levizja e lire, atyre u  
duhen viza, ata s'kane para, ata e pesojne prej kufizimeve!

Nese eshte fjala per ndryshe, pra per ndonje hile te grekeve te lashte,  
nese ndjehet i pafuqishem, -gjithnje mendojme me nese..., Berisha do te  
duhej te jepte doreheqjen! Vete, jo si me 1997-en!

Atehere e me vone, nuk u shpjegua perse e humbi shansin me te madh qe ka  
pasur ndonje burre shteti shqiptar. Tashme eshte ne kohe per ta bere me te  
lehte.


Faruk Myrtaj


on Sat, 11 Nov 2006 11:42:23 -0500, Xha Xhai <no.elevator at gmail.com> wrote:

>                   *** AlbClub Discussion List ***
>
>
>




From pishaku at yahoo.com  Sun Nov 12 05:48:56 2006
From: pishaku at yahoo.com (Pishak Zhgaba)
Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2006 02:48:56 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [AlbClub] Vorio-Epiri Diplomatik
Message-ID: <20061112104857.32755.qmail@web42204.mail.scd.yahoo.com>

Them se problemi i dh?nies s? shtet?sis? greke ka t? b?j? me karakterin KOLEKTIV t? tij. N? p?rgjith?si shtet?sia jepet mbi baza individuale. Nj? emigranti i jepet p?r arsye t? integrimit t? tij n? indin social, por gjithnj? si INDIVID. Natyrisht kriteri GJUH? mbetet i r?nd?sish?m, por jo i vetmi kusht p?r marrjen e shtet?sis?.
  Pra minoritar?ve nuk po i jepet si individ?, por si komunitet.
  K?tu nuk i kam t? qarta synimet e shtetit grek, ashtu si edhe kriteret q? duhet t? p?rmbushin kandidat?t. Duhet t? jen? aktualisht me q?ndrim n? Greqi? Apo mjafton nj? q?ndrim kohor qoft? edhe i pjessh?m? Apo mjafton t? jesh minoritar dhe e merr automatikisht shtet?sin??
  N? rast se shtet?sia lidhet me nj? q?ndrim t? hersh?m n? Greqi, dhe n? rast se shtet?sia ?sht? konceptuar si Kali i Troj?s (zakon historik) kam p?rshtypjen se dera e barkut nuk do t? hapet n? ?astin e duhur. Po sikur minoritar?t t? mbeten n? Greqi e atje t? asimilohen krejt?sisht? A do t? jen? p?rs?ri mjet trysnie p?r Shqip?rin?? Cili ?sht? avantazhi afatgjat? politik i Greqis?? Llogarit? jan? b?r? mir? apo pa hanxhin??
   
Pishaku
 
---------------------------------
Access over 1 million songs - Yahoo! Music Unlimited.
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From obobonews at yahoo.com  Sun Nov 12 06:15:36 2006
From: obobonews at yahoo.com (OBOBO NEWS)
Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2006 03:15:36 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [AlbClub] Shendeti publik
Message-ID: <20061112111536.15992.qmail@web54706.mail.yahoo.com>

Tiran?, 12.12.2006 ? Polemikat e shumta q? shkaktoi konferenca e sotme p?r shtyp e Presidentit t? Fondacionit ?Mente sana in corpore sano?, Prof. Dr. Sh?ndet Pla?i, vazhduan gjith? dit?n edhe n? kafenet? e Parlamentit. Z. Pla?i hodhi iden? provokuese e vizit?s s? detyrueshme n? psikiatri t? t? gjith? shqiptar?ve. ?Madje ? u shpreh ai ? vizitat duhen b?r? n? qendrat psikiatrike me specialist? t? huaj?.
  Ngjarjet, si? dihet, rrodh?n k?shtu. Shkrimtari Kadare ftoi kolegun Qose t? b?nte nj? vizit? psikiatrike. Qose nuk ia b?ri fjal?n dysh dhe e b?ri. Vizita doli me rezultate negative. Qosja, gjat? nj? takimi me student?t e Universitetit t? Tiran?s, i ?oi fjal? Kadares? se i takonte atij tani t? b?nte nj? vizit?. Kadareja, pa nj? pa dy, e b?ri vizit?n e k?rkuar. Edhe ai doli pa probleme. Q? k?tej ndarja n? dy kampe e opinionit publik shqiptar dhe polemika p?r korrupsionin n? mjek?si. Kriza e besimit tek institucionet mjek?sore shqiptare u shtri m? pas edhe tek institucionet politike. Jeta publike shqiptare u mb?rthye n? pak dit? nga mosbesimi dhe dyshimi p?r aft?sit? mendore t? protagonist?ve por edhe t? qytetar?ve t? thjesht?.
  Propozimi i sot?m i Prof. Dr. Sh?ndet Pla?i i ka v?n? n? mendime parlamentar?t shqiptar?. Imuniteti i deputetit i p?rjashton k?ta nga vizita tek psikiatri? 
   
  ? Obobo News

 
---------------------------------
Cheap Talk? Check out Yahoo! Messenger's low PC-to-Phone call rates.
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From Dritan68 at aol.com  Sun Nov 12 10:51:58 2006
From: Dritan68 at aol.com (Dritan68 at aol.com)
Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2006 10:51:58 EST
Subject: [AlbClub] Vorio-Epiri Diplomatik
Message-ID: <c8f.2c7c022.32889d1e@aol.com>

In a message dated 11/12/2006 8:26:05 A.M. Central Standard Time,  
pishaku at yahoo.com writes:

N?  rast se shtet?sia lidhet me nj? q?ndrim t? hersh?m n? Greqi, dhe n? rast 
se  shtet?sia ?sht? konceptuar si Kali i Troj?s (zakon historik) kam 
p?rshtypjen  se dera e barkut nuk do t? hapet n? ?astin e duhur. Po sikur minoritar?t 
t?  mbeten n? Greqi e atje t? asimilohen krejt?sisht? A do t? jen? p?rs?ri mjet 
 trysnie p?r Shqip?rin?? Cili ?sht? avantazhi afatgjat? politik i Greqis??  
Llogarit? jan? b?r? mir? apo pa  hanxhin??
 
Pishaku
Perdorimi i metafores se Kalit te Trojes me duket  pa vend.Troja ishte nje 
qytet i forte e i lulezuar , me mure te larta e porta te  renda.Shqiperia nga 
ana tjeter eshte nje han pa dyer e dritare , nje rremulle ku  s'e merr vesh i 
pari te dytin.Nese grekeve u hyn ne pune nuk u duhet ndonje  dredhi e 
sterholluar per ta marre e te hartojne plane afatmesme e  afatgjata.Dhenia e pasaportave 
minoritareve nuk eshte gje tjeter vecse kujdes qe  tregojne ata per bash
kekombasit e tyre.Te njejten gje qe do te benim ne me  kosovaret nese do te ishim 
shtet i pasur e i fuqishem.Shqetesimi se do te  krijohet nje shtrese qytetaresh 
te privilegjuar eshte i kote.Nje pjese e  anetareve te albklubit jane 
qytetare amerikane.Nese shkojne ne Shqiperi nuk kane  asnje lloj avantazhi pervec 
mundesise per te hyre e dale lirisht.


 
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From cun-tirone at hotmail.com  Sun Nov 12 15:23:46 2006
From: cun-tirone at hotmail.com (Cun Tirone)
Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2006 15:23:46 -0500
Subject: [AlbClub] Vorio-Epiri Diplomatik
In-Reply-To: <c8f.2c7c022.32889d1e@aol.com>
Message-ID: <BAY106-F252BD4D0C52C459237076091F50@phx.gbl>

Ashtu eshte kjo nuk eshte fare dredhi e sterholluar, por eshte qepur
jo me pe, por me litar te bardhe. Dhe eshte cudi e madhe se si mund
te justifikohet, apo t'i behesh avokat.



Eshte gjithashtu e qarte se greket po kujdesen per bashkombesit e
tyre te vjeter e te rinj, dhe shume mire bejne. Jane per tu hequr
kapellen. Cudi e madhe, nga ana tjeter, edhe ne Evrop dhe
nacionaliste. Sikur ky i fundit i perkiste librave te historise,
bashke me kalin e Trojes.



Le ta provoje shteti i ashtuquajtur shqiptar tu jape shqiptareve te
Kosoves nenshtetesi shqiptare. Resultati i menjehershem do te ishte
qe Kosova do te perfundonte nenbashki e Boegradit.



Eshte e njohur teza greke, se duan per minoritetin jo me pak se
cfare do t'i jepet Kosoves. Levizja e fundit greke eshte ne
perputhje me kete qellim.



Nuk do te kishte problem nese nenshttesine do ta merrnin vertete
vetem ninoritaret. Por te shtyre nga fukaralleku, eshte e qarte qe
shifra do te kete nje apo disa zero shtese. A nuk kane qene dhe
vleresimet shqiptare e greke mbi numrin e minoritareve me nje apo
disa zero diference? Cfare koincidence! - tha. Mesa duket Orakulli i
Delfit nuk i paska humbur aftesite.




Cdo do te ndodhe kur gjysma e me shume e ish-shqiptareve te quhen
greke? Pse jane dakord dhe serbet qe Kosoves t'i jepet autonomi
shume e zgjeruar, dhe nderkombetaret po behen gati t'i japin
pavarsine? Stermbullari eshte perqindja e popullsise. Pra eshte e
qarte se ku po shkohet. Kush do te mbylle syte, le ta beje, pa qene
nevoja te beje te tjeret qorra a dicka tjeter.



Greket mund te bejne cfare t'i do qejfi, dhe ne vec mund te grijme
sallate per kete gje. Ceshtja eshte se c'duhet te bejne shqiptaret.
E vetmja levizje do te ishte heqja e dyshtetesise. Pastaj do te
shihnim sa kollaj do ta leshonin shtetesine sternipat e Odiseut.



Mirpo duket se burat skipetare jane te kapur nga allatet... e s'po
bezajne. Ku eshte ai fjalim-ngjiruri i rrepte qe u prish me
ameriken, dhe i beri m... kolltukut, se po i kerkonte Sazanin? Ku
jane deputecet aq te vendosur, sa qe mbathin dy kepuce te djathta?
Po shpataret e rrepte mediatike, qe s'lene shtatezani a kapsllek pa
anallizuar, kane rene squke, bashke me trimat parlamentare qe
thyejne vazo e tavolina per ideal. Dikush ka "kredi" magjike nga
bankat greke ne Tirane, dikush tjeter ka shitur viza, sa la pa pune
dhe skafistet, te gjithe jane te pergjuar ne celularet e grekut ...
Bile dhe ai trimi i dheut, qe kishte marre llastiqet qe 13 vjec
kunder dushmanit, e qe beri namin kur i cenuan nipat fluturues
bashke me kushtetuten, ... mos i eshte kthyer prap tavlles? Po ai
Aksioni Civil mor aman? Cfare thote? Apo keto jane ceshtje
ushtarake, jashte kompetences se tyre?

Nuk flasim dot - thane. E kemi gojen plot.



?un Tirone


PS.
Ju lutem mos ofendoni inteligjencen e klubsave. Ngjashmeria
midis nenshtetesise greke dhe asaj amerikane apo nigeriane eshte aq
evidente dhe s'ka nevoje te thuhet hapur. Njeri do Epirin, tjatri eshte
ne sevda me Sazanin.

_________________________________________________________________
Get today's hot entertainment gossip  
http://movies.msn.com/movies/hotgossip?icid=T002MSN03A07001



From benesl at hotmail.com  Sun Nov 12 21:01:44 2006
From: benesl at hotmail.com (Ben)
Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2006 21:01:44 -0500
Subject: [AlbClub] Vorio-Epiri Diplomatik
Message-ID: <BAY109-W8717C83EE073BD82B0F66DCF40@phx.gbl>

More po sa bukur e lidhe kete punen e minoritetit grek ne Shqiperi me ate te Kosoves?!! Si te kishe mbaruar shkollen e Nikolla Geixhit. Edhe ai ne kete vrime ka vite qe i bije fyellit. Ku e paske gjetur edhe ti, te njejten vrime? Po pse ore, njelloj qenka gjendja e shqiptareve te Kosoves me ata pesembedhjete greqer me moshe mesatare 84 vjec qe kane mbetur sot ne Shqiperi? Kali i Trojes mbetet Kale Troje - ate e kane shpikur greket, ata te lashtit, dhe perpiqen ta vene ne perdorim havdallce edhe keta te sotmit (megjithese nuk kane asnje lidhje me ta). Vendet qe duan te zgjerojne territoret nuk sulmojne vetem vende qe jane me te zhvilluar se ata vete. Perkundrazi, historikisht iu jane versulur me shume vendeve qe i konsiderojne me pak te zhvilluar. Veshtire qe Greqia te kete ndonje plan per t'iu versulur Amerikes, apo Anglise. Jo, ore jo, syrin ata e kane te Shqiperia, ndoshta jo te gjithen, por nga Shkumbini e poshte. Kete thote edhe Nikos Gaxhojani, alias Nick Gage. Te marrin greqerit Voreo Epirin, dhe t'i leme shqiptareve Kosoven. Budalleqe me brire. Por ai i thote diten per diell, ne mes te Amerikes, nga nje universitet ne tjetrin. Edhe do plehera qe bejne politike ne Greqi ia degjojne llafin dhe prandaj i leshojne edhe ato pasaportat. Jo se iu hap barku per "bashkatdhetarit" qe kane ne Shqiperi. Se po t'iu ishte hapur barku, ua kishin dhene qe perpara pesembedhjete vjeteve.  From: Dritan68 at aol.comDate: Sun, 12 Nov 2006 10:51:58 -0500To: alb-club at alb-net.comSubject: Re: [AlbClub] Vorio-Epiri Diplomatik






In a message dated 11/12/2006 8:26:05 A.M. Central Standard Time, 
pishaku at yahoo.com writes:

  N? 
  rast se shtet?sia lidhet me nj? q?ndrim t? hersh?m n? Greqi, dhe n? rast se 
  shtet?sia ?sht? konceptuar si Kali i Troj?s (zakon historik) kam p?rshtypjen 
  se dera e barkut nuk do t? hapet n? ?astin e duhur. Po sikur minoritar?t t? 
  mbeten n? Greqi e atje t? asimilohen krejt?sisht? A do t? jen? p?rs?ri mjet 
  trysnie p?r Shqip?rin?? Cili ?sht? avantazhi afatgjat? politik i Greqis?? 
  Llogarit? jan? b?r? mir? apo pa 
hanxhin??
   Pishaku
Perdorimi i metafores se Kalit te Trojes me duket 
pa vend.Troja ishte nje qytet i forte e i lulezuar , me mure te larta e porta te 
renda.Shqiperia nga ana tjeter eshte nje han pa dyer e dritare , nje rremulle ku 
s'e merr vesh i pari te dytin.Nese grekeve u hyn ne pune nuk u duhet ndonje 
dredhi e sterholluar per ta marre e te hartojne plane afatmesme e 
afatgjata.Dhenia e pasaportave minoritareve nuk eshte gje tjeter vecse kujdes qe 
tregojne ata per bashkekombasit e tyre.Te njejten gje qe do te benim ne me 
kosovaret nese do te ishim shtet i pasur e i fuqishem.Shqetesimi se do te 
krijohet nje shtrese qytetaresh te privilegjuar eshte i kote.Nje pjese e 
anetareve te albklubit jane qytetare amerikane.Nese shkojne ne Shqiperi nuk kane 
asnje lloj avantazhi pervec mundesise per te hyre e dale lirisht.
 

 

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From Dritan68 at aol.com  Sun Nov 12 20:17:27 2006
From: Dritan68 at aol.com (Dritan68 at aol.com)
Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2006 20:17:27 EST
Subject: [AlbClub] Vorio-Epiri Diplomatik
Message-ID: <37c.1d277309.328921a7@aol.com>

In a message dated 11/12/2006 4:11:18 P.M. Central Standard Time,  
cun-tirone at hotmail.com writes:

Cdo do  te ndodhe kur gjysma e me shume e ish-shqiptareve te quhen
greke? Pse jane  dakord dhe serbet qe Kosoves t'i jepet autonomi
shume e zgjeruar, dhe  nderkombetaret po behen gati t'i japin
pavarsine? Stermbullari eshte  perqindja e popullsise. Pra eshte e
qarte se ku po shkohet. Kush do te  mbylle syte, le ta beje, pa qene
nevoja te beje te tjeret qorra a dicka  tjeter.
 

PS.
Ju lutem mos ofendoni inteligjencen e klubsave. Ngjashmeria
midis  nenshtetesise greke dhe asaj amerikane apo nigeriane eshte aq
evidente dhe  s'ka nevoje te thuhet hapur. Njeri do Epirin, tjatri eshte
ne sevda me  Sazanin.
 
Greket nuk qene ne gjendje te mbushnin mendjen e botes ne 1919 mbi  
perqindjen e popullsise ne shqiperine e jugut do ta bejne tani ne epoken e  
televizionit e internetit.Amerikanet shpenzuan miliarda ne luften e kosoves do  tu 
ndruyshohet mendja nga keto manovra.Come on man dhe pretendon se te eshte  fyer 
inteligjenca.
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From JSannar at PILPG.ORG  Sun Nov 12 20:32:49 2006
From: JSannar at PILPG.ORG (John Sannar)
Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2006 20:32:49 -0500
Subject: [AlbClub] Balkan Watch- 13 November 2006
Message-ID: <41f738da0611121732q7a8df5e1x6be9df73dfcad6f8@mail.gmail.com>

* <http://www.publicinternationallaw.org/>*

*Balkan Watch
Monday, November 13, 2006
(Volume 8, Number 22) *

Welcome to Balkan Watch, produced by the Post-Conflict Political Development
Practice of the Public International Law & Policy Group (PILPG).

Attached is the current edition:

Volume 8, Number 22, dated Monday, November 13, 2006.

Balkan Watch is a biweekly publication detailing and analyzing the various
current events and conflicts in the Balkans region. The next issue will be
released Monday, November 27.

Balkan Watch is prepared by the Public International Law & Policy
Group<http://www.publicinternationallaw.org/> ,
in cooperation with the School of International
Service<http://www.american.edu/sis/>
  at American University <http://www.american.edu/>, and is made possible by
grants from the Carnegie Corporation of New York <http://www.carnegie.org/> and
the Ploughshares Fund <http://www.ploughshares.org/>.

To view our archived issues, visit
http://www.pilpg.org/areas/poldev/balkanwatch/
<http://www.pilpg.org/areas/poldev/balkanwatch/>

*Current Table of Contents*: (Volume 8, Number 22)

**

**

**

**

**

**

**
**
**
**
*UN Delays Kosovo Final Status Decision*

*EU Planning Post-Final Status "Advisory" Mission in Kosovo*
**
*Serbian Elections in January*
**
*Rehn Urges Serbian Cooperation*
**
*Bosnian Presidents Sworn in*
**
*Hoon Visits Balkans*
**
*Ceku Visits Montenegro*

*Quotable Quotes *

If you have any questions, comments, or suggestions, or to
unsubscribe, e-mail us at jsannar at pilpg.org.
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From Dritan68 at aol.com  Sun Nov 12 22:29:45 2006
From: Dritan68 at aol.com (Dritan68 at aol.com)
Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2006 22:29:45 EST
Subject: [AlbClub] Vorio-Epiri Diplomatik
Message-ID: <c0d.97f244b.328940a9@aol.com>

 
In a message dated 11/12/2006 8:22:38 P.M. Central Standard Time,  
benesl at hotmail.com writes:

Vendet  qe duan te zgjerojne territoret nuk sulmojne vetem vende qe jane me 
te  zhvilluar se ata vete. Perkundrazi, historikisht iu jane versulur me shume  
vendeve qe i konsiderojne me pak te zhvilluar. Veshtire qe Greqia te kete  
ndonje plan per t'iu versulur Amerikes, apo Anglise. Jo, ore jo, syrin ata e  
kane te Shqiperia


Ashtu eshte mor xhan .shqiperine qe thua ti grekerit e kane me sevda te  
madhe.Vdesin per ato malet tona ku pula ha strall e s'ka asnje lloj  pasurire 
natyrore.
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From Era18 at aol.com  Sun Nov 12 22:54:35 2006
From: Era18 at aol.com (Era18 at aol.com)
Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2006 22:54:35 EST
Subject: [AlbClub] Hashim Thaci at CU
Message-ID: <111.6684d023.3289467b@aol.com>


Kosova Independence and its Reflections  on Developments in the Balkans
Hashim Thaci  (President, Democratic Party of Kosova)

Tuesday, 14 November 2006,  12:00pm-1:30pm

Columbia University
1501 International Affairs Building




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